Drug info - "Tolerance Factor" you can only get so high

[Swimster]

by Jon Gettman
High Times, July 1995


One of the safest qualities of THC, delta-9 tetrahydrocannabinol, the primary psychoactive substance in marijuana, is the natural limit the body places on the drug's effects.

It has long mystified scientists how most individuals can consume enormous quantities of marijuana with few or no obvious ill effects. But the explanation will not surprise regular marijuana users.

Early researchers were often alarmed by this, believing that this tolerance was a warning sign of dependence or addiction.
Tolerance generally describes the condition of requiring larger doses of a drug to attain consistent effects. While tolerance to marijuana has never exactly fit the classic definition, some form of tolerance to pot does develop.

Regular users of marijuana frequently claim that this tolerance reduces troublesome side effects, such as loss of coordination. They also claim that tolerance to marijuana develops without risk of dependence.

Cynics have argued that tolerance to marijuana is proof of dependence, and proof that the drug is too dangerous to be used safely and responsibly.

Science has finally proven otherwise. The cynics have been wrong, the pot-smokers have been right. Tolerance to marijuana is not an indication of danger or dependence. This conclusion also adds credence to anecdotal accounts of marijuana's therapeutic benefits by patients suffering from serious illnesses.

This conclusion also adds credence to anecdotal accounts of marijuana's therapeutic benefits by patients suffering from serious illnesses. ...

resume... http://www.marijuanalibrary.org/brain2.html

[Paroxysm]

Hmmm. Swim finds this an interesting read because swim believes that it's entirely dependant on the individual taking the drugs. For example: swim has a very low tolerance when it comes to smoking weed, and swim smokes usually once or twice daily. Swim has been a daily user for the past 6 months or so, and 1 hit off a pipe (not even a bong) will get swim stoned and that hasn't changed since day 1.
Swim does however agree that the "type" of high swiy gets changes when using regularly. Swim used to get super anxious and paranoid when high, but swim would like to say you kind of "get used to" the high, and learn to control your anxiety, paranoia, and train of thoughts which makes it easier to control motor skills and coordination etc.

[fiveleggedrat]

Swim used to get insanely stoned off a hit. Now, becoming a daily smoker, he gets barely a buzz from three bowls, or about 600mg of material (With no tolerance, 200mg is PLENTY for him)

Swim has to break for a week to really get anything.

Swim's been playing around a lot with cannabinoid tolerance lately. He has divided the effects of marijuana on him into plateaus, and is taking notes regarding the amount of time he spends away from marijuana, the amount he consumes when he does consume, and the subjective effects.

One thing Swim finds is that there is an "instant" tolerance right after getting high, but long term tolerance, the kind we all hate, builds within a 12-24 hour period mostly.

It's like if he smokes For Mon-Weds, his tolerance will be, lets say, -3. If he breaks for the next 3 days, it seems to return somewhere between -1.5 and 0. The goal is to have as high a number as close as possible to zero.


Swim'll do some real research one day and share.

[Shampoo]

Originally Posted by Paroxysm

Hmmm. Swim finds this an interesting read because swim believes that it's entirely dependant on the individual taking the drugs. For example: swim has a very low tolerance when it comes to smoking weed, and swim smokes usually once or twice daily. Swim has been a daily user for the past 6 months or so, and 1 hit off a pipe (not even a bong) will get swim stoned and that hasn't changed since day 1.

While there is some variation between each user, the facts of tolerance still exist. Downregulation is a natural phenomenon that occurs in almost all receptors and subtypes, and the CB receptors (both 1 and 2) are no exception to this rule. There are many factors that contribute to the efficiency of cannabinoid uptake, and maybe your friend has some of these on their side. Do they consume large amounts of omega-3 fatty acids like DHA and EPA? Also, using very small amounts as described above can reduce downregulation, which is something that results when receptors are barraded with activity, not just activated. Smoking small doses frequently may not elicit the same response from CB receptors as smoking large doses.

for more information on cannabinoid tolerance, see the stickied thread in the cannabis using forum on tolerance, or see the cannabis wiki article, which contains the information from that thread.

[Swimster]

Supossibly, the more swiy smokes the less it will effect swiy next times. Swiy(paroxyism) smoke 1 or 2 X a day? Well, swim used to go 10x a day. This is the problem, that over-doing it will not increase effects but reduce them. Swim could wait 3weeks or more, get real high the first time of the day, then repeat 9 more times. After the first or second high, swims effects are compleatly weakend, like tolorance, even if he smoked 6 bowls in a row.

but... like swiy said, everyone is diff...

[fiveleggedrat]

With ZERO tolerance, Swim can smoke a max of 3 times daily to reach effects.

With tolerance, once daily is great.

Swim can sit down with tolerance and smoke 10 bowls back to back, but get nothing after the first one or two bowls. After those first ones, Swim just gets a headache and nausea. Swim usually stops smoking once taking a hit makes him gag.

Edit: Never really heard about o3's in relation to cannabinoid tolerance but Swim has a bottle lying around and will experiment. Thank you.

[Shampoo]

Originally Posted by fiveleggedrat

Edit: Never really heard about o3's in relation to cannabinoid tolerance but Swim has a bottle lying around and will experiment. Thank you.

Anything that increases membrane solubility will have an effect on one's ability to take chemicals into their brain, where they will find their targeted receptors. A good dose of alpha-gpc, or some similar choline supplement, with some DHA tends to prolong and intensify one's high significantly, at least from anectdotal evidence. I do not have much to substantiate that, but it has certainly had a catalytic effect for swims cannabinoid intake. There are other dietary factors as well that could have an influence on one's ability to effectively ingest cannabinoids, however after a bit of consideration, it sounds like in the case of paroxysm's friend, his use of low doses no more than 2 times a day is probably the biggest contributor to his lack of a notable tolerance.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Thanks for the helpful info!

[Smokey420]

SWIM Is a daily smoker, tolerance is definetely noticable, as SWIM can only feel the "high" effects of marijuana the first time he smokes in a day, after the first smoke SWIM cannot feel high, but only stoned. NooTropic drugs such as Alpha-GPC and Piracetam do a great job increasing the high. SWIM only feels high for about an hour or two after taking 2 hits of MJ

[Juko]

Listen. From the way swim sees it, it's just like a computer. Your sober mind is drive C. when you first smoke pot, you install a new drive on your comp. As you smoke you get more files and programs and shit in the new drive. making it smarter and smarter. each time you smoke your stoner brain gets smarter.

[Shampoo]

Originally Posted by Juko

Listen. From the way swim sees it, it's just like a computer. Your sober mind is drive C. when you first smoke pot, you install a new drive on your comp. As you smoke you get more files and programs and shit in the new drive. making it smarter and smarter. each time you smoke your stoner brain gets smarter.

What?

Can you please explain this? What is the "new drive" being installed on one's "computer" (brain?) New receptors? New connections? New thoughts? I dont understand this metaphor or how it relates to the mechanism of tolerance.

Then, what are these "files and programs and shit" that make your "new drive" smarter and smarter? and what does being smarter have to do with tolerance/what do you mean "smarter"?

Please do a little bit of reading on the mechanisms of down-regulation and the effects of cannabinoids on CB receptors, and if "the way swim sees it" still sounds reasonable, please come back and elaborate/explain.

[Desertfox]

Originally Posted by Shampoo

What?

Can you please explain this? What is the "new drive" being installed on one's "computer" (brain?) New receptors? New connections? New thoughts? I dont understand this metaphor or how it relates to the mechanism of tolerance.

Then, what are these "files and programs and shit" that make your "new drive" smarter and smarter? and what does being smarter have to do with tolerance/what do you mean "smarter"?

Please do a little bit of reading on the mechanisms of down-regulation and the effects of cannabinoids on CB receptors, and if "the way swim sees it" still sounds reasonable, please come back and elaborate/explain.

I believe what he was getting at, is that after smoking so many times you become well practiced in the art of being High. so well practiced in fact that the feeling is no longer novel to you, and unfortunately have grown to be "used" to the feeling of being high. It feels pretty much like you are sober because you are in that state of mind so often.

[th3tawav3]

Originally Posted by Desertfox

I believe what he was getting at, is that after smoking so many times you become well practiced in the art of being High. so well practiced in fact that the feeling is no longer novel to you, and unfortunately have grown to be "used" to the feeling of being high. It feels pretty much like you are sober because you are in that state of mind so often.

Amazingly true! swim has since graduated to being a daily smoker and swim just takes bong rips all day packing just enuff for a large hit jus to save weed.
SWIM said, "I have noticed that throughout the day I feel like i can';t get any higher and that i have reached some sort of limit.

Yet in all actuality this is just due to my state of mind to be in tune with my senses when the thc is in my system, and it remains so even in the times when swim smokes less or more frequently thus seemingly tolerance lvl"

[fiveleggedrat]

Shampoo, Swim has started taking Fishoils. 1g gelcaps, taking at least 2 and max 3 or 4 a day. Nasty things but tolerable. Swim has noticed that it feels like the afterglow lasts longer, but not really noticing any effects on the high. It's been about 5 days. Swim figures taking them for longing will prove useful. Swim'll report back.

I've been studying on the mechanisms of cannabinoid tolerance and all that jazz. It does not seem like there is some easy way out out cannabinoid tolerance excepting taking breaks. Opioid receptor are the only type that really seem like it will easier to sensitize.

My first theory was that an taking antagonist of CB1/2 would increase sensitivity. I doubt it would work. CB receptors seem very diff. from opioid in terms of how they work.