Best Gram Value?

[Nagognog2]

There is a vast difference in the chemistry of acetoxy - CH3COO-R - and a phosphorous atom. Acetoxyl groups are inherintly more stable and could pass through the blood/brain barrier intact and take up residence. That I do not dispute. But the P group has been shown to revert to the hydroxyl. It would be interesting, though, to try this hypothesis out with something unique. Say: O-Phosphoryl -4-hydroxy-n.n-dipropyltryptamine. See what that one does based on radio-tagging and dose/response.

[allyourbase]

the structure of the compound might remain unaltered in these exchanges but doesnt the weight change? doesnt molecular weight have something to do with potency in regard to chemical structure? the acetoxys were in theory metabolites of the hydroxy compounds right?are their chemicalpropertiesextremely similar? could you say...smoke a 4acetoxy(their being more stable and whatnot)? qualatatively I find miprocin more akin to its 5methoxy analogue than to mushrooms. which is to say, more powerful. different.... psylocybin is more of an organic experience (no pun intended) while miprocin seems almost mechanical....it is a very clean trip as you said. virtually no unwelcomed effects even at doses ranging to 45 milligrams.Edited by: allyourbase

[gn2osis]

Originally Posted by allyourbase

the structure of the compound might remain unaltered in these exchanges but doesnt the weight change? doesnt molecular weight have something to do with potency in regard to chemical structure?

Yes but probably not enough to matter; check Shulgin's comments in TiHKAL under psilocin.

the acetoxys were in theory metabolites of the hydroxy compounds right?

vice-versa. but they may be active on their own.

are their chemicalpropertiesextremely similar?

Depends on which properties.... as psychedelics they seem similar
though in certain cases (4-HO/AcO-MIPT) the acetoxy may be somewhat
less potent, moreso than the molecular weight difference would have
suggested.

could you say...smoke a 4acetoxy(their being more stable and whatnot)?

There are reports of 4-AcO-DET freebase being smoked and being mucho effective.

qualatatively I find miprocin more akin to its 5methoxy analogue
than to mushrooms. which is to say, more powerful. different....
psylocybin is more of an organic experience (no pun intended) while
miprocin seems almost mechanical....it is a very clean trip as you
said. virtually no unwelcomed effects even at doses ranging to 45
milligrams.

ya, miprocin's amazing. happy trails!



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[gn2osis]

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meant to add something about smoking 4-acetoxy tryp's vs.
4-HO-tryps. There's a good chemical reason why the former would
be easier to smoke. It's because the 4-HO's exist as something
called "internal salts". The proton moves from the 4-HO group to
the N on the terminal amino group, leaving a negative charge on the
former and a positive charge on the latter. Salts generally have
higher vaporization points than non-salts. 4-acetoxy's ought to
vaporize more readily, as long as they exist in freebase form and not
as a salt (i.e., a protonated nitogren and a negative counterion like
chloride or something like that). Most 4-acetoxy's on the market
are in fact salts, so you'd have to make the freebase. You can
check the search engine on that.