Combinations - Codeine and Heroin?

[sirris]

SWIM has a friend that is a pretty heavy H user (snorter never a banger). He wants to try some CWE.

So, is it safe to give SWIM's friend any CWE?

And if so, does SWIM need to control the dose (SWIM usually does 400mg as a max dose (no reason to go higher, as SWIM understands it)?

Thanks.

[beena]

Its pretty dangerous but also SWIM would imagine quite pointless as SWIM also snorts H and often tops up with morphine. On occasions in the past when SWIM ran out or couldn't get any opiates she tried CWE codeine but it never did much for her cos of the stronger opiates she was taking. So on this basis SWIM would suggest that the danger of taking two depressant drugs pretty much outweighs any high that SWIYs friend is gonna get off the codeine. hope this helps.

[jon-q]

in swims experiance it always pays to ere on the side of caution when doing any drug for the first time,just because your freind may have a high tolerance to one drug it dosent automaticly suggest (but more than likely)that they will have a high tolerance to another.swim would suggest a tester dose and gauge the effects.
although this may well sound very boring and i may well be an old fart dishing out old farty warnings it has served this old fart well over the years..

[Mint boi]

Is Ops friend going to combine heroin and codeine? Or is he a heroin user who wants to try codeine for the first time?

[sirris]

He's a heroin user that wants to try out the CWE codeine for the first time. SWIM has seen him down Percs or Oxys while using whatever else he may happen to have in his system at the time (heroin, coke).

SWIM is leaning towards caution on this one at the moment; meaning that SWIM may deny him the codeine for his own good. SWIM hates to have to do the thinking for him though, his right to choose and all that. Hmmmm.

[darkglobe]

Originally Posted by sirris

SWIM hates to have to do the thinking for him though, his right to choose and all that. Hmmmm.

It never hurts to give a friend some informed advice.

MY opinion would be that SWIY should firstly advise his friend of the dangers involved when mixing drugs. They may be minimal when dosage/timing/other factors are well planned and done responsibly, but they're still present.

Anyway, SWIY's friend will probably feel fuck all off the Codeine. Codeine is converted to Morphine in the body, in tiny tiny amounts (I think it is around 10% if I remember correctly). Since Heroin is a synthetic relative of Morphine, and Codeine is a comparably weak Opioid, I would bet that the additional effects would be minimal.

Hope I've helped

[sirris]

Actually that helps a lot. Thank you. SWIM suspected that the effects would be minimal but wasn't sure if there would be a cumulative effect.

SWIM thinks that he will not mention the codeine again and hope/expect that SWIMs friend will totally forget about it(very likely, hehe).

Ya, that's the decision. No codeine for him.

Thank you all for the input. It really helped SWIM come the safest conclusion.

Reputation Comments on this post:

no problem. A little good rep wouldnt hurt tho

[RoboCodeine7610]

The heroin will completely overpower the codeine and swiy will barely notice any difference.
Swiy could use the codeine when he's dope sick though...

[darkglobe]

Replacing one addictive substance with another isn't the best idea. C'mon now, Robo, use your head.

[RoboCodeine7610]

Originally Posted by darkglobe

Replacing one addictive substance with another isn't the best idea. C'mon now, Robo, use your head.

SWIM is not talking about replacing and addictive substance with another, SWIM is talking about replacing one withdrawal with another, one that can be more easily handled.
Why do you think they give methadone to heroin addicts? So they can decrease the dosage little by little.

[sirris]

A new scenario has arisen in regards to SWIM's friend. He called looking for some H or some of the CWE I had mentioned to him to get him by, as he was drug sick (beginnings of withdrawal?) and his dealer was MIA.

So the new question is; would a CWE of 8/15's really help him in any way, or is he better off just toughing it out as best he can?

[beena]

A lot of heroin addicts will do CWE's if they literally can't get anything else - and no, to be honest the amount of codeine a heavy heroin user would need to extract exceeds the ceiling limit that codeine has to convert into morphine in the body. SWIM has however done CWE's herself many times when she was in dire straits and it may give a little physical relief and probably some mental relief too ... so SWIM wouldn't rule it out. That said I think the science is something like every 10mg of codeine will convert into just 1mg of morphine in the body so like SWIM said - a heavy heroin addict would need a hell of a lot to get any real comfort....SWIM would prefer to have something rather than 'tough it out' as SWIY puts it ... SWIM thinks SWIY should consider this when making a decision. SWIY's friend will no doubt suffer horribly either way though.

Oh SWIM just wanted to add that she was taking upwards of 600mg of morphine tablets that she was able to get hold of sometimes when she couldn't get heroin so if SWIY does the maths ... well, there's just no way anyone is gonna get/take 6000mg of codeine! And even if SWIY did that would way exceed the ceiling effect that codeine has.

[sirris]

Thank you very much. That's exactly the kind of thing SWIM was looking for. You brought up a whole new point that SWIM hadn't truly considered; the placebo effect.

He's already on methadone too but it isn't enough in his times of need. SWIM has recently felt the pain of mild heroin withdrawal himself, after snorting for about a month. It was not pleasant; tolerable though. SWIM can only imagine the true withdrawal of a genuinely large habit. Ack!

SWIM asked this one before (maybe?) but if he's a heavy heroin user,also on methadone, is it safe for him to jump right up to the top of codeine (about 400mg) dose? Or should he be worked up on it? SWIM isn't quite clear on the whether and "opiate is an opiate" or whether they all need to be treated differently. They all need to be respected, of course.