Best drug for depression?

[addict]

Hey swim is a severely depressed 19yo. After prostituting swimself about 9 months ago, swim has not been the same. Swim did not do it for heroine or crack, swim did it for weed...Swim is veryvery anti-social, and although can come to terms with swimself that swim is probably bisexual or something, simply can not communicate with women. So blahblahblah swim is a depressed fuck.

Swim is wondering what the best anti-depressant is. I'm not talking about drugs like effexor, cymbalta, lexapro---those are bullshit, I don't feel anything from them. Other drugs like alprazolam (xanex(sp?)) , subutex or suboxone, and painkillers in general make him feel great though. Swim has looked into taking codeine, but can't find any non-prescription meds with it in it.

He's not looking to be high off his ass, stupid and unmotivated, he goes to school in which he very much wants to succeed in. He's not looking to turn his life around either, become the life of the party or a social butterfly, he just wants to be comfortable and content with himself and his lifestyle.

PS don't suggest marijuana, though he used to smoke in relatively large quantities, now it makes him paranoid, unmotivated, and effectively rendering him more depressed.

Any suggestions? Illegitimate treatments or prescription? I think swim'd cum his pants if he could get a bottle of xannies legally for depression. REALLY hope to hear some suggestions....THanks

[dyingtomorrow]

There seems to be a percentage of the population that doesn't respond to any kind of antidepressant, OTC med, or any creative use of other RXes like amphetamines (all of which SWIM was prescribed at one point). Sadly, some people seem to only respond to opiates; or if there is something else SWIM doesn't know. It is difficult for SWIM to recommend them to anyone else, particularly someone just starting their 20s. The thing is, at this point SWIY might have other options or ways to get out of their depression. Someone starting out severely depressed, who then gets addicted to opiates and uses them as an antidepressant - well, if something fucks up, particularly money, and they can't get them anymore, they are going to be the most miserable shell of a human you can imagine. It's a tough tradeoff. SWIM only got on heroin when he was 100% ready to kill himself, and if he would have been smarter with his money then he would have made the jump to lawyer and could have afforded to self medicate with heroin the rest of his life. Unfortunately there tends to be a binging phase with opiates, which combined with legality and financial issues, destroys a lot of people before they learn to use the opiate properly for depression or just regular use in general.

It really is playing with fire, and SWIM would not recommend using opiates at least until SWIY is certain they can't go on anymore. Benzos are a whole other can of worms, and are almost equally dangerous, but SWIM doesn't have the expertise of long term use to really speak for them.

Reputation Comments on this post:

	Good warning
	Well put, this is exactly the sort of post needed by the OP. Keep it up.
	Good to tell OP how it really is.

[cra$h]

well, opiates are obviously the best choice. But swiy's playing with fire with that one. He is with all others, but opiates are a whole 'nother game (in swim's opinion).

in the simplest terms, drugs are not the way to go. It might sound cleche, but the effects of a drug are only temporary, and bring you to a deeper low once you're all out. Swim's there now, it sucks. meditation has helped with some brutal depression, and surprisingly enough, natural sleep deprivation. After the third or fourth day you crash like a mother fucker, but the days before elevated swim's happy levels.

good news though, there are alternitives!
Amphetamines bring out the social butterfly in people, and you just kinda cruise through the day and not really acknolage that your doing bullshit work (great for school)
psychedelics has taught swim to love himself, and the natural world, but inspired a hatred to all that is artificial
alcohol is good for those really bad days. but save it for the really bad days and make sure you're with someone, or you might kill yourself.
Oh yea, forgot possibly the most obvious one of them all! ecstacy is known for making people feel good. swim doesn't have any experience with it, but everyone swim knows that's done it love it

Reputation Comments on this post:

Excellent info, good warning about the downside of drugs.

[chazsaysrelax]

Originally Posted by cra$h

in the simplest terms, drugs are not the way to go. It might sound cleche, but the effects of a drug are only temporary, and bring you to a deeper low once you're all out.

SWIM agrees with this whole heartedly. In SWIM's opinion, drugs are NOT the answer to depression, nor the key to happiness. Don't get him wrong, SWIM knows that there are lots of people with chemical imbalances and the like, and they CAN be helped with antidepressants/antianxiety meds.

SWIM has battled with anxiety and depression for years (and still does) and if he 's learned anything, it's that drugs are only a temporary solution. Sure, some of them may make you FEEL happy, but they ultimately wont make you genuinely happy.

That being said, there are a few drugs that can help SWIY through tough times, and even provide the right framework for a personal breakthrough. Here's SWIM's input regarding common substances:

amphetamines: good when you need to be motivated and get things done. VERY dangerous, and should only be used for specific purposes. Regular use of these is VERY tempting, but it's a dead end street (SWIM is there now)

opiates: good for when you REALLY need to relax. same warnings as above.

benzos: good for anxiety and sleep. these aren't as tempting for SWIM, but could be for SWIY. proceed with caution.

cocaine: SWIM tried this, it doesn't work. Good for a temporary confidence boost, ABSOLUTELY USELESS if taken regularly (more than 2x/week)

The common theme with all of these is that regular use is definitely not the answer. SWIM has also tried changing things up (i.e: amphetamines one day, opiates another, etc) but it only led him to constantly finding new ways to feel good, the realization of which was FAR more depressing than being addicted to any one drug.

SWIM's ultimate piece of advice for SWIY (and anyone else in his position) is that happiness is something that comes from within. Meditation is very good, and SWIM highly recommends Yoga. Yoga is kind of like a natural "drug" for SWIM. It forces him to meditate, it physically and mentally awakens him, it improves blood circulation and promotes physical and mental health.

Simply put: be healthy, save the drugs for extreme circumstances/special occasions

[HalfDutch]

I would agree with what most people here have said. What i would call "recreational" drugs are not ideal as a long term solution. I myself suffer from depression. I have very extreme highs and lows in my general life, the trick is learning how to get through them. SWIM occasionally does things like MDMA recreationally/socially, but balancing them around life is one of those things to figure out. By no means would SWIM use something like MDMA in order to cope with everyday life. Not doable!

Ive been prescribed Citalopram before. My experiences with it were somewhat dissapointing. In a sense i began to feel better, and have less bad days. But i couldnt shake off the feeling of being chemically altered, and not "feeling myself". I'd sometimes feel like some sanitised version of myself. Im probably not describing it very well. The other problem i had with Citalopram was it causing me horrific insomnia. Now in general i am more of a night person anyway, but it caused to be awake until say 8 or 9am, at which point id suffer the odd narcoleptic style blackout for a few mins for the rest of the day. A few weeks of going through that was enough, and i cut myself loose.

So yeah, the best advice i can probably offer for dealing with depression is learn ways to get through downswings. Sometimes i find the best ways of coping is really simple, silly stuff. Like, im a big music fan, and sometimes ive pulled myself out of one of my little downward spirals by just slapping the headphones on nice and loud and listening to whatever tunes are doing it for me at the moment.

Find things that you enjoy or something that makes you feel good, and use it to combat the lows. Also, try the Samaritans helpline if you havent already. Theyve talked me down from the ledge before (literatally as well as figuratively) and i cant reccomend them enough.

[AceOvArts]

HalfDutch, In my experience finding an ani-depressant that doesnt make you feel chemically altred is the trick. You must work with your GP to fing it. They do like to prescribe the latest thing theare told to prescribe though. Personally I have been through a number of different meds for depression, Citalopram worked for me and I have been free of SSRIs for a few years now (though it takes a long time to taper off of them). You do need to explain your feelings to the doc and tell them you need something different, else they will ju mess about with dose.
What I did notice though was that antidepressants stunted my creativity, unfortunately for me, being creative is my job and I had a tough time dealingwith that aspect though the alternative (severe lows, thoughts of suicide etc.) was much worse.
Gooluck

[3333]

Swim is also a "depressed fuck", and deals with it in a number of ways. At the moment swim is using both therapy and drugs. Therapy (CBT, but swims favourite is MBCT, google it) is incredibly important if swiy wants to become depression free.

However, Swim has of course realised that depression is long and very painful, thus, in the short term, swim uses some drugs to help him through. Swim has done fluoxetine and setraline (SSRIs) and they have helped him a lot but recommends that if these don't work on others they should either increase the dose or give a good try to a few more antidepressants (SSRIs/SSNIs/Tricyclics/MAOIs).

Now for the bit swiy is probably interested.
Kava - Very good mildly euphoric, safe (well worth a go for depression especially with anxiety)
Codeine - Swim feels good, but large addiction potencial
Coca Leaves - Swim loves this, he thinks it is very very good for depression
Nitrous Oxide - laughing gas, you do the math (although the high is only seconds long)
Modalert - Pharm that gives mild euphoric and mental wakefulness
Kratom - Natural (usually legal) opiate like plant powder - can be addictive but much nicer that strong opiates

Opiates and benzos may be effective, but swim thinks that they are not worth it for depression (except codeine only to be used rarely).

Reputation Comments on this post:

	Thanks for the MBCT info, never heard of it before
	Good to offer alternative options.

[Venusia]

Swivy likes her Adderall (Dextroampthetamine Salts/Amphetamine Salts) for her treatment-resistant depression. She is on Celexa (citalopram) and Abilify (aripiprazole) and those alone did not work totally well. She started the Adderall, and her depression nearly completely lifted! Opiates help sometimes too, but they can sometimes cause a dysphoria, and that can make her depression a little worse.

ETA: A psychologist (or any type of "talk doc") could be beneficial too, but that is one of those things SWIY would have to be comfortable with to get anything out of it.

[Routemaster Flash]

MDMA is a good bet for a genuine, life-changing experience (or several, I should say) that could help you come to terms with your problems, improve your confidence and self-esteem and maybe even kick your weed habit.

But really, it's not a great idea to look to chemicals to sort your problems out; you could well find it just becomes another problem to add to your list down the line. Even psychedelics can help in this way, but they are very much a double-edged sword and it'd be very sensible to acclimatise yourself to a drug which is somewhat psychedelic but also euphoric and 'easy' on the psyche, i.e. MDMA (or something close to it, if you can't get real MDMA, like methylone).

It's like what Alan Watts said about psychedelic drugs and enlightenment: "Once you've got the message, you hang up the receiver"; in your case substitute 'improved self-esteem and day-to-day mood' for 'enlightenment'.

Of course, MDMA is immensely recreational in its own right too, so once you're feeling a bit better about yourself you might want to carry on using it and other drugs you like, but in a responsible and sustainable way.

Don't just go popping pills and expect that to sort you out, though - just as important is the right person or people to do it with. Best of luck, and I hope you find a way out of your rut.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Honest, informative post, supportive of OP, good advice too.

[Lady Codone]

Depends on the type of depression you have. There's the kind where you're anxious, can't sleep, and lose your appetite, and the kind where you sleep TOO much, overeat, and have no enthusiasm/ambition ("atypical depression" though it's the most common). And of course, complex combinations of the two.

For the first kind, an opiate/benzo type drug would be best to quell the anxiety, insomnia and help mellow you out. Amphetamines are probably better for the second type of depression to boost energy, ambition, and confidence while discouraging overeating and sleeping.

[Snowman]

Drugs help if you find good ones and don't abuse them but what helps much more than drugs is sport and reading books, I've learned a lot from a book from Stefan Klein.

[sandoz1943]

SWIM was seriously depressed for several years and thought about ending it all on a daily baisis. A year ago Christmas she had black period she didnt eat, go outside, wash, speak to anyone, and spent a couple of weeks in her PJ's often going on 20 hour sleeping jags. Two weeks in she recieved a gram of 2CI. 2CI fixed her mind and her soul. It is not mentaly taxing like LSD, not as intense Ephoria as MDMA but is very "light" and gave her a great feeling of joy. The hangover is minimal and the high last about 4-6 hours so she finds she can function the next day even going to work. SWIM took the 2CI for several days and about 3-4 days in she broke down and cried like she has never cried before and then it happened like someone flicked a switch. Her friends and family cant believe the change and are very happy to have the old SWIM back. She had been so depressed for so long and never realized how bad it had gotten until then. It has been about a year and a half and SWIM is her old happy self again and has rediscovered her love for life and that the world is truely beautiful.

Reputation Comments on this post:

	A kind post that is inspiring to ppl suffering depression. Very cool story. Glad you got better.
	interesting story and recommendation - something to look in to

[samspad]

You might try modafinil. It's used to boost the anti-depressant effect of ssri's.

[Venusia]

Originally Posted by samspad

You might try modafinil. It's used to boost the anti-depressant effect of ssri's.

Swiv will vouch for this too. It did help mildly with Swiv's depression (Adderall works best for her though). It helped Swiv get up in the morning and face the day with more enthusiasm and a better attitude. Swiv can be pretty anti-social, esp when her depression is at its worst, but the stimulants do keep her from falling so far down in the depression hole and let her get out with more ease when she starts down the spiral. Now Swiv has her down days like anyone else, but she no longer thinks that suicide is the only way to stop her internal suffering and hopelessness. Swiv would most definitely say she agrees that modafinil (Provigil in the US) can help tons if lack of motivation and "black depressions" with suicidal ideations are Swiy's issue.

[addict]

2CI? Is that some kind of hallucinigen? Tell me more!

[Routemaster Flash]

Originally Posted by addict

2CI? Is that some kind of hallucinigen? Tell me more!

Plenty of information to be found in Research Chemicals -> Phenethylamines. Or try erowid. Or, as they say, UTFSE!

Edit: Sandoz, thanks for sharing that beautiful story, really glad things worked out for you.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Thanks for keeping the newbies informed on where and how to find certain info. It's much appreciated.

[AceOvArts]

Sandoz, SWIM thinks what you achieved is great, SWIM thinks this is what a lot of theropies try to achieve one way or another which is sort of helping the mind to breakdown almost or rather release maybe a better word and reset itself.
Its so very hard to notice a build up of stress untill you are at breaking point and this can go eitherway and end up full on depression, or of course any other bad route. But if one can find a way of release on a regular basis Im sure this helps the mind stay fairly level.

SWIM is the worlds worst though, he dont practice what he preaches, gets depressed, stressed looks for a magical pill knowing full well that excersize and a good diet is what he really needs, right now writing this SWIMs head is messed up and he is wondering what magical potion will help.

But back to the OP, SWIM would very carefully cosider SWIYs next move before jumping headlong into any number of mind altering events. Hullucogenic ethenogens are a well known release for this, things like Ayahuasca used for many years by south American tribes to keep the mind and body on the level. SWIM has the ingredients but is too scared to try yet. Though this is a remedy that needs the help of someone experienced in such things.
SWIM did personally use an SSRI that worked for him but it took 5 years for him to be completely SSRI free and is not suggesting that to SWIY.

Sounds like SWIY could do with maybe a little councelling ? SWIM dunno if SWIY is up for that kinda thing though. SWIM found it some help to physically speak to someone, you know really let it ALL out, and I mean ALL of it. it wont reset you though. SWIMs not sure that after the experience SWIY had ones mind can be reset but one can most certainly come to terms with it and move on way past it positively.

SWIM never thought of writing all the bad shit down, all the bad things He felt, the things he did that he hated, hated about himself, the hurt people had done to him or even he had done to others basically all the bad feelings on a piece of paper and burning it, could help, but it has for some.
SWIM is just riffing on it here and dont know anything about SWIY really, but never discount something SWIY might think is rediculous I think is what SWIM is saying.

Believe it or not theres a lot of people just like SWIY right here so just keep talking and hopefully we can ALL get through it

Good vibes to ya

[Uncle Getafix]

SWIM has just come out of a 10 year period of clinical depression, which is a long time so believe me SWIM hears you!!

SWIM would try a mild dose of modafinil to get you up and moving at school, and enable SWIY to exercise a bit.

Its taken SWIM 10 years to come off the benzos, so SWIM wouldn't reccommend starting them if at all possible.

Talking therapy man, find a good therapist that understands SWIY and has empathy and work out your goals and a plan back to reality.

Sometimes it just pays to have someone to talk to, that is neutral and not involved with your situation.

SWIM thinks the nastiest part of depression is feeling there is no end in sight to the illness. Well, if you set your goals you will slowly and painfully start to feel better.

It only took SWIM ten years because SWIM was self medicating like hell with speed, 6mg of lorazepam a night, lithium, risperidal and paroxetine!!

All scripted except for the speed!! It made things a lot harder for SWIM because you get dependence and addiction along with a severe clinical depression and anxiety.

I definitely think finding a good therapist or even counsellor is an asset.

SWIM got out man, you can too. Go for drugs and therapy, if SWIY chooses to medicate. And good luck!!

Reputation Comments on this post:

good post man, youve obviously been there

[AceOvArts]

Uncle, out of interest, do SWIY worry about the future ? SWIM hate to admit he does sometimes, hates to think he could get dragged back to that place again. For SWIM it started when he was 12 very slowly worked its way up till he was mid 30s when really he was not himself. Only now after 2 years free of medication does SWIM thinks he has a handle on it.

Uncle speaks wise words...listen up

[Lorazepam]

escitalopram is a good drug for depression.
unfortunately you have to wait a couple of weeks until the positive effects kick in.
for the first two weeks as with the rest of ssris you may experience anxiety and panic attacks and a few other side effects

[Uncle Getafix]

Hey Ace, yep SWIM is in my his 30s and got blindsided by depression a bit, used to be a dance party kid and didn't see it coming.

As far as worrying about the future, SWIM does a bit but find that if you set a plan that SWIY is in control of and if SWIY is aware of the stress triggers that set off the initial depression, you definitely feel a lot better and in control of the situation.

Once SWIY feels that they have control of the situation, rather than a doc or meds being control, SWIM found a sense of self empowerment more valuable than any medication.

However, most useful to SWIM was a neutral therapist to set a plan with, and minimising meds so the side effects of benzo/SSRI withdrawal etc doesn't send SWIM back into anxiety/depression.

SWIM has a friend who took citalopram as an anti depressant and it seems to work for them. SWIM was scripted paroxetine, lithium, risperidal and lorazepam and it didn't do SWIM any favours at all.

SWIM personally beleives that if SWIY goes for medication, to have a therapist involved as well, and setting a plan for the future. Its good to have a neutral person as a sounding board, and a feeling of control of SWIYs own life and a plan for going forward to combat the common feeling of helplessness in depression.

Most importantly, SWIY should not feel alone. Many people go through this stage and come out to lead fulfilling lives. So don't feel alone by any means, SWIM wishes you all the best!!

[xxdan123xx]

for him aderoll or cocaine help in the short tem. THe comedown can bring depressen times 100 fold however. Zoloft works,

[laing1981]

hi there

swim went through a spat of depression, swim had 4 people die she cared abt in a couple of years. swim has two young kids and had too get a fking grip, swim was on seroxat which is paroxetine and it does work, it just needs a fortnight to kick in! it certainly worked for swim, swim used to smoke dope and thinks this brings on anxiety and depression. swim was only on 20mg which is quite low a day. but a word of advice is that they do need a fortnight to work, bringing the serotonin levels to a balance.

swim would hate to see swiy battle through depression cos it is a shitty bleak period in ones life. swim couldnt even get out of bed.

good luck

laing1981

laing1981 added 0 Minutes and 59 Seconds later...

DO NOT think an opiate of any kind is the answer as this will bring swiy down rock bottom..........seriously

[AceOvArts]

SWIM did Seroxat too, SWIM ended up on Citalopram which saw SWIM through to the end, took SWIM 6 months to taper off though. SWIM tried stopping dead once when he felt he could handle it....NEVER EVER do that SWIM got seriously f*cked up from trying to stop SSRIs without tapering. Long slow taper is the key

[laing1981]

yeah forgot to mention that, that bring swiy back to square one .....if not further down, its slowly weaned down.