Magic Mushroom Ban a fact in UK!

[gambit]

What paper was that Billy?


Go to the link I posted above to see all about the counterr court case.

[enquirewithin]

Interesting, but I can't get the link to work.
Edited by: enquirewithin

[gambit]

Try www.entheogendefencefund.org.uk

[billyloner]

Originally Posted by gambit

What paper was that Billy?

it wasnt one of the best papers in the world! just 'metro', the paper they give away free on the transport network around here (and i guess elsewhere in the uk). whatever the quality though, its still a bit worrying...

[Peyote]

Man this is really fucked up..Stupid short-sighted goverments..Hopeless this..

[ramjet]

The Secretary of State has yet to announce when s21 of the Drugs Act
(the bit relating to shrooms) will come into force. Technically he
could postpone it for as long as wanted to, so long as he gave it
consideration from time to time. This is very unlikely, though. I just
hope he's really busy at the moment and forgets about it for a few
months ... or years ...



Good news: The Drugs Act doesn't effect the legality of peyote buttons!
Now, to persuade the local "Zen" shop that the public are spiritually
ready for over the counter peyote sales (they get some in from time to
time, but oddly they didn't seem all that keen on selling it - they
probably reserve it for the hard-head hippy customers they KNOW will be
able to handle it)

[enquirewithin]

Under the present governement any infringements of human rights are possible.

[glomp]

all these laws are so ridiculously ambivalent about the topic, it's legal but at the same time it's not...

[freakybass]

Now the dream is finish

[Alfa]

The home office says it will take a couple of weeks - monthsbefore it comes in effect.

[joetaco]

God damnit. I wish I hadn't read this whole topic; the first couple of posts made me so happy!

[SLICE]

Well it still hasn't come into effect yet... I bought a bag of shrooms from my local sex shop on saturday.Any news on when there is going to be a complete crackdown?

[gambit]

I 've had a letter from Caroline Flint which says that magic mushrooms are dangerous for people with heart conditions and mental conditions and canlead to self harm.I would like to know if any of you can point me to relevant Scientific papers which confirm or oppose this idea.


Thanks

[Alfa]

That and the rest of Caroline Flynts letter is bullshit and twisted facts and she knows it. Luckely some people have awoken in the UK and as a result Dr. David Nichols, president of the Heffter institute and Rick Doblin of MAPShave reviewed that letter and given their view upon it. I'll dig that up for ya.

[Sky Walker]

Don't know bout the dangers related to heart problems unless your trippin hard and get all scared and panicky, could cause stress on your heart. As for people with mental problems, it's not advisable to take any psydelicsbut it'sonly in extreme cases that they canlead to self harm. Sorry I can't provide anyrelevant Scientific papers.

[gambit]

Who are the people you mentioned alfa and where are they bassed.They sound knowledgeable. What does Hugh Pennington say about them?

[Alfa]

www.heffter.org www.maps.org Both research institutes. Bottom line is that there is no dat or research in the world to base the opinion of Caroline Flint on. It has been made up just to pass this law. It's the same cunningness which has made them pass this law on a unannounced day, so the politicians could not even prepare themself for this law. The mushroom clause was just two lines between a shitload of other clauses(most of them heroin related)that could do nothing else pass parlaiment and the house of lords.

[gambit]

Very helpful Alfa,thanks.I was able to provide my MP David Cameron with a link to these sites for further reading and enlightenment on the subject.He may one day be in a position to change back this unjust and misguided piece of legislation. A nd bring about a better more enlightened world.

[sg43]

I know that psilocybin is chemicaly related to serotonin, and therefore might be dangerous to people with mental conditions,and ive aslo heard that they raise your blood pressure, so i would beleive that statement is true.

[gambit]

Ok so you believe it to be true but what scientific evidence can you show to back up your claim?


If this was an argument based only on anecdotal evidence thte ayes would have won it a long time ago. Let me have the science please.

[Phungushead]

On psilocybin and mental conditions:

I guess it kind of depends on the mental condition (a lot of mental
condition/psychadelic problems involve schizophrenia), but I know for a
fact that fairly recently (last note was Feb. 2004) there was an
FDA-approved study on the effects of psilocybin on Obsessive-Compulsive
Disorder symptoms. I do not know if this is still going on or
what.

A friend of mine has severe OCD. Whenever we take mushrooms, the
intrusive thoughts that normally fill his head are gone... the one time
he can be free from them, probably due to the serotonigenic effects of
psilocybin (OCD can be caused by serotonin imbalances).
Unfortunately, the minute psilocybin's effects are gone, the OCD is
back. He says the symptoms are not worse, but the way they were,
like they were never gone. (Incidentally, acid has the same effect)

There have been quite a few cases like this reported, this is why
they're doing the study mentioned above - to replicate these effects in
a controlled situation. I do not know how that study worked out
in the end, but last I heard 8 people had been treated (not cured)
without any problems.

[Alfa]

testimony from Professor David Nichols of the HRI (rebuttal of Caroline Flint) and from Dr Rick Doblin of MAPS.

From what was said in parliament during the Bill’s Second Reading and during the Standing Committee stage, the greatest fear seems to be that the mushroom presents a danger to the mental health of certain susceptible people. Upon what scientific information has this judgement been made? If we assume that the majority of mushroom users are healthy persons (and currently not criminals), then is it sensible to instantly make criminals of them on the grounds that an inferred minority of users will not be suited to the mushroom’s effects? If harm reduction is one of the prime functions of the government, then how will banning the mushroom serve to reduce harm? Steve Rolles of Transform (personal communication) agrees:

“If you have mental health problems then using hallucinogenic drugs, in fact any recreational drug, is obviously a bad idea. But what about the majority of people who don’t have mental health problems? It is like banning peanut butter because a tiny minority people are allergic to it. Surely people who have problems with drugs or mental health should get the help they need. Those who don’t have problems (the vast majority) are unlikely to develop problems, are not a problem to others, and are not the concern of the State beyond being provided with accurate information about risks and being encouraged to make responsible lifestyle choices. Neither group should be the concern of criminal law unless they harm others.”

To be sure, the concerns over mental health issues are debatable anyway as the following rhetorical exchange demonstrates. The ‘exchange’ consists of a response from Professor David Nichols, President of the Heffter Research Institute, to comments made by Caroline Flint MP regarding psilocybin mushrooms.*

* Caroline Flint’s comments, in quotation marks, were prompted by a letter she received from me via my MP Tom Cox.

"Mr Powell refers to the relatively low health risks associated with magic mushroom use. However, magic mushrooms, like LSD, are highly hallucinogenic.”

Professor David Nichols: What does that mean? Highly hallucinogenic? Is being "highly hallucinogenic" inherently dangerous, and if so why?

“They are particularly harmful to those with mental illness or with an underlying mental health problem and can precipitate psychosis. Users are also vulnerable to self harm whilst under the influence.”

Professor David Nichols: There is no evidence that hallucinogens produce mental illness in anyone not predisposed to it. That is, persons who experience the onset of psychosis would likely have suffered it in any case; hallucinogens may expedite the process. LSD is most problematic in that regard because it also activates dopamine pathways in the brain; the same transmitter that is believed to be involved in psychosis. Psilocybin does not activate dopamine pathways.

“…and, like LSD, those misusing mushrooms may experience negative flashbacks.”

Professor David Nichols: Hallucinogen persisting perceptual disorder (HPPD) as far as I know is only consequent to the use of LSD. I am not aware of documentation that mushrooms cause flashbacks. This effect could well be related to sensitization of brain dopamine systems, a well known phenomenon, which could occur with LSD but is unlikely to occur after psilocybin because of differences in their mechanisms of action.

"Mr Powell also refers to the recently published Dutch Report which concludes that mushrooms are not physically harmful to healthy subjects. The report does at least concede that taking magic mushrooms can be very harmful to those with existing heart conditions.”

Professor David Nichols: There is no inherent reason for heart problems after hallucinogens unless someone already has a heart condition and they have an experience with mushrooms that causes stress that precipitates a heart attack. Hallucinogens do not interact with the receptors that control blood pressure or heart rate and any cardiovascular problems are only related to stressful events; taking a hallucinogen is not inherently stressful. Thus, anyone experiencing heart problems after hallucinogens is already "a heart attack waiting to happen."

“However, the report does not tell the full story; it does not address their effect upon worsening of mental health conditions or the potential for self harm whilst under the influence."

Professor David Nichols: Mentally ill persons should not be taking mushrooms, or any psychoactive drug at all. There is no evidence that mushrooms cause mental health problems in "normal" individuals. The potential for self-harm occurs with alcohol intoxication or any drug that clouds the senses. How many alcohol intoxicated persons wreck their automobiles, often killing themselves and others? Alcohol intoxication leads people often to believe that they are completely in control of their actions, when in fact they are not. Mushroom intoxication rarely, if ever, produces such inhibition. Rather, mushroom intoxication is more likely to result in a state where the user is extremely conscious that they should not be out and about. Awareness is most often increased, not inhibited as it is with alcohol.

Professor David Nichols: Furthermore, alcohol is one of the most addictive and destructive drugs known to man, often producing lifelong dependence and personal destruction. Mushrooms are not in any sense addictive, nor do they injure the health of normal people. There is not a single documented case of death by mushroom overdose, nor is there a single documented case of mushroom dependence or addiction.

David E. Nichols, Ph.D.
Dept. of Medicinal Chemistry and Molecular Pharmacology
Heine Pharmacy Bldg, Room 506c
575 Stadium Mall Drive
Purdue University
W. Lafayette IN 47907-2091
765-494-1461 (Voice)
765-494-1414 (FAX)

[Alfa]

Psilocybin Therapy

As evidence of the benign properties of psilocybin, the House should consider the fact that there are three psilocybin therapy studies currently underway in the USA. These studies have been sponsored by the Heffter Research Institute (www.heffter.org) and the Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies (www.maps.org) and have been sanctioned by those various officiating acronyms (like the FDA, the DEA, etc) who exert strict controls over the use of entheogenic substances in the USA. Given the extremely draconian drug laws in the USA, such studies would be incomprehensible if psilocybin were truly dangerous. The studies are looking at psilocybin’s possible role in: mitigating the psychological distress of patients suffering from end-stage cancer; treating obsessive/compulsive disorder; and treating cluster headache syndrome. It remains to be seen what other therapeutic applications psilocybin has.

Statement From Rick Doblin, President of MAPS

TO: House of Lords/Commons
RE: Drugs Bill - Clause 21
FROM: Rick Doblin, Ph.D. President, Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies (MAPS, www.maps.org)
DATE: February 3, 2005

By way of introduction, I have a Ph.D. in Public Policy and also a Masters in Public Policy from Harvard’s Kennedy School of Government, where I specialized in the regulation of Schedule I drugs. I also founded (in 1986) and currently direct the Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies (MAPS), a non-profit research and educational organization that sponsors FDA-approved research into the risks and potential therapeutic benefits of Schedule I drugs such as MDMA, psilocybin, and marijuana.

Psilocybin Research in England:

MAPS has been working with several researchers in the UK on the design of a questionnaire to be filled out by purchasers of fresh mushrooms at numerous points of purchase around the UK. The questionnaire will assess both the positive and negative effects of fresh mushrooms. We have completed the final round of critiques on the questionnaire and should be able to start implementing the data-gathering phase within a matter of weeks. The study should take about four months for data-gathering and analysis.

We intend to present the results of the study to the House of Lords/Commons in the hopes that some direct data would be helpful in formulating government policy.

Psilocybin Research in the United States

MAPS is currently co-sponsoring with the Heffter Research Institute an on-going FDA-approved study of psilocybin in the treatment of Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder (OCD), under the direction of Dr. Francisco Moreno, Uni. Arizona, Tucson. Preliminary results are promising. MAPS is also independently sponsoring the analysis of case reports and medical records from about 75 subjects suffering from cluster headaches who have used psilocybin mushrooms (illegally) and discussed their therapeutic effects on an internet website (clusterbusters.com), with this case report study leading to a clinical trial to take place at Harvard Medical School, under the direction of Dr. John Halpern and Dr. Andrew Sewell.

Psilocybin Risk/Benefit Analysis

While no drug is completely safe, psilocybin has a relatively low risk profile. There are no significant risks of physical damage from psilocybin, to either body organs or brain. This has been well established in over 45 years of research. For background information supporting this conclusion, MAPS has created digital, PDF copies of virtually all the pioneering scientific papers published on psilocybin and has posted them on our website bibliography at: http://www.maps.org/sys/w3pb.pl?face=simple/

The mental effects of psilocybin are generally well-tolerated, milder than the classic psychedelics such as LSD, DMT and ayahuasca, and are not linked to flashbacks. Generally, users of psilocybin report enjoyable recreational experiences and/or enhanced understanding of themselves and the wider world. Not infrequently, users report having spiritual/mystical experiences. The use of psilocybin contributes either not at all, or positively, to the mental health of the vast majority of users.

It is possible that psilocybin can trigger mental instability in people prone to such problems. Even in mentally healthy people, psilocybin can present powerful psychological challenges with persisting negative effects lasting until the psychological material that has emerged into consciousness, in a manner somewhat similar to dreams, is addressed and integrated. While such negative effects in mentally healthy people are rare, they can occur.

In about 1 in 5 million cases (this is just a rough estimate), problematic reactions to psilocybin have resulted in suicide. Though it is impossible to know for sure, it’s likely that the positive effects of psilocybin have prevented more suicides than the negative effects have generated.

Comments about Drugs Bill-Clause 21

The widespread use of fresh mushrooms in the UK, coupled with what seems to be a lack of evidence about any increase in harms as a result, suggests that more study should be conducted before any action is taken to criminalize fresh mushrooms. Prohibition has well known negative consequences, such as the creation of black markets with associated violence around sales, and should be a last resort as a public policy option.

The questionnaire to be administered to purchasers of fresh mushrooms is a tool that could provide valuable information to the House of Lords/Commons. Given the absence of an imminent public health threat of a significant size, I urge both the House of Commons and the House of Lords to observe more closely the actual consequences of the availability of fresh mushrooms and ground its decision on data and facts, rather than hypothetical assumptions and fears.

For more information about MAPS’ research efforts, I’ve briefly mentioned below our current research with MDMA (Ecstasy).

MAPS’ MDMA Research in the United States

MAPS is also sponsoring two studies approved by the FDA for the therapeutic use of MDMA. The first study is in subjects with treatment-resistant posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD) who are victims of crime or soldiers with war-related PTSD, taking place in Charleston, South Carolina under the direction of Dr. Michael Mithoefer. The second study is in subjects with anxiety associated with advanced-stage cancer, taking place at Harvard Medical School under the direction of Dr. John Halpern.

MAPS has also started a study of possible long-term neurocognitive consequences from the use of Ecstasy (often but not always MDMA), taking place at Harvard Medical School under the director of Dr. John Halpern. The National Institute on Drug Abuse recently awarded Dr. Halpern a $1.8 million, five-year grant to complete this study.

Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies
MAPS - Rick Doblin -
3 Francis Street - Belmont, MA - 02478-2218
Tel - 617 484 8711
www.maps.org
rick@maps.org

List of Useful Internet Resources:

Dutch Risk Assessment Study that concluded that mushroom use was not problematic:
http://www.erowid.org/plants/mushroo...ms_health1.pdf

2004 hardcore scientific study that found psilocybin to be safe:
www.maps.org/research/hasler_2004_1.pdf

Home Office Report (2000) on the non-problematic nature of magic mushrooms:
http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs2/hors249.pdf

A set of rational licensing proposals for the trade in magic mushrooms:
www.tdpf.org.uk

Information on current psilocybin therapy studies: www.maps.org and
www.heffter.org

Simon G. Powell
Editor of Prescience: www.island.org/prescience/

[gambit]

Thanks a bunch Alpha you've really given me some ammunition to go on with.I sent David Cameron my MP a link to a study about some of the effects of psilocybin so he could argue my case better with Caroline Flint but have not heard back yet for obvious reasons. With this information I can further my argument to her through him about the need to think about facts and data before stripping people of thier rights and cultural practices.


I think that the real fight here is more than "should we shouldn't we" be allowed to take mushrooms it's about the way in which we're Governed and the quality of the descision making by the Government regardless of who's in power.

[gambit]

That's very interesting phungus head I had no idea they were doing there was such a trial taking place.It must be a great comfort to any one with compulsive disorder