Dose - 5 Methadone pills to kick heroin

[Nahbus]

SWIM and his girlfriend go on heroin binges that last about a month. They really don't use too much, and usually snort it. Anyway, they are acquiring 10x 40mg methadone pills to help them come off.
SWIM doesn't know the best way he should do this as he has never used methadone.
He was thinking:
Day 1 - 40mg
Day 2 - 40mg
Day 3 - 20mg
Day 4 - 20mg
Day 5 - 20mg
Day 6 - 20mg
Day 7-10 - 10mg

Do you think this will be sufficient? Is 40mg enough? Is one a day enough (I read that it lasts up to 36 hours)

He also has valium, which he plans to take after the methadone. Hopefully it will be a nice smooth transition from dope - methadone - valium - clean

Any suggestions for a better solution with 5 pills? will 20mg be enough for a full day? Maybe he can extend them a bit longer.

Any help would be great! SWIM thanks you all.
Thanks!

[jennmkillgore]

Hi there. I was a little concerned when I read your post. I commend you for wanting to get better, but what you are proposing is not the way to do it. If you try it in this fashion, you will still have terrible withdrawals that can last anywhere from 28 days to 6 months. I have been on Methadone Maintainence for six years successfully and I have done tons of research. Most experts agree that you need to be on Methadone for at least 2 years so as to get your body stable and get your life back on track. Then, they can help you ween off of it correctly to where it won't be nearly as hard as what you are about to do. I know two years seems like a long time, but you didn't get sick with this disease of addiction over night and you aren't going to get well overnight either. I stress this because the chances of relapse are extremely high for those that don't have some sort of support system in place. Most of the time the withdrawals are just so severe, that most end up using just to stop the pain. I don't want that for you or for anyone!! I do hope that you will consider what I have said. I'm not a doctor, only someone that has been through this first hand and has lots of experience and knowledge on the subject. I will be praying for you and I wish you the best of luck. Please know you can contact me anytime if you need to. Take care and God Bless!!

[msmogadon]

SWIM is currently doing a methadone detox to get off heroin. SWIM has posted a link to the thread describing the amounts recommended by SWIMs doctor.
www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?p=450739#post450739

SWIM thinks SWIY maybe needs to cut down a lot sooner rather than staying on the same amount for so many days. SWIM is on day 4 today and is feeling good

SWIM realises that SWIY is using tablets and may find it difficult to measure the doses so accuratley. So perhaps get SWIY to aim for something as close as possible

[Nahbus]

Wow I really appreciate your concern and care for SWIM. He currently does not have a "problem" though. For the most part he is very responsible, and doesn't let himself get too far down the path.
I don't understand how this will yield more withdrawls than if he just weened off dope by itself.
SWIM doesn't have a disease or anything, he just wants to not feel cruddy when he runs out of dope and figures replacing it with methadone, then easing off the methadone would work.
How would this method give SWIM 6months of withdrawl?
It's not like SWIM has been on dope for months or years or anything, he just wants to avoid the crappy feeling as if he stopped abruptly.

[Spare Chaynge]

methadone is a powerful opiate.. If swim were to use methadone and not be extremely addicted to opiates it would rock his world and lead to further opiate addiction. Keep in mind methadones long half life makes withdrawls from this drug longer than heroin. And more painful for this swim.

[chillinwill]

Originally Posted by jennmkillgore

Hi there. I was a little concerned when I read your post. I commend you for wanting to get better, but what you are proposing is not the way to do it. If you try it in this fashion, you will still have terrible withdrawals that can last anywhere from 28 days to 6 months. I have been on Methadone Maintainence for six years successfully and I have done tons of research. Most experts agree that you need to be on Methadone for at least 2 years so as to get your body stable and get your life back on track. Then, they can help you ween off of it correctly to where it won't be nearly as hard as what you are about to do. I know two years seems like a long time, but you didn't get sick with this disease of addiction over night and you aren't going to get well overnight either. I stress this because the chances of relapse are extremely high for those that don't have some sort of support system in place. Most of the time the withdrawals are just so severe, that most end up using just to stop the pain. I don't want that for you or for anyone!! I do hope that you will consider what I have said. I'm not a doctor, only someone that has been through this first hand and has lots of experience and knowledge on the subject. I will be praying for you and I wish you the best of luck. Please know you can contact me anytime if you need to. Take care and God Bless!!

SWIM doesn't think that by using methadone for 10 days is going to cause a whole lot of withdrawal from the methadone....also, SWIM doesn't think that it is neccessary to be on methadone for 2 years....it all depends on the individual and how bad their habit is

SWIM believes that if the OP has been using for only a short time that this plan should work but just watch out for an addiction to methadone(which staying on it for 2 years will certainly cause one)

[Nahbus]

Yeah, thanks.
I don't think SWIMs problem is becoming too addicted to any opiate, he can handle opiates pretty well. His main concern is just avoiding the body soreness, lethargy, grumpiness, and overall crappy feelings he gets for 4-5 days after about 2 weeks of using heroin.
SWIM will probably start lower than 40mg, maybe even lower than 20mg - just to see how it effects him and to see if such a low dose could stave off withdrawls.

Again, addiction is not an issue, SWIM is just wondering if switching to very low doses of methadone (and weening off the methadone) will stop the withdrawls from 2 weeks of dope coming on.

[chillinwill]

SWIM thinks by using the methadone the way SWIY described will work...SWIY might still feel some lethargy and depression once the methadone is gone but it shouldn't be too bad and the worst of any physcial withdrawal SWIY will have will be gone by the time the methadone runs out

[Nahbus]

Ok, SWIM figured this was his best option. He will start at 10-20mg first, and try to take as little of a dose as possible, just so he doesn't feel crappy. When the methadone is gone, he has plenty of valium to curb his anxiety and tension.
Also, should methadone be taken once a day or maybe in the morning and at night? It has a long half-life so SWIM is assuming once when he wakes up every morning should suffice.

Thanks for the help guys. SWIM appreciates it.

[chillinwill]

SWIM would take it once a day in the morning....like SWIY stated, methadone has a long half and therefore would only needed to be taken once a day

[itchypolarbear]

swim has been doing heroin for years and has been on methadone for about 3 months, swims not a doctor but feels this experience qualifies him to have an opinion on the matter. anyone who has been through it will tell you the first step to beating addiction is admitting you have a problem. swim knows it sounds cliche' but its true, and if swiy feels like swiy needs to take one drug in order to stop doing another drug then swiy probably has a more servere addiction than swiy realizes.when swim started doing heroin, he had alot of friends with a similar mentality as swiy. most of these people are still putting needles in their arm, still getting sick, still blowing all their money on dope, and still dont think they have a problem. please help yourself before its too late.

Reputation Comments on this post:

great points

[Nahbus]

I can see where you are coming from, but SWIM assures youthere really is not problem. Sure, he does heroin now and then, but he never let's it affect his life in a negative way.
He has an amazing job doin illustration and animation, has a great girlfriend, family and friends.
He does do heroin, but maybe only for a week or two and then stops for a month or so.
He has a good head on his shoulders, doesn't shoot it (although he has tried it, but is smart enough not to do it all the time), and never let's himself do it for more than 2 weeks.
The only reason he is replacing on drug for another is to avoid the couple days of no motivation and exhaustion - mainly because he has a lot of work to do and doesn't want to risk feeling crappy because he won't get as much work done.
He honestly doesn't have a problem, even though it may seem so from his post, and may seem like denial. But not everyone who does heroin is controlled by it and is addicted to it with a big problem.
SWIM is happy, successful, and smart enough not to let heroin control his life. He just likes to enjoy the relaxing, blissful high of heroin once in a while on his free time.
SWIM is glad you are concerned for him, but rest assured, heroin is most definitely not a problem area in his life. He is just an example of the few people who can do dope in moderation and still lead a healthy and happy life.
He is in control, not the drugs

[msmogadon]

But say there was no methadone pills. Then there would be a problem cause SWIY would have to stop cold turkey and then go through the sh*t. SWIM thought it was under control as long as it was always there and she didn't have to suffer illness. But one day the supply will be interupted or money will not be available or whatever and there will be things to do and then it will be a problem

[Nahbus]

Right, SWIM always stops cold turkey when he does dope. I mean after a week of dope it isn't too bad really, just a sore body and a little under the weather, but he gets by with no problem.
He is a smart user and doesn't go overboard. I guess if you want to call that a problem you can, but a few days of icky feeling is what he expects after a few days/week of dope, and it's his choice to go through it
He can handle it and stop when he wants, and he does, even if he had an unlimited supply - he would not keep taking it until it runs out. He's always been really good with opiates. Stimulants are his problem child, and that's why he stays away from them altogether, but that's another story
But trust me, SWIM does not have a heroin problem, nor is he fiendishly addicted to it (sure his body gets "addicted" while he's on it - but he knows when to call it quits and take a break). Nothing to merit going to rehab or anything of that sort.
He just does dope from time to time

Nahbus added 1385 Minutes and 17 Seconds later...

So far, so good!
SWIM has been feeling great, happy, motivated and unanxious.
So far this is how he has been going:
day 1: 20mg
day 2: 20mg
day 3: 17.5mg
day 4: 15mg

tomorrow he will do 12.5mg, then 10, 7.5, 5, 2.5 and maybe an even smaller chunk the next day.

So far it's going very well, and smooth. No bad feelings for SWIM!
Thanks guys.

[Ididnotinhale]

Swim beleives that methadone will just make the withdrawal longer lasting. Swim knows a lot of people who have gotten off methadone by switching to heroin. As others have said when coming off methadone, the withdrawal lasts forever.

Methadone addicts sometimes switch to heroin for a little while then just go cold turkey. Methadone has not been very useful in most cases to come off opiates, it is used more to stop heroin use. Just a replacement.

Either come of heroin slowly over a couple weeks or go cold turkey. It's painful, but quick. The benzodiazepines should help. Also, get a butt load of immodium to keep swiy from loosing all of his liquid and a little bit of marijuana also seem to help.

[Nahbus]

right, but it shouldn't be bad for SWIM if he gets it down to a couple milligrams a day and then stops.. he won't really have withdrawals from a couple milligrams..
SWIM didn't have enough heroin to ween off, which is why he switched to low doses of methadone and immediately started to taper.
He really isn't worried.
Again, SWIM was only on heroin for 2 weeks. Hardly enough to have serious withdrawals. Immediate tapering from 20mg of methadone over the course of about 10 days shouldn't give any withdrawals either.
I suppose SWIM has no experience with methadone, but he highly doubts his method will produce worse effects than he would have if he stopped "cold-turkey" from 2 weeks of dope use.

[BuriedinFrost]

Swim has read most of these posts but here is what Swim has to say about his own methadon experience. Altho he only used heroin once or twice before methadon and was heavily addicted to oxycodone, hydrocodone and morphine, Swim used Methadon pills for almost 2 or 3 months straight.......Methadon rocks your socks and now swim has ran out of methadon and the supplier is dry...swim has been the most miserable he has ever been in his life, his body hurts all the time, you tremble trying to use any of your strength, you wake up sweaty and and shitty and if anyone says as much as "good morning" within the first three hours you're awake, you may very well snap at them, the worst part is the sever Ahedonia >.< swim was only using 15 - 25 mg a day, it's real powerful shit. Be careful dude.

BuriedinFrost added 1 Minutes and 57 Seconds later...

Oh one more thing, if your body isn't used to methadon or has a high tolerance against opiates, you aren't going to need anymore than probably 10mg to start with, atleast thats how it was for Swim but he is a small dude (125lbs) otherwise you'll just be nodding off in a chair, giggling and puking into a bowl and you'll probably have some on yourself as well. >..<

BuriedinFrost added 0 Minutes and 23 Seconds later...

Oh one more thing, if your body isn't used to methadon or has a high tolerance against opiates, you aren't going to need anymore than probably 10mg to start with, atleast thats how it was for Swim but he is a small dude (125lbs) otherwise you'll just be nodding off in a chair, giggling and puking into a bowl and you'll probably have some on yourself as well.

[Zendo]

swim thinks that is a great idea, and close to exactly how swim would bring himself off,
the only change swim would make would be 3 - 4 days on the done, than use the benzoes to curb any nasty feelings for a few more days,

hows it going anyway?