Taper off or cold turkey?

[Gappa]

SWIM hears all this shit about tapering but what is better? Tapering or going cold balls. I'm sure this has been discussed before but I want to know what has worked successfully for SWIYs

[fnord]

Both works,but people who taper off have a much higher success rate and dont have to worry about the negative effects that come when quitting cold turkey.

Speaking of cold turkey im going to go make a sandwich!,thanks for a good idea!

[AvidFan]

Originally Posted by fnord

Both works,but people who taper off have a much higher success rate and dont have to worry about the negative effects that come when quitting cold turkey.

Is there any evidence for this - what is the success rate based on? Have controlled studies been done?

Also depends on the opiate and the situation I would have thought - tapering off street heroin would be a practical impossibility given the inconsistency, whereas tapering off say, oxycodone, might be possible - but is an utterly useless approach in X's own experience. Also, tapering might well work in a rehab setting, but I think it would be a very hard task for an addict working on their own to successfully taper using their DOC unless they were really, really committed and had done the psychological work necessary to stay clean.

[wonky]

Well SWIM is tapering, this is her third cut, and is sticking with it. She hasn't done any psychological work to acheive this. SWIM started coming on this board when still taking the full amount, she was searching for something besides an AA/NA forum, and wanted to quit using. On this forum she read the stories of others, this gave her the motivation and courage to quit. SWIM is 9 days into her taper, and 50% lower on the drugs. It is not easy, always in one state of withdrawal or another, but SWIM has cold-turkeyed before, and figured she would taper this time before she ran out. SWIM spends alot of time on here, read Patient X's and Rokman Nash's story, spends all her time in the addiction forum. Yes, SWIM is committed, but she can't say she was super-committed when she started. Just sick and tired of the whole thing, like many other SWIY'S on here.

[AvidFan]

Originally Posted by wonky

Well SWIM is tapering, this is her third cut, and is sticking with it. She hasn't done any psychological work to acheive this. SWIM started coming on this board when still taking the full amount, she was searching for something besides an AA/NA forum, and wanted to quit using. On this forum she read the stories of others, this gave her the motivation and courage to quit. SWIM is 9 days into her taper, and 50% lower on the drugs. It is not easy, always in one state of withdrawal or another, but SWIM has cold-turkeyed before, and figured she would taper this time before she ran out. SWIM spends alot of time on here, read Patient X's and Rokman Nash's story, spends all her time in the addiction forum. Yes, SWIM is committed, but she can't say she was super-committed when she started. Just sick and tired of the whole thing, like many other SWIY'S on here.

Finding the motivation and courage is what I meant by doing the psychological work

It seems though that if tapering leaves SWIY always in one state of withdrawal or another, then it certainly doesn't avoid the negative effects of cold turkey, and just seems to prolong the torment?

[wonky]

SWIM'S torment is turned down quite low. As stated before (somewhere) SWIM has cold-turkeyed, and didn't want to do it this time. SWIM also has times when she feels pretty good-and it's not right after taking a dose-but times when she feels almost 'normal' again. This might last an hour, may two. Sometimes the nerves get going pretty good for a few hours and she hates it. Most of the time it's bearable, SWIM is able to do basic household stuff, even forces herself to do 1/2 hour of yoga a day (not much considering SWIM has done yoga for 10 years, and is used to 1-1/2 to 2 hrs). SWIM has to say this is preferable to cold-turkey torture, considering the amounts she was on. If she jumped off now, it wouldn't be as bad. But she is a little more than 50% lower than when she started. SWIM guesses it all depends on the individual. If SWIY wants to get it over quick, that's fine. If not, then taper. Whatever works, right? And no, it does not avoid the negative effects. SWIM just gets them a little at a time, and not as acute, instead of all at once.

[Gappa]

Does tapering actually work though? SWIM tried it with suboxone and it was still pure hell for 1 month. I am completely clean now but I am just looking back and would like to have the answer in case someone asks.

[oxynomo]

Swim was put on a taper,but as usual swim couldn't follow instructions.90 oxys gone 120 percs gone 2 weeks thus a self imposed turkey.couple days of shit hell and a couple weeks no sleep ,good as new.Don't know but they both probably suck.Just stay clean and you won't find out.

[Gappa]

SWIM got clean with the wiessmann method. They get you thru the really fucked up part the first week, then SWIM just stayed under hot water for the next 2 weeks and feels good now except for not being able to sleep properly.
I am interested in how others have done it successfully.. or otherwise.. I have read X's Dickon's, The ROC's of course!

[Dickon]

SWIM (really, not me) tapered off methadone for 18 months. He said it was painless; he jumped from 5mg and used lofexidine. He had a moment of revelation, and just decided that however long it was going to take him, he was getting off the heroin and that was that. I could never stand to go through such a slow process. That said I'd not recommend the 200mg, 100mg, 0mg "taper" off methadone outside an institution (unless you're Gappa on a roll, and he would probably add some naltrexone just for fun!!), or inside one for that matter although my cat did go through with it, with the aid of clonidine. The only point of such an experience is to have gone through it! I guess after boarding school, the rest of life is a cakewalk!!!!

I'm more of a turkey man myself, [I had a french book at school which had a chapter with the immortal phrase I remember to this day : Ecraser la dinde - i.e. squash the turkey. How prophetic, and how odd that I remember it.], although my last time round was a taper. I don't think the cat would have enjoyed jumping off from about 225mg of methadone a day; not at his age. I think the 5mg/day drop works well for a methadone taper (you can go 10mg a day or more if you're up in the 100+, 150+ range) , and I'd recommend it. It's a good compromise. It's not so long as to let you lose focus, nor is it quite as bad a shock to the system as a full on leap!

The thing is, even if one has tried a few different methods, one's body is always changing, and w.d. are different at different periods of one's life soo there is never any way to arrive at a best method even for yourself.

We probably all swear by the ones that worked for us!!! I say, get into a chicken costume, parade round New York smeared in cheese with a sign saying "pancakes gurgle" whilst yodeling in Swahili if that's what'll get you off.

One hopes not to fight this fight again, and having won it's enough to celebrate the victory, however obtained.

Dickon [yodeling in Swahili]