Pharmacology - CWE with ice..

[hamsterdam]

Someone thought of something, what if you iced out 90% of the water in your final CWE product. The ice shouldn't be taking any opiate or apap out with it, and it cuts volume much faster then letting it evaporate (since you can't boil it w/o messing it up).

[RoboCodeine7610]

[Quote]Someone thought of something, what if you iced out 90% of the water in your final CWE product. The ice shouldn't be taking any opiate or apap out with it, and it cuts volume much faster then letting it evaporate (since you can't boil it w/o messing it up).[Quote/] Swim thought of that too but then he figured that the ice would probably absorb everything that was dissolved in it right?Could someone confirm this?

[hamsterdam]

Why would the ice absorb whatever's in it? Think about it.. icebergs form in the ocean.. and icebergs are fresh water.

I guess this could be confirmed by letting the ice evaporate and seeing if any dissolved solids were in it.

[RoboCodeine7610]

I guess this could be confirmed by letting the ice evaporate and seeing if any dissolved solids were in it.

Well when swim gets ice in his CWE the ice is always cloudy which is why he thought it would get absorbed.Could you conduct the experiment yourself and post the results?

Thanks, Robo

[honourableone]

This is an interesting thought... But surely if ice formed around some codeine it would get trapped there? I think it's very likely that the ice would have codeine in it, though it would probably have much more APAP.

[hamsterdam]

SWIY is right, the ice is white (SWIM's CWEing hydrocodone tablets), when freezing a clear solution. However, if SWIY passes the melted solution through a filter the instant the last bit of ice melts, almost all the APAP has precipitated out of the solution. SWIM thinks that freezing then melting is better then cooling to 32 degrees. By just cooling to 32 degrees, some of the stuff will precipitate out, but by freezing, The total dissolved solids goes to zero, and any apap has to redissolve.

Less apap will redissolve (if you filter it quickly) then the amount that will just stay dissolved if not frozen.

Downside is this obviously takes longer and probably only removes a few mg of apap, so unless SWIY's taking like 50 pills or something, it's probably not worth it.

[RoboCodeine7610]

SWIY is right, the ice is white (SWIM's CWEing hydrocodone tablets), when freezing a clear solution. However, if SWIY passes the melted solution through a filter the instant the last bit of ice melts, almost all the APAP has precipitated out of the solution. SWIM thinks that freezing then melting is better then cooling to 32 degrees. By just cooling to 32 degrees, some of the stuff will precipitate out, but by freezing, The total dissolved solids goes to zero, and any apap has to redissolve.

Less apap will redissolve (if you filter it quickly) then the amount that will just stay dissolved if not frozen.
????: Drugs Forum http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=79527

Downside is this obviously takes longer and probably only removes a few mg of apap, so unless SWIY's taking like 50 pills or something, it's probably not worth it.

Yeah, that's what swim always does.He waits till there are chunks of ice in the solution and then just filters as soon as some of it melts.

[hamsterdam]

it's possible only apap is getting frozen into the ice, and that the more soluble components stay in the remaining water (salt is very soluble, and that doesn't go into icebergs).

But there's no way to verify this unless someone has access to a GC/MS lab to verify the contents in the chunk of ice.

[honourableone]

A rough verification could be carried out by evaporating the water from a usual CWE (multiple times to get an average) and weighing the powder, and then weighing the evaporated product of the unfrozen water from your method. Yes the APAP will be weighed as well, but depending on what the results are this method could be sufficient enough to deduce what is happening (though surely somewhere on the internet there is information about such things already). I would very much appreciate it if someone with high quality measuring equipment put in the time and effort to try this.

[hamsterdam]

Originally Posted by honourableone

A rough verification could be carried out by evaporating the water from a usual CWE (multiple times to get an average) and weighing the powder, and then weighing the evaporated product of the unfrozen water from your method. Yes the APAP will be weighed as well, but depending on what the results are this method could be sufficient enough to deduce what is happening (though surely somewhere on the internet there is information about such things already). I would very much appreciate it if someone with high quality measuring equipment put in the time and effort to try this.

Even then, how do you know what's APAP and what's hydrocodone (or codeine or whatever)?

Without some really expensive equipment it's next to impossible to know.

[honourableone]

If the ice method gave an incredibly low weight that was only slightly higher than the codeine dose (and the product worked as succesfully as that amount of codeine should), whereas the standard method gave a weight much higher than the amount of codeine, then It could be assumed to be a good method. Like I said, this would depend on the results, and would by know means be conclusive, but it could help.

Surely someone must know, at least in a non drug context, what happens to soluble molecules when water is frozen?

[honourableone]

This is the 3rd post in a row I've made about freebasing codeine, but surely it would be the most ideal way to test how effective using ice is (though this would probably make the ice method obsolete, the knowledge could be useful to some people)? http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36584