Effects - Heroin addicts immune to colds/flu?

[Junkhead23]

It has struck pacman that since he started abusing opiates on a regular basis he hasn't been ill in the slightest be it colds/flu or anything.

An other SWIMMERs experienced this/

[OhCasey]

A lot of fellow lab rats have noticed the same thing where im from. My guess is that even if you do get sick while on opiates the effects of the opiates mask the symptoms. Ive had times where I wasnt using and just a couple mg's of hydrocodone would break a fever when swim developed one and then swim would feel fine right after.

[oxyandme]

If exposed to viri enough, via unclean tools, I would think you could develop an imunity to the viri?

[Junkhead23]

pacman hasn't been injecting the whole time and even if he has always has used clean syringes

[dyingtomorrow]

SWIM never got sick once the almost 4 years he was shooting dope.

At rehab 2 months ago, about 3 weeks of feeling like dying he finally went back to semi normal. Had one day of being almost 100% and was like, "holy shit, yay!" ... then got a severe cold the next day and was sick again for like a week.

It just felt like such ... well, "perfect." ...

[chillinwill]

Back when Red Rock was using, he can't ever remember a time where he got legitimately sick except for when he was going through withdrawal. I think OhCasey nailed it on the head when he said that opiates probably mask the symptoms of the sickness and one doesn't feel anything.

[CrookedEye]

SWIM never got sick on methadone, either, for years straight, and thinks it may have to do with having a higher endorphin level. Seems this may help boost immunities, but he only has experience, nothing scientific to present here..

[Spucky]

Originally Posted by CrookedEye

SWIM never got sick on methadone, either, for years straight, and thinks it may have to do with having a higher endorphin level. Seems this may help boost immunities, but he only has experience, nothing scientific to present here..

There are some study`s, but mostly in German-language!
Most significant is the Study about Methadon and Leukaemie (blood-Cancer)

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/ma...ticlekey=91520

http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/..._10078512.html

Methadon stimulate T-Helper Cells, they are important to fight bad stuff
like flu and also cancer!

Scientists have found that opioid receptors also exist on the surface of some cancer cells for reasons that are not understood. One research group tested the agent in human lung cancer cell lines and found that it can induce cell death.

Hmmm, does it mean that people with a high affinity to Opioids have more cancer-cells than normal people?

Reputation Comments on this post:

Terrific post - entirely relevant and interesting articles!

[Nature Boy]

Originally Posted by Junkhead23

It has struck pacman that since he started abusing opiates on a regular basis he hasn't been ill in the slightest be it colds/flu or anything.

Illness can actually be quite rare. SWIM can't even remember the last time he was genuinely bed-ridden ill. Besides the odd case of the winter sniffles, some people only seldomly get sick. I wouldn't be chalking it down to opiate-induced superpowers just yet.

[OhCasey]

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

Illness can actually be quite rare. SWIM can't even remember the last time he was genuinely bed-ridden ill. Besides the odd case of the winter sniffles, some people only seldomly get sick. I wouldn't be chalking it down to opiate-induced superpowers just yet.

I know for sure that opiates played a major role in swim not getting sick for the 4+ years he was using. Im not just talking about bed-ridden illnesses, im talking about even small common colds. When I think about he wouldnt even get hang overs from drinking if he was currently using opiates.

[Junkhead23]

Well pacman used to get colds fairly often before but then again was abusing ecstasy rather heavily

[CrookedEye]

SWIM never caught a cold in 3 and a half years while on a steady methadone dose, when before his use, he commonly caught colds and sniffles, so definitely could be something with the opioids, His habits were not nearly as healthy as they are without abusing opiates, and he catches colds much easier, now that he is clean and uses much less drugs, in general even. Most of his colds come from smoking herb with others, he believes..

[trannyboy]

SWIM still get sick, SWIM hasn't noticed any difference but then again SWIM is always physically ill so it would be hard to tell the difference.

Spunky I would give you rep for your post but the system won't let me. That is a phenomenal post.

trannyboy

[Spucky]

My Cat guess it is not 100% Right to say: "Heroin makes me immun to cold/ flu",
in reallity this is more a pschological Problem!
Who Hard-Core Consumer of Heroin have enough Time to listen what the body try to tell him.
Also we cant forget that Heroin is a very strong analgesic medicine,
this means we dont feel the suffering of normal colds!

In fact: many (not all) Heroin-User have a tendency to spread their disease
because they have no Time/ Money and also no trust to other People
like Medics because of bad Memorys and Shame!
But also they dont realise that they are Ill!

one question:
do the MMT-Center or Needle-Exchanges in the US., Aus. and GB. have normal (non drug related) Doctors to consult?

[OhCasey]

Originally Posted by Spucky

My Cat guess it is not 100% Right to say: "Heroin makes me immun to cold/ flu",
in reallity this is more a pschological Problem!
Who Hard-Core Consumer of Heroin have enough Time to listen what the body try to tell him.
Also we cant forget that Heroin is a very strong analgesic medicine,
this means we dont feel the suffering of normal colds!

Thats what I meant when I said the opiates mask the symptoms of any cold or general sickness one could get.

[CrookedEye]

The methadone maintenance center that SWIM went to, had nurses to dispense meds, counselors for every day needs, and a doctor who visited a couple days a week.

The needle exchanges SWIM was familiar with were only a small bus/van type vehicle in which someone would sit in them and trade used needles, placed properly in a container for sharps, for fresh ones, give a cooker, bottle of distilled water, some alcohol swabs, a bottle of bleach, sometimes a small paper on safe injections, and a piece of cotton. No real doctor at those.

SWIM didn't notice his immunities until thinking about it after years of being on methadone, and wondering why he never caught a cold in so long when he had been much more prone to them. With heroin use he would often feel sick from withdrawal when his habit got to be too expensive, so he's not sure colds weren't still common during these years.

[Dickon]

Good information Spucky. although the first link contains the following ignorance:

While methadone can become addictive, the habit is much easier to break than being hooked on true opioids, Friesen said.

And how the hell was it being given in higher doses that to addicts, at least assuming the patients were opiate naive?

Well, In so far as seeing a blue house lends credence to the hypothesis that all swans are white, I am not taking opiates, and do have tonsillitis and something of a fever. My cat didn't seem to get this kind of thing, nor cold nor flu, on opiates. Yet if you look on wiki, you will find, under morphine, that it effects the immune system in the opposite way, by increasing the risk of infection, although HIV, pneumonia and TB are mentioned, not colds and flu.

Maybe it's just symptomatic relief that opiates provide for colds and flu. It's an interesting question. I also wonder if methadone has a specific effect against leukaemia, or whether any opiate (mu-agonist) would do.

Dickon

[enquirewithin]

Opiate addicts often say that methadone addiction is harder to overcome than heroin addiction.

It is said that junkies never gets colds (William Burroughs said once. "Have you ever met a junkie with head cold?") but perhaps it doesn't apply to flu?

[ex-junkie]

hmm. swim cant remember being sick when she was on heroin/methadone or methamphetamine.

the second she quit for a given length of time (2 weeks would have been her maximum amount clean for over a decade tbh), she would always fall sick. in fact, when she got the flu for the first time ever whilst in rehab a couple years back after she ditched the methamphetamine. (unsuccessfully that time she might add).

:P

[Spucky]

Here is the most scientific Articel in Englisch, the Study is in German,
maybe someone else find a better one?

Methadone, Commonly Used as Maintenance Medication for Outpatient Treatment of Opioid Dependence,
Kills Leukemia Cells and Overcomes Chemoresistance

Claudia Friesen, Mareike Roscher, Andreas Alt and Erich Miltner

Institute of Legal Medicine, University of Ulm, Ulm, Germany
The therapeutic opioid drug methadone (D,L-methadone hydrochloride) is the most commonly used maintenance medication
for outpatient treatment of opioid dependence.
In our study, we found that methadone is also a potent inducer of cell death in leukemia cells
and we clarified the unknown mechanism of methadone-induced cell killing in leukemia cells.
Methadone inhibited proliferation in leukemia cells and induced cell death through apoptosis induction and activated apoptosis pathways
through the activation of caspase-9 and caspase-3, down-regulation of Bcl-xL and X chromosome–linked inhibitor of apoptosis,
and cleavage of poly(ADP-ribose) polymerase. In addition, methadone induced cell death
not only in anticancer drug–sensitive and apoptosis-sensitive leukemia cells but also in doxorubicin-resistant,
multidrug-resistant, and apoptosis-resistant leukemia cells, which anticancer drugs commonly used in conventional therapies
of leukemias failed to kill. Depending on caspase activation, methadone overcomes doxorubicin resistance,
multidrug resistance, and apoptosis resistance in leukemia cells through activation of mitochondria.

In contrast to leukemia cells, nonleukemic peripheral blood lymphocytes survived after methadone treatment.
These findings show that methadone kills leukemia cells and breaks chemoresistance and apoptosis resistance.
Our results suggest that methadone is a promising therapeutic approach not only for patients with opioid dependence
but also for patients with leukemias and provide the foundation for new strategies using methadone
as an additional anticancer drug in leukemia therapy, especially when conventional therapies are less effective.
[Cancer Res 2008;68(15):6059–64]

@ Someonewhoisentdickon,
we dont know the situation in your Cat`s homecountry, but in Germany People who are deadly ill use every way to safe some time,
they use all possibilitys the have, also unknown one like this Methadon-Test.
This People normally are not Opioidnaiv anymore!

Methadon is easy to Withdrawal, but only if you do it very slow and with a lot of disciplin!

Regards

[Junkhead23]

Methadone is not easy to withdraw from far from it. Even if SWIY reduce to 2mls and come off SWIY still get pretty bad withdrawals.

[Spucky]

Sorry for Offtopic:

2ml. is still to high for a "easy" Withdrawal,
my Cat stop it mostly with a half Drop, 0,125ml.!

Normally the Plan suggest 0,250ml. as the last Dose.
Still 10 Times lower than swinys 2ml..

[SmokeNmirrors]

Wow swim never thought of that but yeah the only time swim is sick is when he is in withdraw, other then that swim hasn't even got a cold the whole time he has been using. Swim usually gets some kind of cold every winter but not since he developed a habit.

[BrownStreakRailroad]

SWIM very rarely gets ill also, and has not really had many illnesses in the last 13 years on heroin. it is not unheard of though, in SWIM's experience when he does get ill, it's doubley worse!! especially when SWIY cant bring SWIY'self to smoke any gear as SWIY keep throwing up etc.. the combination of clucking and illness is wank!

[Spucky]

People with a higher interest maybe have a look here to the very good Database of Df.:

http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/loc...id=128&id=2821