Evolving words a solution to society?

[sylenth]

smurf had a thought. if certain words that society know could change with the times. evolution/revolution then the world would be a better place. less generalising, misconception, judging & classing etc... people are lazy though & figure if some thing works dont change it.

if people were all thinking of the greater good this could of happened already, maybe it has? if so it has only happened in small amounts that can't have a huge beneficial impact like the below first example.

some examples:
here in SA our 'drug stores' as other countries know it, were called chemists a few years ago. the name changed to a 'pharmacy' a while back. as the pharmacy is now a distributor of the drugs being made from the chemists. a chemist back in the day was fine cos things were made in house by the chemist/cook.
.................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ...............
now to help people with their beliefs & have a effect for the well being of humanity/society.
think of these & other words.

drug. this has quite a stigma to it & there is various drugs, so people get judged for it being the illegal ones. yet to have head ache tablets is fine, this is having a natural negative effect.

i strongly believe it should be changed to what is more suited until & if it perhaps gets too much of a stigma or what ever then change it again when due. quick easy example for a illegal drug is it is a psychedelic 'stimulant'. this word will do alot more for peoples views.

the word faith. people get judged on this & get the wrong impressions.
the word god. people quickly think of a person. it's too traditional.
the word religion. people get judged on this & get the wrong impressions.

certain words like love are great cos that creates a good correct thought in your mind.
if one thinks of the word hate & uses it directed to some one it is quite a strong feeling to have to another person. surely dislike is more appropriate depending on the circumstance. so naturally one should think before speaking.

smurf has to throw this one out there. government! the word government can remain unchanged as most peope have the right impressions & thoughts when thinking & using this word & is why things like this idea are'nt in action & have such a negative effect. lol...

i'm sure other swimmers can think of many examples smurf is trying to make a point of... post your views here if you agree, smurf can think of alot more words to post.

sylenth added 1328 Minutes and 2 Seconds later...

it's a long shot but the education system is'nt at it's best that it can be. my opinion.

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	Thanks for being so active =]
	insightful thread

[Mutil]

the word "drugs"...just saying "i do drugs", people will probably think you mean that you use them recreationally(did i just coin a word right there? :P).

this association tends to cause negative reactions. i really hate the fact that recreational/spiritual use of drugs is so frowned upon in modern society.

[sylenth]

Originally Posted by Mutil

the word "drugs"...just saying "i do drugs", people will probably think you mean that you use them recreationally(did i just coin a word right there? :P).

this association tends to cause negative reactions. i really hate the fact that recreational/spiritual use of drugs is so frowned upon in modern society.

yeah! with this word majority of the people assume you abuse them & the worst comes to mind. the word is stale if you wanna call it that 'in my opinion.'

naturally swimmers are open minded & the word drugs is fine to us we haved to bear in mind the people we dealing with daily.

[The Dreamer]

I think ideas and even social structures have evolved. When I look at the mafia and how it operates I see what resembles tribal leaders or early kingships. When I think about the modern idea of love and compare it to what love has been historically I see a marked change. Need for sex, children, food, social status, affection, acceptance and many other things have merged into this one thing.

I don't think that animals love and yet I believe that not so long ago we were all animals. Therefore I believe that evolution is happening; fast. All this helps me when I look at the 'Drug War' going on in the west. Surely, drugs can be a good thing for a healthy mind. They've lost the place they used to hold in temple societies but they're beginning to fill a new one for my cat and others here on the forum. Eventually, this will evolve into something greater that will become an acceptable and even appreciated part of humanity.

[lostmente]

For some people, well a lot of people their change of how to view things is not a gradual process. It comes in waves of popularity, most often their source of ignition is from the media. Media develops buzz words, triggering established responses to generate the desired reaction in the viewer.

Right there is a huge issue, that people are very reactionary. An individual who is informed on the fundamentals of everything pretty much doesn't exist. So instead, people fill in that lack of knowledge with something similar.

Using analogys has its use, but its a tranistion to a better understanding. So most of the time people will combine meanings, issues or what ever. This cover all attitude, that higher order ideas can be summed up so neatly leaves so much to over come.

Mis understanding is the greatest barrier to communication

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Interesting

[The Dreamer]

I don't think that our society's foolishness will last much longer. People have been given a lot of power and we're not very good at using it yet. At least most of us can read now which is a new development. I think there are less conspiracies going on than people believe. Often its just our own foolishness screwing us from behind.

And yes lostmente I agree with the 'buzzwords' point. Ultimately, a new trend in society has to either wait for a new human urge to evolve (several thousand years) or adapt to the use of a preexistent one (very little time required). Several forces within the media understand this and use fear, hate, love, sex, pain, word association exc. to form their own little piece of human nature.

[lostmente]

Can't recall the exact nature of this knowledge (picked up somewhere i assume), but evolution seems to come in bursts, the period between 'evolutions' is some what arbitary.

To broaden the scope of buzzwords. It's being on the cusp, if you are the one you defined something...you are the authority.

Take the incandescent light bulb....someone comes to my mind straight away

now, who invented flourescent light bulbs? who cares, those neon signs are UGLY!

[sylenth]

true to all this. it's just that some of us, like 'some swimmers' learn things quicker... but i do see things changing to the better still in my life time. seeing this will be enjoyable, i sure do my bit on trying to educate & spread the word about the benefits of drugs to people & show them how silly they being. eventually our hard work should spread & hopefully pay off...

sylenth added 1 Minutes and 28 Seconds later...

Take the incandescent light bulb....someone comes to my mind straight away

who invented flourescent light bulbs?

good point.

[sylenth]

the thing is majority of people are unaware of the things they are saying on a daily basis with the wrong meanings because of tradition.

another example is the word heart being used with the wrong thoughts. people use it by saying:

'that person has a good heart'................ yeah we all healthy & have good hearts.

'my heart has alot of love'............. no we have a lot of good loving caring intentions from our conscioussness from our 'brain.'

the heart is a muscle not a consciouss emotion, unless the heart is connected to your nervous system which would validate the terms used?

people are also sexist by many sayings used such as 'mankind' it should rather be humankind. we are all equal & this is what creates seperation to many people.

evolution does'nt happen over night though.

[fiveleggedrat]

Physical evolution based on survival instincts is over. As a whole, humans no longer have to fight each other for food.

To "survive" in this world will send the evolution of humanity in a different way. That's why we have so many idiots today. They would have been dead if they lived earlier in history.

For example, a weak, small rich person can easily outlive a big, strong intelligent person who is poor and lives on the streets.

Money is way too much of a factor today...

The only type of physical evolution still happening is random, and not really based upon physical environment.


We have lots of cultural and societal evolution happening, mostly in a downward spiral

Swim agrees also with the "bursts" concept very much.


Aside from the above, Swim believes most people today are close to what most would refer to as a "shell, zombie, asleep, unaware, controlled, etc", meaning more or less, unenlightened people. Swim has only met a handful of enlightened people in person, and a good amount online, for here, example.

Swim believes on average, 90-95% are "asleep" as he puts it. The rest are intelligent, awake, aware of what is going on in this world and of things that are truly important.

A man who spends all his time studying and teaching others about, say, drugs, for example, is closer to "awake".
A man who spends all his time at his pointless job, not caring about others or asking questions, kind of like a solider to the world. He eats, works, sleeps, and fucks just like everyone, but is closed-minded, ignorant, and does not say things like "What is my purpose? How do my actions affect others? Why is...", etc

People who want to learn and ask questions are entirely another class of human if you ask me. Anyone who believes anything they told are essentially worthless as humans, Swim thinks.

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thanx 4 ur input

[Bajeda]

Originally Posted by sylenth

the thing is majority of people are unaware of the things they are saying on a daily basis with the wrong meanings because of tradition.

another example is the word heart being used with the wrong thoughts. people use it by saying:

'that person has a good heart'................ yeah we all healthy & have good hearts.

'my heart has alot of love'............. no we have a lot of good loving caring intentions from our conscioussness from our 'brain.'

the heart is a muscle not a consciouss emotion, unless the heart is connected to your nervous system which would validate the terms used?

evolution does'nt happen over night though.

Most people would understand such expressions as metaphorical. The sayings originated in misunderstanding, but remain because they still have great symbolic power.

Being completely literal all the time would kill all expression in all languages.



That said... I hate the title of this thread.

Makes no sense. Language is and always has been constantly evolving, and society evolves with it. Whether language influences thought or thought shapes language is a question for the ages, embodied in the Whorf hypothesis. How language could ever be a 'solution' for society, or what a "solution to society" is exactly, is beyond me.

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thanx 4 clearing this up. sy.

[sylenth]

Originally Posted by Bajeda

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Most people would understand such expressions as metaphorical. The sayings originated in misunderstanding, but remain because they still have great symbolic power.

agreed 'most people' understand the expression... but for uneducated people growing up in poor areas they have a good chance of having the wrong impression about the heart as used for example, not everyone has the opportunity to go to school. do we want to keep them in their bubble of what they think or to let them have the facts from the start. there can be many other forms of expressions.

Being completely literal all the time would kill all expression in all languages.

yes completely literal would kill the expressions if you know what literal means. other expressions would manifest naturally. there can be many other forms of expressions, more different people not bound by a set understanding.

That said... I hate the title of this thread.

yeah i would of rather named it 'evolving people a solution to society' but people are evolving, just some very slowly & misinformed as posted above by fiveleggedrat people are zombies controlled & pretty unaware. i cant expect much from people, so i'm just thinking of ideas...

Makes no sense. Language is and always has been constantly evolving, and society evolves with it.

i agree for it making no sense, just trying to think of ideas to help disadvantaged communities. the problem is just lack of proper education & communication.

Whether language influences thought or thought shapes language is a question for the ages, embodied in the Whorf hypothesis. How language could ever be a 'solution' for society, or what a "solution to society" is exactly, is beyond me

with saying 'a solution', i did'nt imply it being 'the solution.' if people were more informed from young to understand it would help people to understand things the best they could from as young as possible. but this might seem wrong to some. as kids maybe like to hear that they should eat their carrots as it will let them see better in the dark or god created the earth along with their bible studies.

i'm not in school or have any kids so i dont know what they're being taught. from what i can see society/people need some thing to get them more informed. but with these ideas & there being no forms of communication on a school level for some, they may as well try to figure things out for them selves from what they being taught on a daily basis. just means more slower evolving informed zombies.

[The Dreamer]

I studied Hebrew to some degree. It helped me to understand how words evolve and change over time. I think people often misunderstand how ambiguous language can be.

[Archangel]

I am not sure that I understand what you mean and sincerely i do not even have the time to read all the posts not even all of your original post.
However from the first lines I felt confused ...... maybe coz U r confuzed.
It is not a seen ....being confused is productive as long as it makes you search for new ways to find the answer to your questions.However once it makes you dispare , go into an endles loop of more questions than answer you should let go .If you stop trying (REALY stop trying) the answer might come to you.Even if that stoping means just a little break.
Anyway that was me imposing my thoughts/questions/conclusions and totaly drifting away from YOUR questions/thoughts.
I just wanted to say that you have a fundamental flaw (hope you dont let your ego get angry at me) in your thinking.Words are not an elevated form of comunication,can not be.Language is actualy the most primitive form of interpretation for things that .....are.I' ll give an example that might help , a mother often knows what her child feels without even having to ask.So if you can imagine a mother "seeing" her baby crying or being restles and take him into her arms and he becomes calm.Whta has been comunicated is actualy tha baby "saying" ,I dont know whats hapening,Something is wrog with me,I am afraid and the mother "saying" here,here its alright I love you and we will figure it out.And so much more without even using a single word without even thinking what he ment be that word and in a fraction of the time it would take to do that. No words.
Another reason why language is a primitive form and prone to failure is the fact that it tries to define/limit something that is forever changing and can not be any other way.So even if you spend your whole life trying to perfectly define a concept/object , once you have suceeded(throwing your whole life for just that)you will discover that you have only suceeded in describing perfectly a thing that is frozen in time , not valid nor important for anybody ,not even you.
I am not trying to disapoint you nor say that your questions are sily,far from that.I belive that even the most insignificant questions must be answered if only to let your mind free to find the next question and so on.
And i am not saying your whole quest is stupid either.You probably thought about a higher form of comunication amongst ppl.Maybe telepathy,maybe just plain and simple empathy.Words are not it.




P.s.just took a quick glance over what you all been righting.....just wanted to say that word are not meaning,words are not anything,we use words to comunicate,but words dont even mean comunication.Interpretation of words depends on context,cultural situation,time period ...... to who you say a word and when.If he is upset he will not even llisten.If he is unwiiling to acept, he will think 'what kind of bulshit word is that'.

(God damn it ...editing again and i have to go)
Yes i know that i might be blowing the whole thing out of porportions but this might help out:
Word can not lead to a revolution ,words can not lead to world peace , can not make ppl understand what they can not acept in there hearts,word can not resolve religius diferences coz that is a diference of opinion and not necesarily miscomunication.Words are just words
(shhiittt thats all i had to say from the begining Hahahaha)

[sylenth]

yeah perhaps my flaw is trying too hard. i know i'm a perfectionist & demand answers so i can understand things better. i do not over analyse things too much. just getting views from people to better myself on my path of enlightenment. sometimes a conversation face to face is alot more rewarding than trying to explain things on a forum, but i must dicipline more patience. the whole thing started from seeing how far back our country is with certain things like my example in 'my first post of the pharmacy & chemist sign' taking so many years to change to the correct name.

people just need to learn a little quicker to use the language better with more thought before speaking or doing. i am always expecting too much from people though. as for my ego i dont let my ego get angry with people, as we are only humans & i am not perfect... honesty is the best policy. thanx it appears i am confused & in despair then probably cos of my surroundings.

thanx 4 the replies, maybe i need help instead of helping others. hahahaha. good help is hard to find.

[fiveleggedrat]

Helping others IS helping yourself, if you ask me

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So true

[Archangel]

Dont be hard on yourself
I beleive that there are many ways to find enlightment(And i didnt "coin" this idea either).And I am just a felow traveler waking the same path you do.I needed to know to give meaning also and it is not bad ,just diferent.
Your heart is at the right place ,dont judge others ,theres no point in looking for blaim,even if you find it it can only be your fault.Is the thief responsible for being a thief or are you that you didnt protect yourself beter.It all depends on the perspective.It all depends in what you choose to believe.
For example the old mind game of "who was first,the egg or the chicken".
If your a fauthfull christian it is of course the chicken since the bible says that god created the animals(no mention on egg as far as i remember)
If you are an evolutionist the egg came first of course since the chicken wasnt always a "chicken" most probably it was a dinosaur and dinasaurs (as far as we know) laid eggs.
And if you are a zen budist you'd probably say that: the chicken and the egg exist just in your mind.

Also the part about not being in "touch" with the day and age is something global I think.Ppl are becoming more and more shalow.As more evolved you become its only normal to become lonlier coz there are fewer ppl as higher you get.Its like talking to someone who has been to war ,what could you posibly talk with him if you havent been in one also?talk about the latest tv-series?talk about bills?your day to day problems?its so trivial to him that it doesnt worth the time to talk about it.
Realy now think about it ,you would say that you bought a cool tv that has this and that.What could he say to you?Yesterday I saw my "brother's" head blown off by sniper fire?
It is however your choise to think that you are alone and misunderstood,or you can choose to think that the ppl that understand you are far away or you just havent met them yet.



As for the forum and personal contact I was thinking about the same thing.
I would like to say lets all get together and talk,but the tides of life keep as a part and even if this isnt the best way(as words ) its beter than not at all.
Rest assured that if the forum,thread or anything in life doesnt serve any purpose anymore will just be extinct.

[sylenth]

posted by ARCHANGEL:i do not even have the time to read all the posts not even all of your original post.

I just wanted to say that you have a fundamental flaw (hope you dont let your ego get angry at me) in your thinking

However from the first lines I felt confused ...... maybe coz U r confuzed.

i've edited this post i'm not here to get analysed about things & get negative repped any more for trying to explain who i am archangel especially if you not willing to read all of my posts properly, i appreciate your input as acceptance can be hard at times. i do see what you are trying to get me to realise & i do see the light.... a little overshare there feel the love.

posted by BAJEDA:I hate the title of this thread.

i changed the name to evolving 'words' for what it's worth

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Though young ,insightfull and smart.

[Archangel]

I read what you wrote (also took the time to read the whole thread)and I can tell you not only that I thought that I totaly agree ,I will tell you that I thought "damn thats exactly what I would write not so long ago".
My point is that maybe nobody thinks you are weak , maybe they do see you'r tough as nails and that makes them fear you.And that I thought ,once, is a good thing coz the "bad" ones ,the "unworthy" ones will stay away and I wont have to hurt them for trying to make a fool out of me .......well I found out that some times it kept the ones that where "worthy".
I used to take revenge on the ones that ,I thought ,screwed me over .I didnt do it out of rage or out of furry not even coz It hurt so much giving somenone a chance (thing I rarely did)and they fucked with it.I did it just to make an example out of them for.For "would doers" to see and stay away.And then I would feel bad for what Ive done but I would "bite off a chunk on my heart" and kept walking even when they runned after me still crying from what Ive done to them.And I never stoped walking even if it tore me to pieces.Not only because I am also proud ,not because I am a man(male ego),Not because I always thought I was right to punish them or the punishment wasnt greater than the "crime",nor because I couldnt understand why they would do such a thing.Just because It was my birthright to be happy and It was my obligation to punish them for standing in the way.I was strong and I could take it.
My point is ,and Im probably assuming to much already, that if you can relate......be the beter person and not the strongest coz if your realy strong you CAN take it.Maybe then you'l see ,as I have, that ppl are not all tha bad,they are just ppl.And the only thing that hurts you are your own expectations.
I'm just saying or even beter advising you , even if this word does step all over your ego(it would have on mine ,if somebody sayed that), to consider that maybe the world isnt a worst place than it was,maybe it doesnt even mater if it is...all that maters is what YOU think of it.
Maybe then youll realize that your feeling traped coz you !cant! !!!acept!!! that the world is bullshit (I aint saying it isnt) as you probably now freedom,hapiness,dispair is just a state of mind so, continue your search but dont asume that you are "un-pleased" because the world/ppl/whatever is insuficient (even if this is true,it is just a detail).I promise you that once you acept that the world just !is! you wont have to fight it.You will realise that you where just fighting yourself.
Btw "at peace" personalities REALY pissed me off a couple a months ago.
Also if a moderator hapens to see this thread ,they shouldnt think to delete everything as "off-topic" and just find a beter suited title to it

Archangel added 18 Minutes and 15 Seconds later...

Oh ,again i find myself trying to say more and achieving to say less(another problem with using words).I just thought how to say what I wanted all along.
The teachings tell as that the first true step to enlightment is to ......**ACEPT**
The teachings tell as that the word describing best the human condition is ***SUFERING***

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you way off topic. you dont know sylenth. so read more before assuming.

[The Dreamer]

Hmmm... what has become of this post. My cat has a headache...

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Right on,relief was desperatly needed

[Archangel]

So true.Can some acupuncture help maybe?