Experiences - Alternatives to Melatonin?

[Barksdale]

Alternatives to Melatonin? Every time I try Melatonin it makes me wake up earlier than ususal.

Alternatives I can think of:
ZMA
GABA

[RaverHippie]

valerian root is another one

[gmeziscool2354]

diphenhydrinate or dimenhydramine are good sleep aids, tho they can also have negative effects, that melatonin does not have.

that is swims best advice

[Barksdale]

Originally Posted by gmeziscool2354

diphenhydrinate or dimenhydramine are good sleep aids, tho they can also have negative effects, that melatonin does not have.

that is swims best advice

Thanks, but I think I'll drop those if they have side effects.

valerian root is a good suggestions, however, I've heard that it works best when you cycle it.

I'm going to try 5-HTP with Valerian root I think.

[DaveCoat]

I have used melatonin capsules for several years because of all the side effects of the other drugs mentioned. But the problem with typical melatonin capsules and pills is that they take so long to take effect and you need to take them far in advance of going to bed.

To resolve this, my doctor pointed me in the direction of a new melatonin product called enlyten. You can do a google search for "enlyten melatonin" to find the details. Enlyten is a thin strip of melatonin and you put it inside your cheek to dissolve in your mouth like a listerene breath strip. The melatonin is absorded into your blood stream in 2 to 3 minutes versus the 30 to 40 minutes for a typical capsule or pill and the strip delivers up to 95% of the melatonin versus just 20% to 40% for caps and pills.

I have now used the strips for about 6 weeks. They just came to the market in early January, I understad. I would highly recommend trying them if you use melatonin now.

[gmeziscool2354]

im familiar with the enlyten brand of products. they are usually really good stuff. didn't know they made a melatonin one.

what dose sizes does it come in?

[runitsthepolice]

Melatonin (600mcg), Valerian, and 5-htp are all good for swim. These are effective on their own, but the combo of these three really does the job. For it to work swiy can't be distracted at all. No tv, music etc. Few side effects except swim sleeps a little longer than usual sometimes 8-9 hours good sleep (which is weird because it is the opposite of the OP's problem). If melatonin is causing problems, Valerian/5-htp should be pretty much just as good for getting to sleep and may not wake you early. Swim doesn't get any side effects from 600mcg melatonin tho, perhaps swiy uses a higher dose and that is causing problems?

[Barksdale]

Originally Posted by runitsthepolice

Melatonin (600mcg), Valerian, and 5-htp are all good for swim. These are effective on their own, but the combo of these three really does the job. For it to work swiy can't be distracted at all. No tv, music etc. Few side effects except swim sleeps a little longer than usual sometimes 8-9 hours good sleep (which is weird because it is the opposite of the OP's problem). If melatonin is causing problems, Valerian/5-htp should be pretty much just as good for getting to sleep and may not wake you early. Swim doesn't get any side effects from 600mcg melatonin tho, perhaps swiy uses a higher dose and that is causing problems?

SWIM was using 2-3mg each night together with ZMA..

Anyway, SWIM is done with Melatonin for now, SWIM don't know what to do with the rest though, more than half the bottle is left=P

SWIM is deff going to try Valerian Root and either 5-HTP or IBE X-dream. What's best of those two?

[RaverHippie]

what would be found in ibe xdream? it is best to only identify things by their active ingredients because not all consumer products can be found in every country. Also not everyone will know the active ingredients just by mentioning the brand name.

[Barksdale]

Contains:

N-Arachidonyl
3-OH-GABA
Dopamine HCL
Totally 240mg

I loove google

[Gradient]

Barksdale,

Phenibut has proven to be a reasonable substitute for Melatonin, but is generally characterized by a much longer duration. It's good if you'd like to get some really good and extended sleep in, and promotes relaxing alpha wave patterns the following day.

I used to take 5-HTP nightly just before I went to sleep, and it used to produce far deeper sleep than I naturally achieve. However, after using for an extended period of time, I found that it became harder and harder to fall asleep on nights that I'd taken it until I was worse off than before - sleepless without a sedative, regardless of 5-HTP ingestion. I have a few relatively baseless ideas as to why, but I figured that I'd share my experience with 5-HTP because in the beginning of my experience with it, I was a firm supporter of the compound as a sleep enhancer. I think it's most likely the presence of magnesium in the vast majority of 5-HTP supplements that would cause this restlessness, along with a slow desensitization to the 5-HTP.
ZMA caused severe sleeplessness on the vast majority of nights that a friend of mine tried it, but said he had extraordinarily vivid dreams on a night that he ingested a moderate dose of alprazolam and a regular dose of ZMA. Interesting supplement there - i'm pretty sure that it's just a combination of zinc and magnesium that is appropriate for post-workout replenishment. I've read a bunch of reviews on another large forum of people reporting completely restless nights from taking ZMA. Have you enjoyed sleep-enhancement from it?

Also, keep in mind - dopamine can't cross the blood-brain-barrier, and can't be absorbed by the brain through diet. That's why treating Parkinson's has been such a challenge - L-DOPA has been the alternative to pure dopamine. You'd never want dopamine in a sleep-aid, either - it generally acts as an excitatory neurotransmitter. Amphetamines enhance dopamine activity.

DaveCoat,

enlyten sounds like an interesting product. I've heard of melatonin sprays as well, and have only heard good things. Hope I'm lucky enough to run into some of the strips sometime soon - do you know if average drug-stores carry it?

[Barksdale]

Yeah that's what I've heard too that 5-HTP only works for a period of time, but for how long though? I'm deff going to cycle it same with a couple of other "sleep supps":

Here's what I'm thinking:

Month 1: 5-HTP + Valerian Root + Glyceine + ZMA + GABA
Month 2: Typtophan + Ashwagandha + ZMA + GABA

I know it's pretty expensive, but I think I need a lot of sleep to get rid of my cold (I've been having it for about 3 weeks now)
I'm really not sure if I should cycle ZMA or not though. I'm been using it for over a year, and I'm not really sure if it does anything to me anymore.

[DaveCoat]

Gradient,

I have only found enlyten online. Just do a google search for enlyten melatonin strips and you will find some sites that sell melatonin strips plus other enlyten products.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Thanks much for this information!

[shivakiva2112]

Barksdale, SWIYou and SWIShiva seem to have similar interests. They find 5-htp makes them very groggy in the morning and mentally sluggish the following day. They also feel like they're walking around in an emotional bubble, very similar to what people who take SSRIs have described. SWIYMMV

ZMA is an excellent supplement all around, but SWIShiva finds that it only works for about 2 weeks and after that they don't notice it anymore. Try taking a couple of weeks off, a year is really long time to take it without cycling off...and damn is it expensive.

Valerian is probably my favorite because it is GABAergic but only about 1/10th the potency of valium (SWIShiva read this somewhere, sorry they don't have a link). Phenibut, which SWIUs already discussed, is purportedly good for sleep-aid. GABA also makes SWIShiva feel groggy when they wake up and they just don't get much out of it, they've read that it has a poor absorption rate and doesn't cross the BBB very well. Meh, it does taste pretty good for a supplement.

Let SWIMUs see if they've got anything in the stash...higher doses of Melatonin (5 mg), also the one with B-6 in it is better but they wake up in the middle of the night when they take it so they're in the same situation as SWIYou.

L-Glutamine increases they're sleep quality, not really effective for promoting sleep, but it makes me feel better in the morning. Gotta throw the falafel in the fryer, will edit.