Heroin for opiate addiction

[GutterPhenomenon69]

Yes heroin maint. would be an idea but seems as though one would havta keep uping the h dose, more so than the methadone, due to the tolerance issue with H. methadone seems to have somewhat a better tolerance. swim has to up his meth. dose alot less than if he were still using smack. just a thought. this might be one of the reasons that were concidered beforehand with the dea. plus meth./subutex doesn't get one "high" or as "high" as Heroin

[Mr.A]

ya know, ive been addicted to opiates for a while now, currently on MMT. I tried getting on suboxone but couldnt since im on MMT, they wanted me to wait like a week without taking anything then come back and go through a bunch of BS to get the suboxone.

But anyways i voted for suboxone. All of you people who voted for heroin, i think your mixing up the question.

The question was, for OPIATE addiction which would you like to be prescribed. Now to me, this means what would you like to take when you really really wanna get off opiates. If you really really wanna get clean, heroin is of course not the way to go.

Methadone is of course a step in the right direction but methadone in itself is addictive soo..

Suboxone would be the best choice i think because its a lot less adictive and if done right one can come off with little or no wd.

For those of you who voted for heroin, and gave all the reasons why it would be good to have heroin maintenance, its all bullshit. We all know what being addicted is like, its hell. If you could just quit being addicted all together would you not do it? If you could take a pill that made you never have a craving or thought about opiates ever again would you not take it?

If you could have the choice between going to a heroin clinic every day or just not being an addict what would it be?

I dont think that heroin would be the way to go when trying to get clean period.

Mr.A added 10 Minutes and 11 Seconds later...

for people who are just addicted and dont really have a desire to stop getting high fuckin right it would be nice to have a place you could score at legally and constantly. But that wasnt the question now was it.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Watch self incrimination. Make sure to use a pet, a dream, a friend, a crazy grandfather, etc

[ex-junkie]

giving heroin addicts heroin for maintenance is the equivalent of waving a magic wand to rid of the problem, only not getting rid of it as such.

its the easy way out.

its not the governments fault theres such a high crime rate from heroin addicts, and its not their fault that so many addicts lead a fucked up life. the only people who are to blame are the heroin addicts themselves.

im sure many will disagree with such a bold statement, but it is the truth. regardless of whether the heroin makes you behave in certain ways, its still your choice to use it, and to behave inappropriately whilst on it (eg: do crime to support your habit).

also the needle fixation is inside your head.

[nick23]

Originally Posted by ex-junkie

giving heroin addicts heroin for maintenance is the equivalent of waving a magic wand to rid of the problem, only not getting rid of it as such.

its the easy way out.

its not the governments fault theres such a high crime rate from heroin addicts, and its not their fault that so many addicts lead a fucked up life. the only people who are to blame are the heroin addicts themselves.

im sure many will disagree with such a bold statement, but it is the truth. regardless of whether the heroin makes you behave in certain ways, its still your choice to use it, and to behave inappropriately whilst on it (eg: do crime to support your habit).

also the needle fixation is inside your head.

isn't everything?

[dyingtomorrow]

Originally Posted by ex-junkie

giving heroin addicts heroin for maintenance is the equivalent of waving a magic wand to rid of the problem, only not getting rid of it as such.

its the easy way out.

its not the governments fault theres such a high crime rate from heroin addicts, and its not their fault that so many addicts lead a fucked up life. the only people who are to blame are the heroin addicts themselves.

im sure many will disagree with such a bold statement, but it is the truth. regardless of whether the heroin makes you behave in certain ways, its still your choice to use it, and to behave inappropriately whilst on it (eg: do crime to support your habit).

also the needle fixation is inside your head.

You might be interested to read about alcohol prohibition in the U.S. and what came of that.

[chillinwill]

Originally Posted by ex-junkie

giving heroin addicts heroin for maintenance is the equivalent of waving a magic wand to rid of the problem, only not getting rid of it as such.

its the easy way out.

its not the governments fault theres such a high crime rate from heroin addicts, and its not their fault that so many addicts lead a fucked up life. the only people who are to blame are the heroin addicts themselves.

im sure many will disagree with such a bold statement, but it is the truth. regardless of whether the heroin makes you behave in certain ways, its still your choice to use it, and to behave inappropriately whilst on it (eg: do crime to support your habit).

also the needle fixation is inside your head.

So here's a good question. If heroin were legal, would these problems that users have to go through and the lifestyle and choices they make, would those problems still exist? There still might be some problems, but taking out the illegal aspect of heroin takes care of several problems.

[harrygoldfarp]

no suprise there then

[beena]

(Ex-Junkie) .... Well, as for the needle fixation: SWIM doesn't inject so she wasn't speaking for herself when she mentioned it, but SWIM has been addicted to crack-cocaine for nine years now and as there's no physical w/d symptoms caused by crack you could say that crack addiction is all 'inside your head' too and you'd be technically right, but that doesn't make it any easier for an addict to stop or get it out of his/her head. Crack-cocaine is generally considered one of the most (mentally) addictive substances known to man.
Nobody makes another person take drugs so yes, it is the 'addicts fault' and it follows, their responsibility too but I don't think any addict knows 100% what they are getting involved in until it is too late. We can play the blame game but that doesn't really get us anywhere. Personally, SWIM has been an addict for almost ten years now but she doesn't have a criminal record so it is not true that all addicts are thiefs anyway but sure, SWIM has done other things she is not proud of (lied to family and friends to get money, got into serious amounts of debt, etc), but unfortunately a lot of addicts end up committing crime to pay for their habits (and to me that should just go to show how addictive, soul-destroying and evil these drugs really are when they get hold of somebody: what must it take to turn, for example, an otherwise good, A-grade student with a bright future ahead of him/her into a lying, selfish monster that would mug someone in the street for a couple of quid?).
For these reasons, drugs are societies problem and rather than stereo-typing, labelling and criminalising addicts, wouldn't it just be better if we worked out what the best, most efficacious solution is to the problem?
What is the solution? Honestly, I don't know. All SWIM can do is say what her own experiences have been as someone who has used hard drugs for almost a decade and who has tried methadone, morphine tablets and been through cold-turkey - all at different times in a bid to get off heroin (and crack-cocaine too), albeit with limited success.
As SWIM is still battling her demons as we speak she can't say which method is the best: there is no perfect, magic solution obviously, but she can say that methadone caused her some other problems, side-effects initially that heroin didn't: she was drowsy when she first began treatment and every day she woke up with terrible pains in her hips and her shoulders, which was caused by the methadone getting in her joints. She could tolerate this however because if it meant a life free from drugs it was worth it. But she found she was let down by the clinic that provided her with methadone: SWIM had stated when she begun treatment she didn't want to be on a high dose of methadone and that she didn't want to be one of these patients that linger on it for year after year. Her keyworker agreed with her but she later found he was just placating her - as soon as she was on the methadone he started upping her dose, even when she protested. He started to push the date of her starting to reduce her dosage back and telling her that six months (the plan she'd worked out and set herself as a goal to get clean) was unrealistic. SWIM felt she needed counselling and support as well as methadone to prevent her relapsing in the future but all her keyworker was interested in was signing her off each week - he barely had 5 minutes spare a week to talk to her. When she said she was struggling and feared relapse he immediately upped her dose - when she told him she was feeling depressed he again talked of upping her dose (she refused to let him this time), and asked her why she didn't go to her doctor and get a prescription for anti-depressants (SWIM was trying to get off drugs, not get prescribed more). Basically, SWIM was not filled with confidence by the people she encountered during her 'recovery'.
And yes, SWIM did relapse, it wasn't with heroin though but crack (she tried to get support for her crack addiction but hadn't managed to obtain funding at that stage). SWIM took heroin out of habit after using crack and that started the whole cycle of addiction off again. SWIM wasn't proud of herself and isn't going to make excuses: she fucked up basically, end of. When SWIM realised she couldn't just stop again and was continuing to use more and more she decided to stop methadone treatment as she was using the same levels of crack and heroin as she used to use, only now with methadone on top: that couldn't be good.
About a month after that SWIM went away to stay with her parents and decided to use this as an opportunity to get clean. She was able to (illegally) obtain some morphine tablets. As soon as she arrived at her parents she made the switch from heroin to morphine. Because both drugs are opiates there was no w/d whatsoever. She did have to take a lot to begin with but at least she knew what she was taking was pure (no adulterants added by greedy drug-dealers to boost their profits), she didn't have to deal with the aforementioned dodgy individuals and/or risk arrest or criminal prosecution, plus she knew the precise amount and strength of what she was taking. Day by day SWIM was able to cut down or taper her dose of morphine and she suffered no w/d symptoms in the process. Because SWIM was used to heroin, she couldn't say that she was really getting any euphoria or 'buzz' from the morphine she was taking but it was still an opiate and it did have certain mood-lifting qualities.
SWIM thinks this really helped her stop heroin - one of the worst parts of the psychological w/d (cos it's not all physical after all) is that you get depressed, bored and you're head is basically all over the place (plus you can't sleep when that's all you want to do). Morphine helped with all those factors: SWIM still felt really good about herself, got her creativity back (that heroin had zapped), so she was able to get work done during the day, slept like a baby at night and generally felt like a normal person once again.....This is what heroin addicts really need when coming off heavy drugs - ok, so methadone takes care of the physical w/d , but that's not the only problem for an addict - believe me it's easier to ride out the flu-like aches and pains than it is to deal with constant boredom, depression, anxiety, self-doubt, worry and stress, etc, etc.
SWIM did manage to come off both the morphine completely as well as the heroin this way (and as she mentioned before she managed this three individual times). It is a shame SWIM has not had the strength of mind or character to stay off these drugs completely yet: she is hoping this is something else that will come in time.
In the meantime though I think we, as a nation and a society really need to think about the way we view addicts and addiction: do we want to punish people for making mistakes? Or do we just want to give them the best help, whatever that may be, so that they can return to being a functioning member of society with a job, an active role to play, etc, etc?
So what if the addict gets a little pleasure or 'euphoria' off the morphine or medicinal heroin that they are given in treatment? If thats what it takes - if it gets them back to thinking, feeling and behaving like a human being rather than a sickly valetudinarian, a creature of habit, interested only in where their next fix is coming from and who's gonna provide it?

Reputation Comments on this post:

a really good story about rehab and such. glad it turned out OK!

[ex-junkie]

youre missing the point. there ARE alternative medications. its not like addicts have to go without opiates entirely, so any misbehaviour from an opiate addict IS their own fault. its not societys fault.

giving addicts heroin is only prolonging their habit, and prolonging the amount of time they are literally useless to society. sorry for the bluntless here guys, but theres not a huge amount of functioning heroin addicts out there working full time jobs, and being good parents to their kids.

in fact, a lot of them have their kids taken away from them for neglect. really now, theres no need for rose coloured glasses on this topic. we all know how destructive heroin addiction is to peoples lives, regardless of whether there is a constant supply or not.

i can only thank the universe that heroin maintenance was never an option for me, or i wouldnt be sitting here completely clean typing at my computer.

[chillinwill]

Originally Posted by ex-junkie

youre missing the point. there ARE alternative medications. its not like addicts have to go without opiates entirely, so any misbehaviour from an opiate addict IS their own fault. its not societys fault.

giving addicts heroin is only prolonging their habit, and prolonging the amount of time they are literally useless to society. sorry for the bluntless here guys, but theres not a huge amount of functioning heroin addicts out there working full time jobs, and being good parents to their kids.

in fact, a lot of them have their kids taken away from them for neglect. really now, theres no need for rose coloured glasses on this topic. we all know how destructive heroin addiction is to peoples lives, regardless of whether there is a constant supply or not.

i can only thank the universe that heroin maintenance was never an option for me, or i wouldnt be sitting here completely clean typing at my computer.

It might be prolonging an addiction; however, I wouldn't go as far to say that they aren't productive members of society. Red Rock knows several people that maintain high corporate jobs while maintaining a heroin addiction. Red Rock personally thinks that you have a stereotype of heroin addicts. Some of the statements made aren't true for all people.

[OhCasey]

Originally Posted by chillinwill

It might be prolonging an addiction; however, I wouldn't go as far to say that they aren't productive members of society. Red Rock knows several people that maintain high corporate jobs while maintaining a heroin addiction. Red Rock personally thinks that you have a stereotype of heroin addicts. Some of the statements made aren't true for all people.

Of course its impossible to make statements that encompass all members of a certain group and im sure that some addicts of every type of substance can be highly functioning members of society. Its just not the norm for heroin addicts to hold high corporate jobs.

[harrygoldfarp]

I can't understand why anyone would stay on a diamorphine script long term.. unless they really like how it makes them feel. Detoxing even going cold turkey off diamorphine aint so bad it's doable.. Where as its impossible to quit methadone cold turkey and tapered detox is a very long process.

[ex-junkie]

Originally Posted by chillinwill

It might be prolonging an addiction; however, I wouldn't go as far to say that they aren't productive members of society.

most heroin addicts arent productive members of society. swim is glad to hear swiy is a functioning addict, but the overwhelming majority ARENT.

"once other treatments have been exhausted"... a lot of addicts will have heroin on their mind for maintenance from the get go, and will intentionally let all the other methods fail to get it.

Reputation Comments on this post:

	great point
	good point. well made
	no, but they could be - thats the whole point here

[chillinwill]

Originally Posted by ex-junkie

most heroin addicts arent productive members of society. swim is glad to hear swiy is a functioning addict, but the overwhelming majority ARENT.

Red Rock no longer uses because of the fact that he couldn't hold himself together when using. And yes you are right when you say the majority of people cannot be functioning addicts on heroin. However, there are some people that can and that was the point I was trying to make.

[ex-junkie]

Originally Posted by chillinwill

Red Rock no longer uses because of the fact that he couldn't hold himself together when using. And yes you are right when you say the majority of people cannot be functioning addicts on heroin. However, there are some people that can and that was the point I was trying to make.

swim is aware that some people manage to function on heroin.

however, things tend to work in cycles. things can seem so great for yourself at times, but more than often the people around you still suffer. sometimes its the people around you who are more important, and addiction really is quite selfish.

eg: youre child might want some attention, but you got to chase up some gear, and then wack it up in the bathroom for ten minutes, then nod off later on the lounge, or simply not have the enthusiasm to get off the lounge.

so despite them thinking they function well, they actually are not. they might be comfortable, and employed, but sooner or later things will come tumbling down. addiction is like that. its destruction happens in cycles. its like a merry-go-round.

swim doesnt mean to sound condescending, however at some stage you just got to cut the crap. addiction is bad. if one cant stop heroin, then methadone or subutex/suboxone is clearly a better alternative, because you only need to administer it once a day. not 3-4 times a day.

[nick23]

Originally Posted by ex-junkie

youre missing the point. there ARE alternative medications. its not like addicts have to go without opiates entirely, so any misbehaviour from an opiate addict IS their own fault. its not societys fault.

giving addicts heroin is only prolonging their habit, and prolonging the amount of time they are literally useless to society. sorry for the bluntless here guys, but theres not a huge amount of functioning heroin addicts out there working full time jobs, and being good parents to their kids.

in fact, a lot of them have their kids taken away from them for neglect. really now, theres no need for rose coloured glasses on this topic. we all know how destructive heroin addiction is to peoples lives, regardless of whether there is a constant supply or not.

i can only thank the universe that heroin maintenance was never an option for me, or i wouldnt be sitting here completely clean typing at my computer.

I'm an addict.I was on diamorphine for 16 years and am now on IV morphine.I'm also a father,care for my parents,work and pay tax.The whole point is that diamorphine maintence enables addicts to function.

I take REAL exception as being described as useless.

The point you make about other drugs is facile because diamorphine is only rxed AFTER other treatment options have been exhausted.

I'd also like to point out that diamorphine maintenance is cheaper than incarcerating someone or treatment for many IV health related issues.

Edit.Ex junkie,I realise that a lot of recovering users have a extreme/puritanical attitude to drug use.Which they need to maintain to continue with their own recovery,but your last post was ignorance personified and you should be ASHAMED.

Reputation Comments on this post:

	excellent post - the last point was something I was considering after reading her posts
	fantastic post; insightful

[beena]

Originally Posted by ex-junkie

youre missing the point. there ARE alternative medications. its not like addicts have to go without opiates entirely, so any misbehaviour from an opiate addict IS their own fault. its not societys fault.

giving addicts heroin is only prolonging their habit, and prolonging the amount of time they are literally useless to society. sorry for the bluntless here guys, but theres not a huge amount of functioning heroin addicts out there working full time jobs, and being good parents to their kids.

in fact, a lot of them have their kids taken away from them for neglect. really now, theres no need for rose coloured glasses on this topic. we all know how destructive heroin addiction is to peoples lives, regardless of whether there is a constant supply or not.

i can only thank the universe that heroin maintenance was never an option for me, or i wouldnt be sitting here completely clean typing at my computer.

No, I think you're missing the point I was trying to make: SWIM wasn't talking about giving heroin addicts freebie heroin handouts for the rest of eternity so they can just get high and maintain their habit. Quite the contrary: SWIM read a study about a pilot project in Scotland where they used heroin rather than methadone as treatment and it worked better than the latter, accepted standard treatment for addicts in this country. The addicts who were treated with heroin were weaned off it over a period of time (a shorter timescale than the lengthy time it usually takes an addict to get 'clean' using methadone) and the initial results showed a lower percentage relapsed too.
And if you read SWIMs post properly you'd have read that in her own experience morphine tablets have been a better remedy / treatment than methadone. Again, the length of time that an addict would need to take morphine for, as opposed to methadone, is much reduced. And it just seems preferable to the addict (well, SWIM certainly thought so).
All SWIM is saying is that there are alternatives to methadone and she thinks that these should be explored, whatever they may be.

[Spucky]

The Statistics for all European Heroin-Studies show no significant increase of the Dose,
after the Patient get a steady-status!

Also it will be no problem to create a retarded Pill with Diamorphin,
in this case the Patient have to show up only once in a day!

I choose none of the possibility`s, every case is a Individual case!

@ Bad Reputation: Everyone can use a search engine, if swiny use: "Heroin-Projekt, staedy-state" he will find this by him self.
Or look her: http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/...se/chap_10.htm

10.2 Intravenous Heroin
The maximum effect (‘ceiling effect’) from injected heroin seems to be reached with 600 mg / day (Parry 1992). The experiences made within the Prove -experiments in Switzerland confirm the figures from England. Under the direction of Seidenberg in outpatient clinic ZokL2 and in the outpatient clinic KODA-1 under the direction of Hämmig, doses and frequency of injectable heroin were chosen freely within safety measurements made. The dose of heroin is not indefinitely increased. Only rarely is more than one gram of pure heroin intravenously consumed daily, under this free choice-within safety measurements method; the maximum dose is reached, on average, after 6 weeks (Kranich 1994, Hämmig 1996, Seidenberg 1996).
Heroin fixers usually inject 3 times a day. Only a few satisfy themselves with the usual 2 injections a day. Constantly injecting more than 4 times a day is, within opioid-supported treatments with free choice, not common and in fact, illegally only seen in cocktail fixers using cocaine in excess.
The majority of patients experience a pleasant daily pace of varying vigilance and sensitivity. Many feel limited with the feeling spectrum and the dynamics of sensitivities when consuming methadone daily. Heroin fixers and heroin smokers feel this difference in feelings and report of unpleasant effects of methadone in relation to these differences. This feeling of all-always-once, of always being packed in cotton wool, living under a glass bell, corresponds to the pharmacological steady-state-opioid-consumption and is caused physiologically by the permanent occupation of the opioid receptors. Unpleasant as well as pleasant stimuli have no effect. The endogenic opioid peptides rarely reach available receptors in the rewarding system. Steady-state -opioid consumption causes, on one hand, the repression of unpleasant feelings (pain, depression) and on the other hand constant repression of euphoric highs (numbing of mania, anorgasmie etc.).
When heroin is fixed on a regular basis, the effects and side-effects come closer to the effects of the steady-state-opioid consumption. With a large shortening in time-intervals between doses, a noticeable cumulation occurs.
The maximum effect is reached, without a doubt, after the last heroin injection. The concentration lies far under the toxicity limit due to the full formation of tolerance
At half the concentration-effect (a half-life after the last heroin injection), the effect is still at a maximum.
Even when the amount of substance is halved, (after 2 half-life’s), there is hardly a decrease in effect noticeable
Only after a decrease, to an 1/8 of the original concentration (after 3 half-life’s, approximately after one day) does a noticeable decrease occur in the effect
The experiences made in the Prove -Project Janus in Basel show that a the majority of patients have sufficient protection against any withdrawal symptoms when they inject heroin twice a day under the one condition that the doses are high.
Doses close to the effect-maximum lead to a lasting effect which carries on long after the concentration half-life value of heroin: the concentration must only be fractionally sunk before the effect in the steepest part of the dose-effect curve, starts to fall. By administering high doses, one can ensure a reserve of heroin where even in fully tolerant heroin consumers, subjective opioid satisfaction is reached and where there is enough to keep cold-turkey at bay. The toxic concentration area is not reached.
Patients in opioid-supported treatments usually need longer to gain enough confidence to consume smaller doses of heroin. But as long as heroin is injected, these reductions in dose should not be overestimated as success on the way to abstinence. As shown in Fig.27, the flash-effect can be felt even at considerably lower levels. The injections and the flash are, without a doubt, the strongest secondary reeinforcers and encourage continuation of opioid addiction.
The fact that the effect of drugs is limited and is not somehow increased through further consumption is hard for the patients to understand. In the illegal scene, the possibilities of experiencing the maximum effect is limited due to a lack of material. The experience, of comfort and happiness through drugs is only to be found within a limited frame, is therapeutically important and needs to be encouraged as an existential reason.

The most patients in the Prove-Project have never subjectively, received enough opioids in earlier substitution programmes. These earlier experiences are due to a restrictive prescriptive dosing and dispension rules and on the other hand, due to the pharmocokinetics of methadone with it’s inevitable steady-state-consumption.
It seems important for us, for therapeutic reasons, that the patients realise that the possibility to experience the biggest and best ‘flash’ is limited. 'The Flash of all flashes, the Superflash, the paradise is even with the best heroin in the world not achieveable. Either the dose is limited to three injections a day or the effect flattens out. Rules from authorities would prevent or hide the learning effect, important to know for the opioid addict, of this question because arguements about doses cover the sensible truth. The disillusion over the possibilities with drugs to have the effect of a constant comfort is a possible, achievable therapeutic effect with diversified drug dispension. Abstract pharmacological explanations concerning the course of dose-effect and maximum effects is rarely helpful for drug addicts because the perception of the effect of heroin in our patients has become something absolute and vital. Our patients need to learn and experience by themselves the course of dose-effect in order to realise how it works; it is of no use trying to force them.
Psychosomatic complaints and placebo effects are observed with surprising regularity in drug addicts. Small colour changes to different degrees were seen to relate to differences in effect in the various outpatient trial clinics of Prove. Pharmaceutical analyses though, showed only a difference in the heroin content of 1%.

neg. reputation, please go and learn!

Reputation Comments on this post:

Where are these studies. Show your sources.

[electrolingus]

This is quite the thread. SWIM's opioid of choice was usually heroin. He was rarely ever successful in gradually tapering himself off of it without the help of some other type of opioid. SWIM has used methadone both successfully and unsuccessfully to detox. Methadone maintenance offered the time needed to actually stay abstinent for a long period of time and to acquire a more controlled way of life. SWIM personally would only use prescribed heroin as a maintenance drug if he wanted to escape the lifestyle of illegal purchase but was not quite ready to give up the drug its self. Using prescribed heroin to detox from street heroin would most likely not work for SWIM. When SWIM used to quit, he usually wanted to stop sticking himself 10 times just to find a vein to get well in the morning.

Suboxone is really the only thing SWIM would use in the future to detox from heroin. Simply because it worked better than anything else that SWIM had used in the past. SWIM also remembers watching a documentary back in the mid 1990's about prescribed heroin maintenance in the UK. Any other SWIYs ever seen this documentary or something similar?

[tyranny4u]

Heroin for opiate addiction (or Morphine) is superior to Methadone
treatment. Several studies have shown that. TT himself is waiting
for getting Morphine instead of Methadone, the study might start in
July / August. Time released Morphine will be given (just like in Austria).

TT can't accept statements like "I am for Heroin treatment, because
i love the rush". And at the same time he can't accept statements
that say "We (whoever that "we" are) have to help them getting ab-
stinent."

The society has to accept that abstinence does not work for a certain
part of people on Opiates, as it is a process that evolves in these people
and can't be forced. And some of them would need to use Heroin or
Morphine for all their life.

TT is not for giving Heroin as a substitute to kids that are on the scene
for a year or two. But if someone is addicted for 2 or 3 decades and
tried WD at home, at clinics, tried rehab and therapy, then i think it's
time to say "OK, let's see if pure (Dia-)morphine would really help you."
And in many or most cases it will. Often andidepressive medications
that are taken by long time Methadone users would get obsolete, as
Methadone makes people more depressed than real Opiates do.

[mickey_bee]

I strongly believe that prescription heroin should be available to addicts as both a maintenance option, and as a means to becoming opiate-free via dosage reduction.

Although I do agree that ideally one should never prescribe heroin to heroin addicts, and rather one should encourage abstinence and recovery.
However, the world in which we live simply isn't idealistic; it's real, very real.

It's plain for all to see that this idealistic, abstinence-based approach is generally unsuccessful. I don't have the figures to hand, but the majority of addicts who walk through the doors of a drug detox or methadone clinic, continue to walk in and out of those doors for most, (and often all) of their lives.

For some people becoming opiate-free is a very achievable goal, whereas there are others, who, as sad as it may be, really rely on heroin for whatever reason, and will continue to chase it whether it is legal or not.

For both individuals, (and society as a whole), I do believe the most successful option is to prescribe heroin. My reasons are thus;

Swim is currently in a methadone program. While this does greatly reduce the acute withdrawal symptoms, it by no means alleviates the desire to use heroin. As a result of this, both he, and literally every other person he has spoken to at his clinic, use heroin on top of the methadone.
Many continue to use heroin in as chaotic a fashion as before they were prescribed methadone, i.e.- stealing to fund their habit, not being able to look after themselves financially or otherwise, etc.
These people generally find themselves in a worse state than they were before they entered the methadone system. Addicted to not one opiate, but two, with the most recent giving even longer acting and arguably more intense withdrawals.

If heroin was prescribed to addicts, provided they were given realistic doses, they would no longer need to provide custom for illicit dealers.

As heroin dealers, unlike the dealers of many other 'recreational' drugs, rely on the daily, 'addict' customer, (as there are very few occasional users), the dealers themselves would stop dealing heroin. This results in potential 'new' users being unable to obtain the drug, and thus stops the addict population pretty much in it's tracks.
This was observed by studies around the clinic of Dr Marks in Widnes, Liverpool, amongst others.

From the addicts perspective being prescribed a safe, reliable, affordable, and pure form of heroin would dramatically improve their quality of life.
In many cases 'useless' hardcore heroin addicts who had previously spent all their time engaging in crime and prostitution to fund their habit, were able, once prescribed heroin, to get their lives back under control, getting back into regular employment, giving back to society, and improving damaged relations with family and friends.

This is not only great for the addicts' health, and general quality of life, but also for society as a whole.
The majority of petty theft and house burglaries in this country are committed by addicts looking to fund their habit. The drop in crime if addicts were no longer forced to pay extortionate black-market prices for their addiction would be incredible.
The overall saving for society, huge.

As many a recovered alcoholic, or drug addict will tell you; you cannot force a person to get clean, people can only get off drink or drugs when the time is right for them.

In the meantime therefore, why not try and reduce the cost to both the individual addict and society as a whole.

This is not just an issue about the long-term wellbeing of addicts- it's also very much a life and death issue.
It is the illegality of heroin and it's subsequent fluctuations in purity which cause unintentional heroin overdoses.
Current idealistic, not realistic, drug policy is literally killing hundreds of people per year, in England alone. The answer to this is so simple!

Reputation Comments on this post:

	A refreshing approach to this thread. Well said.
	great post, well written and argued
	The answer to drug addiction and recovery is far from simple

[ex-junkie]

marianne faithful has a book called "faithful", in which she speaks of her drug abuse throughout her life. she was on heroin maintenance in the UK for some time, and she spent most of her time in soho sitting on a wall on the nod.

[mickey_bee]

Originally Posted by ex-junkie

marianne faithful has a book called "faithful", in which she speaks of her drug abuse throughout her life. she was on heroin maintenance in the UK for some time, and she spent most of her time in soho sitting on a wall on the nod.

I'm afraid that's a pretty miserable counter-argument.

I'd advise you to do some searches about people who are currently undergoing heroin maintenance treatment, and how it has completely turned their lives around, and, in many cases, saved their lives.

Surely that should be the most important thing in any 'civilised' society.

Dr. Marks' clinic is definetly worth a look, as the local police actually conducted studies around the clinic on it's effectiveness.

Also, as I mentioned in my first post, realistic doses are necessary. I'm not advocating the kind of 'blind dosing' that heroin maintenance was in the 60s.

[ex-junkie]

first of all swim wasnt arguing. she was suggesting a book for anyone interested.

swims point earlier was that addicts will hold out until they get the heroin if it is a 'last resort' to treatment by doctors. hell swim would have back in the day.

think about it. if more heroin addicts have their eye on the prize, then what do they do in the meantime? use more smack, do more crime to get more smack, rather than getting fed up with the maintenance options already available to them and quitting.

admit it. if swiy was on heroin maintenance, he/she would never quit. the addiction to the heroin itself is hard to break. its the lifestyle, the withdrawals, that make people decide to become opiate free. getting prescribed heroin aint gonna rid most of these people of their problem.

gotta look at it without the rose coloured glasses for a second. heroin addiction is self inflicted. there are other maintenance options that work, and there is much more to life than going to a clinic daily to shoot up. thats not productive in the slightest. the only people its 'productive' to, is people who want to waste their lives getting high.

heroin is not cool. it should not be given to people.

[Spucky]

@ above me,

There is a big misunderstand in this Posting, the objectivity is missing!
Some People are not ready to stop Heroin,
(and we have not the Right to decide what`s wrong and bad and what good,)
this People have to be supported until the become ready to quit.

Study`s showed that only People in a stable Mode a ready to quit for a long-term period!
Statistic`s showed after 12,4 Years of Hardcore Addiction this point is reached, more than 80% will quit.