Telepathy & Psychedelics

[ADVOR]

Here SWIM is again. It's funny, SWIM only seems to post threads on this forum when he's coming down from a very inspirational acid trip.

So SWIM and three friends ate some very extremely good blotter last night and at the end of the trip (now), SWIM and his friends discussed how psychedelics can almost bring a group of people together to one being. Last night, SWIM and his friends were literally sharing the same experience with one another. SWIM has experienced this a multitude of times, but never put it into words so well until he had three others to help.

During a different acid trip, SWIM was tripping with one other person. They went to the movies and even people listening to them agreed that they seemed to be saying the same sentence. I'll try to explain this.

The sentence would start off with one person and another would chime in, saying what the other person was just about to say. This would go on with the entire group the entire night. Even if that wasn't the case, they each knew exactly what the other was saying, even before he said it.

At the very end of last night's acid trip (now), SWIM and his friends saw a guy across the street walking to his car. It's morning now and they all assumed at the exact moment that this guy was going to the gym. No one immediately said it. They all talked about how he was probably a douchey man. He was wearing plaid shorts and appeared to be in his 30's. SWIM knew he had a child and seemed like a more aggressive father. They discussed this and as soon as the conversation ended, SWIM said, "Yup, he's goin' to the gym." Immediately another said, "I was thinking that immediately when I flashed my eyes to see him... he's going to the gym." and another said, "I know exactly what you're saying, I immediately noticed it but didn't say anything because it was irrelevant to the conversation." SWIM and everyone agreed that they all felt the same way.

What does this mean!? Is it possible that the human race is (or is evolving to be) able to pick up each other thoughts? SWIM wouldn't think that acid creates this ability. SWIM thinks that it's an ability possessed by humans but it is much much more enhanced and defined whilst on psychedelics.

Does anyone have some experience they can shed on this? Please tell me SWIM isn't still tripping and just imagining all this nonsense. This is seriously a recurring phenomena SWIM has experienced. I feel like I've discovered a new ability to human-kind!!!

[Nature Boy]

It's not a phenomenon, it's merely a coincidence. You'd be surprised how often this sort of thing happens when a group of people are observing something together, psychedelic use or not. When something of that sort happens on LSD, it might appear to have a more mystical connotation but it really doesn't.

[ADVOR]

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

It's not a phenomenon, it's merely a coincidence. You'd be surprised how often this sort of thing happens when a group of people are observing something together, psychedelic use or not. When something of that sort happens on LSD, it might appear to have a more mystical connotation but it really doesn't.

That's what I'm trying to say... This phenomena is real, just more noticeable on acid for a strange reason. But it's hard to say it was coincidence, but perhaps a commonality between the 4 caused them all to assume he was going to the gym... or what?

[jakored]

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

It's not a phenomenon, it's merely a coincidence. You'd be surprised how often this sort of thing happens when a group of people are observing something together, psychedelic use or not. When something of that sort happens on LSD, it might appear to have a more mystical connotation but it really doesn't.

SMILEY had a very intense, good, somewhat wonderful mushroom trip with two good longtime friends the other week, and felt the same way. Smiley believed, they could read all smileys thoughts, minds, emotions and demons.. smiley was horrified, and Smiley believed they could hear, or Be with me in where Smiley was in my mind. Smiley then thought happy, silly, stupid, or crazy explode-the-galaxy thoughts and believed they were sharing in them.

Nope, just partly the mushrooms, and partly the firm energy between three connected persons all working at the same goal: trying to experience the world (room) around them in a much more intense manner through the shroomies.

jakored added 1 Minutes and 20 Seconds later...

Originally Posted by lostmente

well...seen the dark knight? when the jokers voice goes all deep and distorted? kinda like that

swim has found a daily high dose of fish oil can help out with psychic exhaustion

on the weekend swim was doing late night surfing and felt a bit isolated. His cell began to ring...on speaker phone (which swim doesn't know how to use). Swim hadn't touched it and yet it was an outgoing call. It was one of swims close mates, he'd just got back from the night clubs and was having an oil spot for a night cap.

Smiley also notices that at the darkest deepest thoughts of depression, or just, not really noticing that Smiley wants to talk to someone, someone will call.

Energy

[podge]

I dont believe this can be simply put down to mere coincidence, consciousness is far more dynamic than most people give it credit for and psychedelics can be helpful in bringing out the more intriguing aspects of it. Coincidence and the materialist view of reality also cant explain the phenomenon of contact highs.

[Nature Boy]

Contact highs could be described as merely being part of an atmosphere, or merely having the ability to pick up on other individual's behaviour. I do agree that coincidences seem remarkable when under the influence of psychedelics but it makes a lot of sense considering how psychedelic experiences tend to pan out. Each member is in the same chemically-altered state, a very similar state of mind, and when this is expressed in words, it seems like some sort of transcendent experience. Even in sobriety people share many of the same thoughts but never express it. I think MDMA is far more effective than LSD for reaching those states.

[podge]

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

Contact highs could be described as merely being part of an atmosphere

And atmosphere/ambience itself is explained by universal consciousness.

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

or merely having the ability to pick up on other individual's behaviour.

Picking up on what somebody is feeling during a trip is one thing (although swim can only attest to this while he himself has been tripping not observing ), experiencing elements of it by merely being in their presence without having taken any chemicals is another story.

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

Each member is in the same chemically-altered state, a very similar state of mind

Ya but people have different brain chemistry , doses will vary, and experience is different for the user everytime so it cant just be explained away as coincidence. Also remember, the person experiencing the contact high hasnt taken any chemicals....so there is no explanation as to how or why their brain chemistry would begin to mimic somebody elses.... other than a shared consciousness.

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

Even in sobriety people share many of the same thoughts but never express it. I think MDMA is far more effective than LSD for reaching those states.

True, but i dont see the bearing on contact highs.

[ADVOR]

Another thing SWIM noticed is that SWIY will become who SWIY spends time with. For example, SWIM spent time with a set of friends for years and only recently has he gotten new friends. He notices that his euphamisms and speech is now becoming extremely similar to his new friends' speech. This was also extremely pronounced on LSD.

[Nature Boy]

We still aren't aware of the validity of contact highs. Is it simply the sharing of an atmosphere or can one actually start seeing fractals if around LSD users without ever having taken some? It's a subjective area to say the least.

[podge]

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

We still aren't aware of the validity of contact highs. Is it simply the sharing of an atmosphere or can one actually start seeing fractals if around LSD users without ever having taken some? It's a subjective area to say the least.

The validity ? Im not sure what valid or invalid here, you mean you simply disbelieve the reports ? A contact high doesnt have to follow a set pattern like any trip, it may include different elements for different people. Indeed it is a subjective area, just like tripping ...and sobriety.

[doublezero]

it used to happen alot with swims friends wen they trip, thinking as one and seeing the same hallucination.

Also wen i'm ill (i got bi-polar) i can hear peoples thoughts

[sylenth]

well this is what smurf has had for a while & it gets amplified on & after lsd even more. smurf believes strongly it is what all humans have the capability of if they choose to which comes with believing in things like this by not blocking it out & not just coincidance. smurf can read minds & it completely fucks out the insecure people on acid when around smurf. in day to day living smurf knows what people are gonna say or think & smurf almost wants to change their nasty ways in public places for example. but smurf has to hold back cos this kind of action could get smurf in to a fight.

smurf proves these things on a daily basis & there's too many coincidances in a day, some things that have happened are just too weird, amazing & far fetched to explain for others to understand. dont let people crush your spirits & beliefs, go with the flow with believing & see how deep it gets by testing to confirm. it has had negative effects from people such as people thinking smurf is a smart ass know it all when finishing peoples thoughts & sentences. yet it gives personal confirmation of what is'nt a misunderstood phenomenan.

naturally smurf is only human & there are times where smurf is wrong but this is so rare to the correct rate that it is pretty overwhelming. tapping into the universal consciouness is a great thing if one can have a good connection with it it is amazing.

sylenth added 12 Minutes and 55 Seconds later...

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

We still aren't aware of the validity of contact highs. Is it simply the sharing of an atmosphere or can one actually start seeing fractals if around LSD users without ever having taken some? It's a subjective area to say the least.

smurf can say with out extremes such as someone seeing fractals whilst around other lsd users that smurf has had straight people including pets dogs & cats getting trashed like a heavy buzz off the energy vibes being released from smurf in a room while on lsd & xtc. how do you explain this?

smurfs dog literally starts running in circles & bouncing off the walls! smurf has asked if the people felt something 'after' checking their actions & they confirmed feeling different. smurf is actually gonna purchase a video camera & record his dog before & while on lsd to show the effects, he has been around smurfs on drugs since a puppy it's as if he has human ways to him he speaks alot too 'obviously not words like we know it' but it is quite extraordinary like nothing ever seen before.

[Nature Boy]

Originally Posted by sylenth

smurf can say with out extremes such as someone seeing fractals whilst around other lsd users that smurf has had straight people including pets dogs & cats getting trashed like a heavy buzz off the energy vibes being released from smurf in a room while on lsd & xtc. how do you explain this?

It's not up to me to explain this. I'm not the one making the claims. Extraordinary claims need extraordinary evidence.

[oggy]

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

Extraordinary claims need extraordinary evidence.

This is the problem, people expect scientific evidence for everything. Some things just can't be explained scientifically "yet".

For instants, how do you explain how a bee can fly following the same path in mid air? It doesn't use a satellite navigation's system, it just knows. Many more things like this that science will just have to accept and maybe just start to understand that there is an intelligence behind it all.

oggy added 33 Minutes and 29 Seconds later...

Telepathy is possible without Psychedelics. Mirroring http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S57lr...eature=related Emotion and thoughts can be passed on not words. Because you's were doing the same thing your subconscious mind would be connected. Did anyone watch the opening of the olympics? The 100's of drummers were all connected this way.

[ADVOR]

The following paragraph was written by some crazy man calling himself "SWIM". This SWIM fellow wrote it about three years ago, more towards the beginning of his 'drug career'. Before psychedelics.

Originally Posted by SWIM

Personal effects of marijuana, overall change in consciousness due to marijuana usage, and philosophy reguarding human personality and physical appearance.

It's too hard to explain how exactly marijuana changes the way my mind thinks and works, but I guess I'll try. When I first started to smoke marijuana, it seemed like it was just something to do. When I got high, I felt a body buzz, and happiness, laughter, etc. After a few years of marijuana usage, and a very horrible experience with marijuana, my brain acts differently when under the influence now. Now, I seem to think in more than one dimension. It seems I can actually interpret other people's personalities and thoughts just by seeing their face. It's not even just people in my direct area either, it's also people on the televison or computer. I used to notice this slightly before I started using marijuana as heavily as I do now. For example, I used to play video games with my friends, and I'd notice something on the game that seemed neat, or the like. As I was about to mention it, I could feel the thoughts from my friend's head thinking exactly the same thing as I. I KNEW he was thinking of the same thing I was. Also, marijuana gives me new realizations on things that aren't usually recognized. I know for a fact this is not just with me, though, because my friends claim the same things I do. For example, when we are high we will notice things like gaps in the television program between commercials or awkward breaks in conversations between characters. When we aren't high, we won't notice these things. But when I get high, I look back and say, "Hey wait, why didn't I notice that gap before?". Within the past few months, I have acquired a new realization of reading people's personality through their face, facial expressions, reaction to certain social interaction, etc. It seems I can make note of their intellect, social skills, and jsut overall personality just by seeing them. I have done this with people I have never seen or met before, and it seems that I am almost always right about it. It's almost scary, that I can see this sort of thing. I have also noticed that there are only a limited number of personalities, or at least in my opinion. This is the part that is hard to explain, and my writing skills are not good enough to explain this perfectly, so please try to understand: I believe that people have different aspects to their personality and overall life. Like there are 1000 different aspects to any given person's personality, and each of those aspects has a few choices to pick from. For example, one aspect could be shyness, and in that aspect, there are 5 or 6 different choices for how shy someone is. Obviously this is just an example, because shyness can be cummulated from many different aspects. But hopefully you can understand what I mean by that. Now I have noticed that a person's physical appearance is directly related to their personality. I can't explain this very well, but I can give an example: Someone who is very shy may look similar to someone else who is very shy, but someone who is very outgoing would look different from a shy person. Now I know this is very rough and I can guarantee that the ideas expressed will change within a few months, probably a few weeks. With increased marijuana use and increased observation of human nature, maybe I can come to a conclusion, but until then, please use this knowledge for your benefit, whether it may be agreeing or disagreeing with me. Thanks for reading.

Reputation Comments on this post:

	keep believing in urself & unleash the good
	Excellent post. Marijuana is a wonderful thing. :cool:

[Xtaldoc]

This is, indeed, an interesting debate. Swix has has his own unexplainable instances of 'apparent telepathy', both while in a psychedelic state and when in a 'normal', but anxious, state..... The problem is, of course, is that my own observations are heavily colored by subjectivity, albeit 'shared' by the other person, as well. Given that the psychedelic experience is often accompanied by a push toward empathy that is neurochemically driven and considering the adrenal oriented "fight or flight" stimulis/response loop - it begs the question: "Since adrenaline first creates the feeling of panic and the desire to fight or flee but ALSO simultaneously operates on another level to grant nearly a super-human, but temporary, ability to amplify one's abilities in those areas.... could it not be the same with empathogens; with the neurochemical symphony that gives rise to the powerful desire to empathize might also, in some related fashion, amplify ones ability to 'connect'? I realize I'm out on a limb here, but if anyone cares to research; back in the 60's there was a book written by a neuroscience researcher with a long and hard (for me) to pronounce name (from India, I believe) entitled, "Beyond Telepathy". In this book the author postulates that both sending and receiving, in telepathic episodes, may be mediated by the cholinergic system. To that end he set up a series of experiments wherein 'receivers' were dosed with a specified decoction of 'Amanita Muscaria Tea' to create a state of "anticholinergia" to enhance reception. Senders were dosed with a cholinergic drug like Bemegride (I think that was one used) in an effort to create a state of "cholinergia" and enhance sending ability.... He claimed to have some success in these experiments, as well. The subjects were then tested for enhanced performance in the stated areas; both in concert with each other and independant of each other. Remebering that this WAS the 60's and that the air was frequently abuzz with this subject matter, I make no claims as to its validity - but it struck a chord then and it still lingers in my mind. Maybe it bears another look within the context of current work? Hope this helps. X - Out.

Reputation Comments on this post:

	Thanks, was thinking of trying Muscaria.
	thanx 4 the info

[sylenth]

yeah inner science that the brain produces naturally is a science of it's own & there is clear differences between brain damage & a healthy utilised brain. from back in the day of humans using a small percentage of their brains to nowadays percentage rate increase... so until their is a device to predict the acuracy of ones mind & brains sciences there is going to be alot of sceptism going on.

our technology is nothing in the bigger picture of things.

[lostmente]

Swim seems to have the ability to force people into 'psychic linking', perhaps its a state of hyper observation caused by insecurities in both swims self and those around swim.

The effects of psychedelics one ones body language could be plausible for the extent that telepathy can be observed (eg basal ganglia which controls unconscious action is heavily influenced by cannabis). Drugs seem to increase swims use body language, and tension accents of those actions.

The common theme swim has seen with telepathic action is this

1. The person being read is drawing the reader in, some call it drawing attention to yourself (being paranoid?) or perhaps an inverted energy field that feeds of those around it.
2. The reader can justify their action within the aware peer group, and thus reap the rewards of turning someone into a spectacle thusly.
3. A reader is limited to their awareness of various thoughts, the more apt the readers observation, the more important that thought is to the reader.
4. If you are aware of someones thinking and they are not aware of it, then there is bound to be someone doing the same to you.

[Panthers007]

Psychedelics increase one's awareness to normal processes within the psyche. This includes such phenomena as telepathy. A friend of mine said it best - "I think it's more like an atrophied muscle." - as regards the ability to communicate without words. Perhaps it's a leftover from earlier times before the development of language. One needed to warn the family there was a Lion approaching. But one can't talk. So...through a biological process ingrained in the survival-instinct, one conveys the knowledge without speech.

This no doubt happens all the time. Only difference being that under the influence of mind-expanding molecules - one becomes aware of this. There is a broad and uncharted territory within the mind. This is what psychedelics prove. In my opinion the best bet is to note these things/events, but don't over-dramatize them. If one is utterly distracted by one finding then one may not notice other events that are at play. Just keep an open mind.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Great post. :cool:

[Nature Boy]

I don't think telepathy is the correct term though. I think it may be a heightened sense of awareness in the actions of others, such as how you might read facial expressions more deeply for example. Reading another's body language to witness fear or playfulness. These are the same instincts all animals use as they investigate, hunt and run for their lives. To call it telepathy, you would literally need to read exactly what is inside someone's head. We have mechanisms that allow us to read mood but we can't, for example, access someone's memories or directly read their thoughts. There's potential to what the psychedelic experience can do but I definitely think it has its limits as far as some of the more massive claims.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Very well stated. :cool:

[podge]

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

I don't think telepathy is the correct term though.

I can understand your lack of belief in anything apparently mystical, but dont allow your own preconceived notions drive your curiosity away.

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

I think it may be a heightened sense of awareness in the actions of others, such as how you might read facial expressions more deeply for example. Reading another's body language to witness fear or playfulness. These are the same instincts all animals use as they investigate, hunt and run for their lives.

Reading somebodies body language is a very different thing then what is considered telepathy. Body language cant account for people knowing what people are going to say before they say it, free will makes it clear that this far more than just coincidence.

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

We have mechanisms that allow us to read mood but we can't, for example, access someone's memories or directly read their thoughts.

But many people would disagree with the use of "we" , it would be fairer to say that "you" dont believe that "you" can access somebodies memories or thoughts.

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

There's potential to what the psychedelic experience can do but I definitely think it has its limits as far as some of the more massive claims.

But would swiy consider that swiys perceived limitations might be as a result of swiys limited experience and may not fully encapsulate the full capabilities of what psychedelics can do ? For example, has swiy ever tried to access telepathic powers while tripping or would he expect it to just spontaneously happen for him and/or everybody who takes a psychedelic?

Most people would argue that taking the substance isnt nearly enough, the psychonaut must have knowledge or certain intentions going into the experience if they hope to access information otherwise unattainable.

For example the Shamans in the Amazon dont just take Ayahuasca and come back with information for the tribe regarding health,weather, the future etc, they are trained for many many years to use the substance in such a way where they learn to develop control over it and the realms which it gives one access to.

The experience in itself is likely to not yield much for the average joe soap other than deep introspection and visual distortions , its what the user can do with the experience .

[Nature Boy]

Originally Posted by podge

I can understand your lack of belief in anything apparently mystical, but dont allow your own preconceived notions drive your curiosity away.

I am curious about this subject but believe the answers are obtainable and are outside of this notion of mysticism. When I hear the word mysticism, I hear - "lacks credibility/avoids examining". That, to me, is the closed-minded approach.

Originally Posted by podge

Reading somebodies body language is a very different thing then what is considered telepathy. Body language cant account for people knowing what people are going to say before they say it, free will makes it clear that this far more than just coincidence.

The limits of language can allow us to predict what someone might say. I don't think there is anything remarkable in this because it's more common amongst people who use similar colloquialisms, are around each other more often and have similar interests. To put the theory to the test, I would have to write a random sentence down and you would have to guess it. No-one can do this.

Originally Posted by podge

But would swiy consider that swiys perceived limitations might be as a result of swiys limited experience and may not fully encapsulate the full capabilities of what psychedelics can do ? For example, has swiy ever tried to access telepathic powers while tripping or would he expect it to just spontaneously happen for him and/or everybody who takes a psychedelic?

I would liken SWIM's search for telepathic powers to attempting to walk through a brick wall. First of all it cannot happen, and second of all there are no means to begin at attempting the impossible. Sorry, but closing your eyes really hard and making wavy motions with your fingers is just the same as sitting there and doing nothing. You have no reason, other than people's reported personal delusions, to believe that this can happen. Correct me if I'm wrong.

I think there's a lot more to this experience than what people describe as telepathy. That obscures the truth, ridicules it and makes it more difficult to pinpoint what may turn out to be an incredible discovery.

Originally Posted by podge

For example the Shamans in the Amazon dont just take Ayahuasca and come back with information for the tribe regarding health,weather, the future etc, they are trained for many many years to use the substance in such a way where they learn to develop control over it and the realms which it gives one access to.

The experience in itself is likely to not yield much for the average joe soap other than deep introspection and visual distortions , its what the user can do with the experience .

You see, I don't think that's valid. Shamans don't exactly work on an evidential basis therefore their opinions, and let's not forget that they are just opinions, are ultimately not that different from Joe Soap. I would liken it to someone who declares themselves as a pastor simply because they happen to attach themselves to a certain code of beliefs that is actually accessible to everyone (should they want). Obviously shamanistic rituals can lead to introspection and perhaps even practical inspiration but this isn't limited to peoples that have used psychedelics for centuries as sacraments. To say so would be unscientific, in terms of genetics at least, maybe even a little bit racially prejudiced.

[podge]

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

I am curious about this subject but believe the answers are obtainable and are outside of this notion of mysticism. When I hear the word mysticism, I hear - "lacks credibility/avoids examining". That, to me, is the closed-minded approach.

Those ARE the preconceived notions which you have to forget about.

Again mysticism is a term used only because the scientific model is outdated and is showing its weaknesses, in the newer models of reality, mysticism = explainable scientific phenomenon.

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

it's more common amongst people who use similar colloquialisms, are around each other more often and have similar interests.

But what bout the people it happens to who dont know each other and who arent friends. And even among friends body language and experience together doesnt simply point to coincidence, its seems like people who are friends tend to be on similar wave lengths (maybe even quite literally) so therefore are more likely to tap into each other thoughts.

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

To put the theory to the test, I would have to write a random sentence down and you would have to guess it. No-one can do this.

But having never sought out someone who has attuned these abilities and put it to the test how can you be so sure other than relying on your preconceptions or what is and is not possible ?

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

I would liken SWIM's search for telepathic powers to attempting to walk through a brick wall. First of all it cannot happen

Well in the quantum world walking through a wall isnt impossible, just highly improbable. And im afraid your first assertion doesnt stand up to the scientific method.

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

and second of all there are no means to begin at attempting the impossible. Sorry, but closing your eyes really hard and making wavy motions with your fingers is just the same as sitting there and doing nothing.

Again your projecting your own notions of how you would imagine such a feat should or could not be attained, and a bit overly sarcastic for necessity too.

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

You have no reason, other than people's reported personal delusions, to believe that this can happen. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Then stand corrected. Iv had quite a few strange experiences which i couldnt just explain away as delusion although i did try for a long time. And if i recall correctly, did i or did i not tell you the precise moment when that game of cards was going to be won the other night... not saying im psychic but its doesnt mean it was simply coincidence either

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

I think there's a lot more to this experience than what people describe as telepathy. That obscures the truth, ridicules it and makes it more difficult to pinpoint what may turn out to be an incredible discovery.

Im in full agreement, there is a lot more to this subject than just accessing information through apparently impossible means. But id wager its you who doesnt realize how much more their really is to it.

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

You see, I don't think that's valid. Shamans don't exactly work on an evidential basis therefore their opinions, and let's not forget that they are just opinions, are ultimately not that different from Joe Soap.

How can subjective experience be put into evidential form in a way that would satisfy you ? I would argue speak to the people who have benefited from the work of the Shaman and re-evaluate your opinion based on that. Also remember the Shamen have been practicing their arts for a long time, their successes are well documented. Your belief or lack of in the matter is a far more inconclusive than their results.

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

I would liken it to someone who declares themselves as a pastor simply because they happen to attach themselves to a certain code of beliefs that is actually accessible to everyone (should they want).

A very bad likeness most would agree. Its like comparing football and formula 1, technically they are both sports but in reality they are completely different. Shamanism and christianity share a title of belief system but other than that in practical terms are completely different. Atheism is also a belief system but i dont see anyone comparing the details of it to a religon.

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

Obviously shamanistic rituals can lead to introspection and perhaps even practical inspiration but this isn't limited to peoples that have used psychedelics for centuries as sacraments. To say so would be unscientific, in terms of genetics at least, maybe even a little bit racially prejudiced.

How exactly is comparing a user of psychedelics to a non user a racial statement ? If anyone is focusing or hinting at a racial implication it would be you. And also lets not forget Shamanism isnt just an Amazonian phenomenon, it goes back to cultures all over the world which share completely different ethnicities.

Also id like to point out at this stage, Francis Crick , nobel prize winner, who claimed his first insight into the structure of DNA was while under the influence of LSD. That information was apparently unknown to anybody at that moment in time so he didnt deduce it from anybody else body language, he appeared to access a hidden channel to a profound wisdom. Or can that simply be explained away as unimportant or something like

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

closing your eyes really hard and making wavy motions with your fingers in the dark

?

[Panthers007]

I agree that the term 'telepathy' is misleading. We may have developed language, which separates us from other animals, but it's a work in progress. The more we refine language, the less we will need to rely on ambiguous terms - such as 'telepathy.'

[lostmente]

alot of the mystical experiences are closely related to detachment from reality...psychotic thought patterns. Something that is far older than drugs and has capacity limited only by the individuals willingness to let go of things that keep them attached to the human condition. Perhaps the illness comes in when they innapropriately change their attachments to reality.

This is not something that is new or particular to modern thought and drug consumption. Some psychosis specialists believe that early on in the development of human existance we were all psychotic and that normalacy was established because people just were not happy. That would be the majority of peoples take on psychosis, some would have indulged greatly.

lostmente added 2 Minutes and 54 Seconds later...

Originally Posted by Panthers007

I agree that the term 'telepathy' is misleading. We may have developed language, which separates us from other animals, but it's a work in progress. The more we refine language, the less we will need to rely on ambiguous terms - such as 'telepathy.'

looking back through technological/social/spiritual advancement...is there a pattern?

belief, faith, understanding. All seems to depend on where you stand at the time.