Combinations - please help! codeine and citalopram??

[flipper70]

I have been recreationally using codeine for 5 years, not huge amounts - about once or twice every couple of weeks about 80mg - just enough to chill as life is so stressful! The doctor has just put me on citalopram for panic attacks and anxiety and its a nightmarte coz the codeine just hasd no effect! Ive read up on this and understand the whys, but im now feeling more anxiety and depression because i cant get the chill from the codeine. I used to be on fluexotine ( prozac ) which didnt effect the codeine at all but this does which is odd coz they work in the same way. I cant go back on fluoxetine as it affected my liver. I dont want to come off the citalopram as i need to feel better for my day to day routine - work and single mum to two children- but i feel so low without that moment for me every couple of weeks. Does anyone have any ideas about how i can get round this? appreciate it, going insane!

[TheNewLeft]

i have the same problem....i'm on cipralex....which is an SSRI VERY similar to what you're taking. my problem is....my recreational codeine dosage was 250-300mg....not 80mg. So I upped my dose to around 400-450mg which is right around the ceiling for codeine....and I get "some" effects, but to perfectly honest....it's still not as intense as 200mg of codeine without the SSRI.

some things you can do to help...

1) up your dosage of codeine incrementally by maybe 25-35mg to see if that helps
2) combine codeine with other OTC pharms....like sedating anti-histamines (dipenhydramine or brompheniramine maleate) and antacids like tums or malox
3) use an opiate that doesn't require all that liver bullshit to work...hydrocodone or oxy should work

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[flipper70]

Thanks for the info - I assume its safe to use anti histamines with codeine and citalopram?!! sounds alot! worth a go though, not sure where id get hydrocodone or oxy - not heard of them.
cheers

[meaculpa]

swim has just been prescribed citalopram, first one taken today and is dismayed to find that it will stop codeine from working swim needs relief from anxiety which codeine brings, previous anti-depressents have been no use for anxiety so swim isn`t confident that citalopram will work either. swim was going to start using CWE and wonders if it`s worth trying anyway. does citalopram stop codeine effect for everyone? swim thinks this may be positve as may help swim to stop abusing codeine and get clean but only if citalopram works for anxiety problem.

[flipper70]

meaculpa - Its a nightmare isnt it! swim has been on citalopram for three weeks now, and the codeine is not doing the job it did. Anxiety is swims main problem and like you said the codeine is the only way swim can chill out! Have to say though swim found cwe didnt work as well - dont know why - swim was taking 6 nurofen plus before just for a light chill and at that level the ibuprofen wasnt dangerous so swim took the whole thing. Now the damn citaloprams kicked in swim thought to try a higher level of codeine so had to do cwe. used 12 tablets(12mg codeine ) but no warm buzz at all. maybe its the combination of both that does it for swim? Got hold of some 30mg/500 paracetamol tabs from a friend so though it worth a shot - ( cozswim could take 4 and still be safe with paracetamol and get 120mg codeine ) and the buzz was great! Swim a bit confused really - is it the combinations that work? or maybe swim doing the cwe wrong - obviously the citalopram didnt block the codeine from the 30mg tabs so why from the others? Meaculpa - what dose do swiy usually take and in what form? sounds like swiy dont use cwe so smaller doses maybe? If swiy try what swiy normally does - see if it has any effect and let swim know - we can compare methods! swim wouldnt recommend stopping citalopram as it is helping swims anxiety a bit - stick with it's swims advice and we can see if we can figure out the codeine thing!

[meaculpa]

swim only took first citalopram yesterday so swim should be able to enjoy codeine for a while longer. untill swim joined this forum, swim had no idea about CWE and had been pill popping for approx 12 years [very bad idea ]. swim normally takes 10/12 8/500g pills per day in one go, but since monday has been taking 6 x 7.5 dihydracodeine 5oomgs para and 4 x 12.5 codeine 2oomgs ibu, [so 10 pills in total, with more opiate, less para] swim changed codeine source to reduce intake of para. swim hasn`t made first attempt at CWE yet but will start soon .swim has ordered pill crusher to avoid using heavy object swim is also considering reducing codeine intake for the next 3 weeks in the hope that when citalopram kicks in her tolerrance will be reduced and she can then increase codeine and hopefully still get a buzz. swim also has 10 x 5mgs of diazepam which swim thinks help her to temorarily reduce codeine. will let swiy know how she gets on. swims first attempt at CWE will be with 15 x 8/500gms chemist own brand. has swiy done many CWE`s? maybe it takes a bit of practise to perfect, swim has taken her codeine fix, about half an hour ago and can feel it though expects this won`t last once the citalopram has got into system. let swim know how swiy gets on

[flipper70]

Swim went through a phase of taking nurofen every day - but only 3 at a time and no more than twice a day. swim stopped it though coz the buzz that i looked froward to on a sat eve for instance - wasnt as good if id been taking a bit here and there in the week. Might be an idea if swiy stops the high daily intake - and save up for a good one like swiy said, swiys body is gonna get too used to it and the damn citalopram will stop it more. Not sure what swims doing wrong with the cwe - followed instructions carefully and the liquid tasted awful so it must have been right - but no buzz. maybe swim didnt do enough pills - and get enough codeine out, was a bit worried about using more than 12 - swims body only used to six at a time! Will try again with more tabs - will try 15 like swiy- but nurofen plus so 12.5 mg codeine - or is that too much?? see how swiy goes with the diazepam instead - trouble is it dont give swim the buzz that codeine does - just calms a bit, makes swim a bit sleepy too! swim gonna try not having any codeine for a few days - then try the cwe again. will let swiy know! ( just read this all back and have decided swim sounds like a sad muppet! but oh well - god bless codeine! ) x

[meaculpa]

make that 2 sad muppets swim thinks that citalopram is reason for swiy not getting buzz off codeine but maybe if swiy tries higher dose swiy might be lucky, not sure about N+ though, swim thinks she read a post somewhere which said N+ is not good for CWE. swim thinks swiy should check forum before trying this as N+ is too expensive to waste. swim agrees with swiy that she should cut down on codeine intake as tolerance builds up quickly so less enjoyment. swim thinks she will also try to cut down on codeine in the next few days then have first attempt at CWE. swim will also try anti-histamine as suggested in earlier post. swim also takes strong antacid everyday for stomach problem so wonders if this will help.

[flipper70]

ah! didnt realise nurofen + didnt cwe well - what tablets should i get then? something with codeine and paracetamol i guess, but not sure what theyre called - or if available in uk?
Wasnt sure about the antihistamine thing was bit worried about taking too many pills. could be worth a shot though once in a while. Let swim know how swiy get on! does antacid help with the buzz then? can do that for sure got some of them! Will keep in touch

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[Psych0naut]

To everyone on this thread, codeine is a regulated drug in many countries. Although it is available OTC in many countries as well, it's only OTC in small quantities and often solely when combined with paracetamol. Pure codeine tablets are still regulated as opioids in those same countries. Misuse of it is often illegal as well, and although it might not be in SWIY's country, you still have to follow the rules regarding self-incrimination. So, always reffer to SWIM or equivalent when discussing codeine use, do NOT self-incriminate. Doing so anyway will lead to infractions and continued breaking of the self-incrimination rule will lead to banning.

[meaculpa]

swim has just checked and there is a thread where this is discussed. swim recommends that swiy enters nurofen plus in search and swiy should be able to find it. swim is currently using cuprofen plus which is the same as N+ but cheaper. swiy can buy co-codamol 8mg codeine/500grms paracetamol pack of 32 for £2 or under ask in any chemist. 2 well known chemists sell their own brand, just ask for paracetamol and codeine tablets. swiy must only use these for CWE.
other pills widely available in the uk are
paramol - 7.46 mgs dihydracodeine [stronger version of codeine] 500gms para. swim doesn`t know if these are suitable for CWE but are more expensive.
propain - 400gms para, 10mgs codeine, 5mgs diphenhydramine, 50mgs caffeine. again swim doesn`t know if these are suitable for CWE and would appreciate if any other swims have tried, possibly too many ingredients though.
according toTheNewLeft who posted earlier in the thread antacids can help, swim doesn`t know how.

[flipper70]

thanks for that will tell swim to try co codamol! x

[meaculpa]

swim wonders how flipper has got on with CWE? swm has now been taking Citalopram for 2 weeks and has found that most of the side effects have subsided. except for feeling tired all the time.
swim has now carried out 2 CWE`s and found that with 18 paramol she still gets a good result despite taking citalopram.
maybe swim is lucky and citalopram in this instance is not inhibiting codeine

[flipper70]

Glad swit is finding citalopram ok now - though swim still gets headaches and is tired continuously - that could be swims nervous thing though. Swim tried cwe with co codamol at the weekend - and had a result! Thinking now it may be the fact that swim was using N+ before that the result not so good. swim used 15 co-codamol. Not sure if swim got all paracetamol out as water a bit cloudy - but effect was ok. I see swiy used 18 paramol - thats dihydracodeine - is that better than in co codamol? Has swiy tried both? Must admit swim found it a bit scary crushing up that many tabl;ets - just looks so bad - im guessing that amount of codeine is ok though looking through the forums!

[meaculpa]

swim is glad swiy got a result! swim also found solution quite cloudy but is satisfied that she got most of para out due to large amount of sludge in the bottom of the glass after putting it in freezer for a while. swim used paramol instead of co-codamol cos DHC is stronger than codeine and swim still has some tolerance due to continued daily use. swim has also tried CWE with superdrug co-codamol and had a result also. on swims first attempt at CWE swim first crushed pills but on latest attempts swim has just put pills in warm (not hot) water and found they dissolve quite easily. however when swims pillcrusher which she ordered, arrives swim will start to crush pills again as swim believes this is the best way to obtain maximum codeine. swim is trying to reduce daily intake to reduce tolerance and just drink magic potion at weekends

[flipper70]

Ah! swim will try paramol! do they only contain para and dihidracodeine? Or any caffeine in there? Prob a good thing swiy has decided to stick to weekends! Will enhance the effect and prob better for swiy in longrun. Must admit tho, swim does it every other weekend ( coz thats when swim has house to herself ) and the two weeks between are a killer! This obviously should tell swim to stop coz of addiction - but oh my god thats hard! How much harm do you reckon us swims and swiys are doing exactly?? Anyway, enjoy this weekend - be thinking of swiy while I sip a cup of tea! x

[meaculpa]

yep no caffeine. swiy is wise to only do this occasionally as swim found out that tolerance and addiction quickly develops, no fun! swim also finds days without codeine difficult but knows she will enjoy potion more if she sticks to weekends only. swim thinks that as long as CWE is always used that swim and swiy will be o.k.
swim lives with cleanliving flatmate so has to sneak about to avoid detection kinda adds to the fun though

[salviablue]

swim was wondering if this is why opium, in a variety of forms, doesnt seem to have any effect on swim? SIDK informed swim that s/he is taking citalopram and cannot get any noticable effects from opium!
swim has read things similar to this but only really regarding codeine. SIDK informed SWIM that the strongest response s/he got was from smoking about a quarter of tar, obtained via the isolator method, all at once in hir hookah over about an hour. This still left sidk feeling like s/he was seriously missing something.
SDIK told SWIM they found P.Rhoeas to give more of an effect?!

Any pointers or SWIY get similar? (Maybe this should be a separate thread?)