Effects - What is SWIM doing wrong?

[Armaghetto]

Hello everyone!

Sorry if swims english is bad. Swim is from Denmark.
swim has social anxiety and therefore swim read about various herbs on the internet and from what swim have found out is that Kava Kava should be the best for anxiety. Should work a lot like benzodiapines. Swims doctor will not subscribe benzodiazepines for swims anxiety because of the addiction it can cause in the longer run.

Well, then swim ordered finely grounded Kava Kava powder, Kava alcohol extract, kava full spec paste and kava capsules. Swim tried all of them but still with no effects. Swin has drank the kava powder for 2 weeks because swim read about the reverse-tolerance.

But swim still can't feel no effects.

The kava powder is bitter but it is not numbing swims tongue when swim drinks the kava, is that because the kava is low potency?
The kava full spec paste is numbing swins tongue a LOT but there is still no effect from 1, 2 or 3 pea sized servings.
The Kava elixir is also useless.
The Kava capsules are also useless.

What is SWIM doing wrong? SWIM is stubborn and is not going to give up until effects are acheived. SWIM has now ordered ned Kava powder from the same vendor again and another vendor.

And one more question. Is it forbidden to ask for sources/vendors in Private messages? Because Swim really need this to work, because swims anxiety is unbearable and swim is starting in a new school again soon and swim would very much like to have something to ease the start in school.

Looking forward for answers..

[fractalhaze]

kava can be really poor quality sometimes and that is probably what you had.

There are other botanical alternatives for anxiety though if kava does not do it for you!

[zornthro]

Something else swiy might like to try is picamilon.

SWIM's kava comes from a company in Hawaii, US, and it's top grade stuff. All swim can say is try drinking lots of the stuff. The reverse tolerance isn't needed if swiy just drink a whole bunch in one sitting, if swiy can tolerate it.

[calimar]

SWIM has a similar problem. SWIM has tried kava kava several times from two reputable vendors, so far only in powdered root form from Vanuatu and Fiji. The powder numbs the mouth like it's supposed to.

SWIM started with 2-3 tbsp of powdered root in milk/lecithin and got some slight relief from anxiety, but nothing very noticeable. SWIM drank it every few days for around two weeks with ~ the same dosage. Sometimes with a slightly better effect, sometimes not noticing anything at all.

As the supply ran out SWIM ingested 11 heaped tbsp over the course of 4 hours. The first four were ingested as part of an emulsion with milk/lecithin, the next few just plain chewed/sublingually and then the rest in more milk/lecithin.

The only thing SWIM noticed was somewhat wobbly legs and slight relaxation. SWIMs anxiety might have been a bit better at the peak, but not at all gone. SWIM also had a tad bit of a stomach ache after this session, but nothing bad. The next morning SWIM was still slightly groggy/cotton-headed, but it passed after a few hours.

SWIM has ordered more kava from yet another vendor to give it another go but SWIM thinks he might be one of the people for whom kava just doesn't work all that well. Maybe SWIY is too, from what I have read tolerance and effects are very different from person to person.

[Armaghetto]

SWIM has found out that he is somewhat immune to kava kava, because SWIM has tried almost all methods of ingestion and preparation. So if ure not getting any effects after 1 or 2 weeks use then quit trying because then ure probably immune like swim is.

[stratry]

Originally Posted by Armaghetto

SWIM has found out that he is somewhat immune to kava kava, because SWIM has tried almost all methods of ingestion and preparation. So if ure not getting any effects after 1 or 2 weeks use then quit trying because then ure probably immune like swim is.

SWIM's experience with Kava Kava has been very much the same.

[Bajeda]

When making powdered kava root into a beverage, my panda finds that different techniques have varying efficacy.

If he wants to make a stronger drink he does things slightly differently.


He uses water instead of milk. Milk tastes better but is less numbing and seems (though this is quite speculative) to result in a weaker brew than if water were used. This differs with the type of Kava and even randomly at times (may be amount of blending used).

My panda blends his kava, using the "ice crush" feature to rapidly churn the mix in a start-stop-start fashion. Don't know if this helps, but it works easier for him.

He usually would use a simple strainer to strain out the remaining kava powder as its quick and easy. However, he has noticed that when he uses a cheese cloth to properly wring out all the kava juice the resultant beverage feels stronger.

Also worth mentioning that my panda uses lecithin, though he hasn't tried comparison brews with an without it to see how much of an impact it has on the final product. Also heard that oil can help with emulsification, but haven't tried this.


Some people have noted a sort of reverse tolerance effect. Trying Kava on consecutive days, or even in staggered doses, may help produce a more noticeable effect.

Another important consideration is to adjust your expectations. Kava produces a more subtle buzz and if you are expecting to be blown away you probably should reconsider why you want to use kava. Different varieties of Kava can produce different effects, and if you want something more like getting drunk off alcohol then maybe a stronger kava like a papua new guinea type would work better. Don't expect Kava's effects to exactly resemble beznodiazepines or alcohol though, it is a unique substance with its own style of effects.


Set and setting also makes a difference. My panda feels that the effects of kava are stronger - or at least more noticeable - when he takes it to help with amphetamine comedowns, or when he ingests it after smoking cannabis. Perhaps if one could identify / recognize the effects better (such as if they were stoned upon onset) they could enjoy kava more, a sort of psychological reverse tolerance per se.

Final possibility is that some people are simply immune to Kava's effects or have a high degree of pre-existing tolerance to kavalactones. Would not jump to this conclusion right away as others have found kava to work after initially being discouraged by lack of effects, but it seems possible.

[Alfa]

FUBAR had the best experiences with either Hawaiian kava-kava or with pure kavalactones. There is a lot of weak kava-kava available and kava-kava and its extracts surely isn't always what's listed on the label.

[AceOvArts]

SWIM uses 2-3 large pea sized rolls of 84% paste and gets very nice results.
Of course though, we are all different so start small and work your way up until you feel effects.
Its not rocket science but it does take time and patience to lern to enjoy most ethnos.

[No ceiling]

I don't remember anyone mentioning EMPTY STOMACH, which is essential if SWIY isn't noticing effects from kava

Quality of root varies dramatically.
Generally the worst quality of root is used for extractions so don't expect much help there.

A kava-enthusiast friend tells me grinding course kava in a coffee grinder and then sifting out the talcum like powder through fine mesh is the way to go. He likes to mix with chocolate soymilk or pineapple juice blends. 3 Tbs. is a healthy (fairly strong) dose.

If you can find microized kava you can skip the sifting all together.

A small cup of coffee (or other caffeinated beverage) can help bring out the effect for some people I've been told.

I found this information lately, which may also help gauge effects and help folks find the kava they are looking for:

It's important to be aware that kava has two different noticeable effects after ingestion.
With kava, you will notice either a:

1. cerebral/"heady" feeling,

or

2. body/muscle relaxant type of feeling.

It's never one or the other but it seems that most people will be aware of only a varying amount of cerebral. This causes most to judge potency only by this trait alone ignoring or not noticing the other.

Due to the fact that the cerebral feeling comes on immediately, it is what people notice predominantly and most times solely. This heady feeling will disappear relatively quickly as well (lasts up to one hour). It is due to more kavain (K) in the kava.

The body or soma feeling, being just as important, is caused by more dihydromethysticin (DHM) and takes a little longer to happen but also lasts a lot longer too (six to eight hours). It lends a soothing muscle relaxant, analgesic, etc. quality to kava although it has a side effect of possible nausea.

This distinction should be noted as some people prefer more of one effect over the other, despite the fact that they tend to overlap somewhere and is not that easy to distinguish the two unless you're aware of it.

Reputation Comments on this post:

informative post, good job!

[Ilsa]

Originally Posted by No ceiling

I don't remember anyone mentioning EMPTY STOMACH, which is essential if SWIY isn't noticing effects from kava

Quality of root varies dramatically.
Generally the worst quality of root is used for extractions so don't expect much help there.

A kava-enthusiast friend tells me grinding course kava in a coffee grinder and then sifting out the talcum like powder through fine mesh is the way to go. He likes to mix with chocolate soymilk or pineapple juice blends. 3 Tbs. is a healthy (fairly strong) dose.

If you can find microized kava you can skip the sifting all together.

A small cup of coffee (or other caffeinated beverage) can help bring out the effect for some people I've been told.

I found this information lately, which may also help gauge effects and help folks find the kava they are looking for:

It's important to be aware that kava has two different noticeable effects after ingestion.
With kava, you will notice either a:

1. cerebral/"heady" feeling,

or

2. body/muscle relaxant type of feeling.

It's never one or the other but it seems that most people will be aware of only a varying amount of cerebral. This causes most to judge potency only by this trait alone ignoring or not noticing the other.

Due to the fact that the cerebral feeling comes on immediately, it is what people notice predominantly and most times solely. This heady feeling will disappear relatively quickly as well (lasts up to one hour). It is due to more kavain (K) in the kava.

The body or soma feeling, being just as important, is caused by more dihydromethysticin (DHM) and takes a little longer to happen but also lasts a lot longer too (six to eight hours). It lends a soothing muscle relaxant, analgesic, etc. quality to kava although it has a side effect of possible nausea.

This distinction should be noted as some people prefer more of one effect over the other, despite the fact that they tend to overlap somewhere and is not that easy to distinguish the two unless you're aware of it.

could swiy post some links to references? not doubting the validity of anything said, very interesting post and through information. any literature is greatly appreciated though, as my cat likes to keep a list of references on this, as she has generalized anxiety and ptsd. thanks!

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