Tryptamines vs. Phenethylamines

[Wierd Logic]

Which do you prefer?
For Squirrel, he would have to go with tryptamines. LSD is the king of all psychedelics in his opinion, and the craziest nights of his life have all involved acid. DMT is also just a ball-dropping, awe-inspiring experience to behold.
However, its not all one sided. He has had more experience with tryptamines than he has phenethylamines, and he is yet to try 2c-t-7 (either this weekend or the next, and he's excited!) and higher doses of 2c-b yielded simply awesome effects, and 2C-I gave him probably his most visual (bar the short explosion of DMT) trip he's had. Perhaps further exploration of the phens would make Squirrel change his mind.

Well, which do you swimmers prefer?

MODS: I had a little think about where to put this, and I decided that DMT and LSD aren't research chemicals, so it should go here. Feel free to move it. Also, could you make it a poll? Thanks!

[Expat98]

^^I cannot add a poll, but you should be able to post a thread with a poll. You can create a new thread with a poll if you want, and then send me a PM and I will delete this thread.

[Routemaster Flash]

LSD's not really a tryptamine, although it does include a tryptamine group in its much larger molecule. Lysergides, tryptamines and other chemical families (including beta-carbolines, such as the harmala alkaloids; mytragynine (active compound in kratom); and ibogaine) all fall into the bigger category of indole alkaloids.

There's a good summary of the main ones here: http://leda.lycaeum.org/?ID=3561

Having said that, there are obviously certain subjective similarities between acid and (say) psilocin.

[Wierd Logic]

Aah, Squirrel got shown up. However, Phenethylamines vs. Indole Alkaloids doesn't quite have the same ring to it...

Well, that kind of took the wind out of me. Forget it then :P

[Routemaster Flash]

No no, it's a good idea for a thread! SWIM isn't really experienced enough to have a particularly informed opinion on the matter (well, he's had good times on mushrooms but prefers ecstasy on balance, big woo). SWIM is just pedantic by nature, heh.

As it happens, drugs like ephedrine, (meth)amphetamine and cathinone are all phenethylamines too, though I guess the word is usually used to mean the psychedelic 2CX/DOX/mescaline type compounds.

[Gradient]

Swim has been lucky to have had generous experiences with both classifications, and has observed tremendous cross-over of effects from many substances. For example, both 5-meo-DIPT/MIPT resemble phenethylamine stimulation in Swim's experience. At times, though 2c-I is often regarded as a psychedelic without true insightful substance, Swim has had experiences similar to the aftermath of smoked DMT on 2c-I. Not the peak. Just the aftermath. MDA has also elicited effects characteristic of what Swim would expect from a tryptamine when administered in isolation, and not in groups of people.

Swim and cohorts have actually had numerous dialogues on this subject. The arrived conclusion was that the subtle differences in effects of the various phenethylamines and tryptamines are quite likely due to differing neurotransmitter receptor binding affinities and efficacies; a given tryptamine likely hits a few of the same receptors that a phenethylamine of similar effects hits, though with varying affinities and efficacies.

Tryptamines would take the cake due to DMT and related analogues, but Swim tends to have more pure and visceral fun on phenethylamines. Tough choice, thankfully unnecessary.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Well put. Hopefully SWIM and SWIY and continue to explore these families.

[RaverHippie]

SWIM's only ventured with phenethylamines so his hats tipped before it came to decide and acid has never even come close to comparing to any phenethylamine he's tried.

[TMM]

SWIM does not draw a particular distinction between them. Too much overlap. In fact, SWIM views them all as one big group.

[pilipuntos]

Originally Posted by TMM

SWIM does not draw a particular distinction between them. Too much overlap. In fact, SWIM views them all as one big group.

Swim agrees. He finds that the differences are not from one RC family to another but to concrete compounds.

The last trypt swim has tried was 4-ho-met, and it shared the bliss of 2c-b and the strong visuals of 4-aco-mipt, for example.

[Routemaster Flash]

The most powerful and beautiful visuals SWIM's ever had have come from tryptamines (psilocin and bufotenine - 4-HO-DMT and 5-HO-DMT respectively, i.e. structural isomers of each other, SWIM guesses), although a high dose of what he thinks was probably MDA was pretty visual too. LSA (HBWR seeds) gave some visuals but mainly just had the effect of making SWIM freak the fuck out.