organic synthetic psychedelic

[phenethylamine]

I was wondering what other people thought of organic chemicals vs synthetic chemicals. Not just in what you prefer, but their spiritual qualities. I believe whichever works for you is just fine, but I know a lot of people that would argue that organic chemicals are the only psychedelics that truly contain any form of spiritual enhancement qualities, and that synthetics couldn't possibly ever be considered sacramental.

[GDxCAT]

i try not to make any destinctions.



I believe they are both great and offer lots of insight and spirituality.



I hold substances like mescaline, mushrooms and dmt in very high regard
but LSD is by far my favorite psychedelic and has provided me with more
than any other that i have tried (17 in total). My 2nd favorite also
happens to be synthetic (4 ho mipt).



So basically i think those that hold natural psychs in higher regard
wont really get much from synthetics because they have convinced
themselves that synthetics arent valuable but IMO that is being close
minded.

[Alfa]

Where do you place the distinction between organic and synthetic?

[GDxCAT]

i think synthetic would be things like RC's, ecstasy and LSD while organic would be natural (found in nature) psychedelics.

[pokeymcsmot420]

honestly i prefer synthetic, just more potent in smaller doses. tends to be cheaper and more powerful.


however i do not completely trust the safety of synthetic psychedelics like i do organic. probably no good reason for this, just the way i am.

[Solidly-here]

I like Synthetic ... I like Organic


I do not care where a particular psychedelic comes from (a laboratory, a hemp field, a cow-pie). I do not need to know the Chemical formula for it either.


I do like to know if a particular drug has been used for centuries (Peyote and Pot). It feels good to know that I am following in a rich history of religious usage.


Even Mescaline is synthetic (in a sense). Peyote buttons are ground up, and a chemist adds chemicals, out comes the Mescaline.


The proof is in the pudding. Whatever works, is great for me. When I want to drink milk, I don't care if it has been artificially fortified with extra calcium, has been pre-cooked to kill bacteria, skimmed from most of its cream ... or even if the cows have been shot-up with hormones to produce more milk. I smile about all of the preparations, then I happily drink it.


On the other hand, if someone wants to give me Marinol (synthetic THC-Delta-9), I would probably decline. I enjoy the Real Thing (which has Delta-9, other Deltas, and many other happy-making chemicals in it).


I keep my eyes on the prize: Spiritual growth. Whatever it takes for me to move further toward learning about life (and my place within it), I am prepared to do. I certainly like to have a lot of fun along the way. In fact, for me, having fun IS spiritual growth.


Spirituality is neither synthetic nor organic ... it just is. Drugs (and where they come from) simply are. If I started feeling elitist about where a drug came from, it would deprive me of some of my fun.

[Alfa]

Are standarized extracts or extracts spiked with alkaloids organic in your view?

[uqlfy]

Synthesis= the combining of seperate elements to form a coherent whole. American Heritage Dictionary

By this definition Yage would be synthetic. It is two seperate
elements combined which makk a coherent whole. Peyote chewing would not
be synthetic as it is only one element.That to me is a narrow way of
defining things.



If it needs to be made in lab enviroment by a chemist and it is not "naturally occurring" like DMT its synthetic.

If it is found in nature already but requires some preparation than it can still be organic.

If its is naturally occuring but is produced in lab as opposed to
extracted it is still an organic chemical, it just wasnt produced
organicly.



So yes extracts are organic so long as they dont contain other substances that are not naturally occuring.



Im not picky about whether a drug is synt or organic. I think the
experiences had are more important. However I have had more spiritual
experiences with organics. Some of the RC's are more like nice toys to
me to play with than actual tools for growth.

Edited by: uqlfy

[Dimitri]

If I use GDxCATs
Definition of synthetic and organic I would prefer the more "natural"
substances, meaning those that occure somewhere in nature, which are
e.g. psilocybin, psilocin, DMT, 5Meo-DMT, mescaline...

Problem is, that some of my favourites are synthetics, which is Acid
and maybe in future 4-ho-mipt or 2cb (didn't try yet). From the
substances I tried already - some synthetics - some occuring in nature
- I have the feeling that the natural ones FIT better. Yes, the word
"fitting" is the best to descibe, what the natural ones can do. I can't
really prove it or say exactly what it is, thatswhy I used the term
"feel". But the synthetics "feel" synthetic, they feel like something,
my brain doesn't know is getting into my system and my body is trying
to break it down.



I would like to know, whether I have this "fits perfectly" feeling in a
double blind test. I would hope yes, since this feeling developed over
time of the use both categories.

</span>

[GDxCAT]

i find acid and miprocin to feel just as natural as psilocin or mescaline.

[Solidly-here]

Synthetic ... Organic... Pretty different meanings.


First, in response to uqlfy about Natural products.


Today, in this world, its really hard to get anything actually Natural. TV Dinners are synthesized from meat, vegetables, mashed potatoes, and gravy. And the gravy is synthesized from several ingredients. ...


So, in the psychedelic world, the only Natural fuels are Marijuana, some Hashish, Magic Mushrooms and Peyote (along with some DMT snuffs, and other esoteric plants). Then (I guess) we could further sub-divide those Natural fuels by whether or not they were Organically grown. Whew! OK, that's about it for Natural.


Extracts, Standardized Extracts, Spiked Extracts: Organic or Not.


In my view, Alfa, when something Organic is extracted from something Organic, the resulting extract is Organic too. After all, if the pure result of the extraction IS an Organic substance, then I am less concerned with the chemical nature of the spiking agent (or the medium in which it is suspended, or dissolved, or mixed).


In Chemistry, a particular chemical is Organic, IF it has carbon atoms in it (so, gasoline is Organic, and all formerly living things). Iwill follow this definition (although it isn'timportant to this discussion).


I would call a Standardized Extract (whether or not it is suspended in alcohol, an Organic liquid) an Organic mixture. If any organic solvent is used to suspend it, then ALL of the mixture is Organic; I also call this an Organic mixture.


I would also call ANYextract, to whicha non-organic chemical Spike has been added (to Strengthen its effect, to Change the effect, oreven to Add another effect) an Organic mixture. I say this because at least part of this mixture IS Organic, and therefore, the mixture (at least until it is split back apart into its individual components) is Organic.


Let me use an illustrative example of purely Organic mixtures: Tincture of Cannabis (called Hash Oil). To make some of this Organic extract, I start with a healthy amount of Marijuana flowers (because its flowers have the most concentrated amount of THCs in them).


First, what type of tincture agent should be used? Well, not water: THC is NOT water-based, so trying to use water would not work. Oil will work, alcohol will work.


Second, Most tinctures are alcohol-based. So, for this tincture, I soak themarijuana flowers in ethanol (or Everclear alcohol, or Brandy, like in the Buyers Clubs). The ethanol absorbs the THC-resins. I strain the mixture to remove the flowers. Last, I pour it into an eye-dropper bottle; Poof! I have Tincture of Cannabis; this is the new Prescription Drug in Canada. We have 1000s of friends in Canada, medicating themselves (under the tongue) with a HOT strain of government-approved Cannabis... Congratulations, you Lucky guys.


To repeat the experiment, but with a different solvent. I soak the flowers in a solvent in this second batchwith Butter. I melt the butter, I pour some water on top of it. I pour in the flowers. Stir. During the next few minutes, most of the resins in the flowers have migrated to the Butter. Thank you. Then, I just toss-out the water (which contains the flowers, minus their resins).


In this case, there is THC which is now part of the Butter. This Butter is Organic, and the THC-resins are Organic; therefore, this is an Organic mixture.


Now, if I wanted to squirt-in some RCs to another fuel, an Organic one, then I would have another Organic mixture (and a lot of fun tripping with it).


I allow each session to mean just as much as it wants. WhenI ingest a psychedelic fuel, the Sky's the Limit. I accept each change in perspective. I live it. If it's good, I live some more. When the best is over, I Let Go. Off to the next Stop of the journey. Welcome, next Stop.

[jaguarangel]

Organic plants can kill you. Synthetic
chemicals were made by organic people. It depends how you view all of it.Edited by: jaguarangel

[drwoo]

Synthetic Chemicals are made with organic chemistry!


Either one works for me. If I had my choice to always do my favorite it would be shroom + mdma at the same time so I would be doing both.

[MescalinePirate]

Either one here aswell.



What I don't understand is how people believe man-made things to be
unnatural, we are animals, and therefore a valuable part of nature,
afterall.

[sloppo]

There has been an ongoingdebate about synthetic vs. natural. I find a lot of people have a stigma against chemicals. In my view, I do not see a differenence if a compound was made in a plant or in a laboratory. Some really good ones don't happen to be made by nature but were made by man. The effects these compounds have on the mind are unrelated to whether these compounds are found in nature or not. That is just SWIM's opinion.





Sloppo

[Hyperreal]

There is no inherent difference between a molecule that occurs in nature and a molecule that does not.The phenethylamines that occur in cacti are not of chemically different to those that do not; it's just a matter of chance whether or not the particular molecule cropped up in the plant world. Nor do I agree with people who say that natural compounds 'feel' any different from synthetic ones.


Having said that, I'd choose a refined chemical over plant material, because it is purer. When you smoke marijuana, you are inhaling not only THC, but one or two hundred other chemicals, of dubious safety. Eating a cactus is quite a chore, but by swallowing a little pill of mescaline, you get all the best effects without any of the hassle.