Pharmacology - Bzp neurotoxicity

[aaa5]

My Monkey wanted to ask the forum this:

"Anyone has any infos on the neurotoxicity of bzp comparing to amphetamine? There is no info on the internet about it. I was snorting it over 3 days several times. Is it is one of the most sheet I've ever met. I find it quite safe in a mean of heart problems but very destructive to the brain. The tolerance incresed very quickly and I started snort it more and more quite like with amphets. But the comedown and crush was horrible, much worse then after severral months on amphetamine. Even after several weeks I could't get myself up, my memory and logic thinking, learning abilities was crushed as never before."

Reputation Comments on this post:

Read the rules before posting.

[ThuzzY]

BZP is umm yea fairly toxic, especially if you use it regularly. It seems that its not too bad if its used rarely, certainly seems to have less of an effect on the heart as you say. It causes a simultaneous release of dopamine and serotonin, which usually ain't good in terms of toxicity. I'm sure that its toxic to the dopamine system, and probably the serotonin system too for that matter, its does just have a fairly high toxicity all round unfortunately tbh. If used regularly that toxicity would snowball and it would be an extremely bad idea to snort it a lot, certainly a lot worse than amphetamines, although all these powerful stimulants tend to be pretty toxic. I expect you'll recover if you take a nice break from it all, but you really shouldn't use BZP regularly in any kind of habit.

[buzzman]

Originally Posted by ThuzzY

BZP is umm yea fairly toxic, especially if you use it regularly. It seems that its not too bad if its used rarely, certainly seems to have less of an effect on the heart as you say. It causes a simultaneous release of dopamine and serotonin, which usually ain't good in terms of toxicity. I'm sure that its toxic to the dopamine system, and probably the serotonin system too for that matter, its does just have a fairly high toxicity all round unfortunately tbh. If used regularly that toxicity would snowball and it would be an extremely bad idea to snort it a lot,certainly a lot worse than amphetamines, although all these powerful stimulants tend to be pretty toxic. I expect you'll recover if you take a nice break from it all, but you really shouldn't use BZP regularly in any kind of habit.

Please, i would love too see some evidence .

[Gradient]

aaa5,

Attached is a short study discussing the pharmacokinetics of benzylpiperazine (BZP, uploaded to archive), often using amphetamines as a comparison for effects. Here are some particularly relevant statements to your question:
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"Early studies comparing the effects of BZP to dexamphetamine in humans suggest these two drugs have similar effects and other have also suggested that BZP has abuse liability similar to that of the amphetamines."

"If we assume a bioavailability of 12.5% the estimate of clearance is estimated to be 7.28 L/h or 91.03 mL (h kg) (where the average weight of the participants was 80kg), which is approximately a third of the reported clearance of methamphetamine (272 mL/h kg)."
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Another study I glanced over suggests that the roles of metabolic cytochrome enzyme, CYP2D6, has a critical role in the removal of piperazines from the nervous system; genetic polymorphisms in the expression of this liver-enzyme might be anticipated to generate some hazardous dynamics in individuals who transcribe for comparatively low levels of the protein. Also, there appears to be higher activity at serotonergic receptors from piperazines than the amphetamines generally elicit.

Hope this helps!

Reputation Comments on this post:

thanks for the info. great post

[aaa5]

IS that theory support by any scientific reaserches? Swim has been using bzp in a few period of abut free days. The crush was horrible it seemed that bzp causes serius brain damage, especially to dopmanie and serotonine neurons, but to entire brain itself. SWIM was feeling completly helpless , anactive and totaly burned out. The momery was to be wracked. The bzp was self-made, since was legal in that time in swim's country. NEver again!

[aaa5]

Any of SWIYs knows about neurotixicity bzp comparing to meth? SWIM believes bzp chronic exposure is much more devastatting!

[aaa5]

SWIM doesn't about activity but neurotoxixity! He believes it is neurotoxic by itself, not by its action as amphetamines and far far more than amphets ! The comedown is also not worth the high anyway !

[ThuzzY]

Yes lol, it is toxic, very toxic, quite why is not clear, but I am sure there is the possibility for it to damage the brain as a whole, if you really feel like you've done damage, you probably have lol.

People can't keep up a regular intake of BZP without experiencing extremely severe negative effects that cause them to have to stop intake, so we can therefore see that it is obviously in some way extremely toxic.

[BoyInTheCountry]

Hmmmm, SWIM is about to dash out and is already late but cant help to want to put his two cence in on this. SWIM was taking BZP for over 2 months a friend picked up like 32g before it became popular and sold to SWIM very cheap. SWIM then proceeded to take the BZP pretty much daily, often some in the afterntoon inbetween 12 and 2 and then again at night time inbetwen 8 and 11. SWIM is a artist and graphic designer (the drug taking clique) and during the 2 months had lots and lots and lots of work to do and catch up on that was the foremost reason for his BZP intake as he found it boosted his energy/ ability to stay awake and keep working, motivation and creativity massivly, he found himself talking intellectually and everything which he wouldnt normally do. He filled a sketch book that is meant to take 2 weeks to do in literally 2 days and it was without a doubt the highest quality work he has done. On top of this he used it when going to parties. He only had a few bad times with it, he had only 1 or 2 days he can remember when he felt really crappy and just kind of lay and sat around all day eating and one night when he took perhaps a bit too much before going to a party and got very very cold extremities (hands) and had to continually run them under hot water, this sounds very similar to some peoples experiences with Mephedrone. All in all he didnt find it as negative as the above descriptions. SWIM is a very healthy male, in peak physical condition if this perhaps has anything to do with it? SWIM has been off BZP for a month and 2 weeks now and has encounterd no problems. In the last 2 weeks now he has been taking Mephedrone, he finds this drug nearly identical with only a few differences, he is awaiting his next deleivery of BZP of 10g which should be coming in the next 2 weeks from a friend. He found a tolerance to the euphoria which could be overcome in larger doses, no tolerance to energy or music appreciation though. In the month he had off from BZP and before the mephedrone it was a completly clean week, no drugs or even alcohol, actually caffiene and the odd nurofen were the only drugs.

SWIM could write much much more on the subject if people are interested as he was considering writing a full report on all of this and making his own thread. SWIM will do this if people are interested? A report on BZP and a comparison to Mephedrone.


All BZP consumption described is taken in a 2:1 ratio with TFMPP.

SWIM has currently taken a bump of mephdrone and grapefruit juice (dont know if this effects mephdrone ingestion) so this is probably why he is writing lots.

Anyway SWIM now has a 20 minute walk, and am ment to be there now silly friend is always late.


SWIM is not as unintelligent and foolish as he is making himself sound he is well aware of what he is doing, please just say if you want a full report broken down in a easier to read format.

[ThuzzY]

Wow lol, well that is interesting. I must admit, I've only ever heard of people who used it for say a week ending up feeling terrible afterwards.

It seems the vast majority of people don't really tolerate BZP that well, maybe enzyme differences really do have a massive effect on it lol.

It would seem that if you definitely were taking BZP then you certainly tolerate it amazingly well, quite lucky lol. I would say that problems would appear at some time, but lol who knows, I'm surprised you managed to keep it up for all that time. And sure write a report if you like lol, I'd read it :P

[aaa5]

Was that bzp selfmade or market grade? How did it look, smell and taste like? Was that swallowed or snorted? What were the doses about? SWIM believes that bzp caused his brain some noticeable permament damage that can't clear up entirely, but he took it for much less time. The bzp tasted acidly and smelled like old medications or dentist medications, looked white to pale yellow loose powder. It caused a feeling of something like alienation from the world, absent-mindess and difficult in doing anything after some time of taking it. Horrible shit! Swim had had never before such a long and intense hangover.

aaa5 added 8 Minutes and 51 Seconds later...

People can't keep up a regular intake of BZP without experiencing extremely severe negative effects that cause them to have to stop intake,

So why they can keep taking meth or crack?

[Mona Lisa]

But it could be these negative feelings that put most people off from overdoing it too often. Mephedrone on the other hand has a relatively gentle comedown for most people which can contribute to its fiendish nature. It lures people into its addictive trap, whereas BZP is more self-regulating with it's hangovers.

[aaa5]

As I heard meth for example has also severe comedown, but despite of that is often abused.

[nirvanaseedsuck]

Originally Posted by aaa5

As I heard meth for example has also severe comedown, but despite of that is often abused.

its not realy that bad but if it becomes too bad you just can take more meth to ease the comedown

[aaa5]

SWIY simply suggests that meth comedown and hangover is quite less severe than bzp?