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  #1  
Old 10-04-2008, 21:57
Swing Swing is offline
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How long does methadone block other opiates?

Swim was wondering if it was okay to take his liquid vicodin 4 days after taking methadone. He's heard reports of people not feeling anything even after not takin domes for 7 days!!!

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  #2  
Old 21-04-2008, 18:49
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Re: How long does methadone block other opiates?

A bit late on the reply but it's an interesting question. As i am sure most people know, methadone has a very long half life, up to 72 hours in some cases but about 36 hours is probably normal.

I don't know if this is entirely accurate but i have read that after 3 half life cycles the drug is considered excreted, so if we take Wikipedia's estimate of 36 hours (max) and multiply it by 3 we get about 4 and a half days which sounds reasonable to me.

The 7 day thing could be possible i suppose, but it would depend on how long they have been taking the methadone for and what sort of doses they are taking. Methadone definitely can block other opiates if the dose is high enough because it saturates the receptors.
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Old 17-11-2008, 23:13
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Does methadone block out a bit of a hit of heroin?

swim is a heroin addict who is slowly but surely coming off gear he need to do it at his own pace,he is on methadone and has noticed that its not really affecting him that much were as his friends are goofing on same stuff,is the meth blocking out abit of the hit??please can i get as much comments as possible cheers
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Old 17-11-2008, 23:16
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Re: [b]Does methadone block out abit of a hit of heroin??[/b]

How much are SWIY on mate? SWIM is on 70mls and as our body is used to such a high concentration of opioids/opiates the effect of heroin is greatly reduced.
  #5  
Old 17-11-2008, 23:19
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Re: [b]Does methadone block out abit of a hit of heroin??[/b]

swim is on 80mls of meth, so methadone does block some full effects of heroin??
  #6  
Old 18-11-2008, 00:17
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Re: [b]Does methadone block out abit of a hit of heroin??[/b]

The point of methadone treatment is to raise one enough so they are not getting withdrawal, and it blocks the effects of short acting opiates, to help change one's using habits. At around 80mgs SWIM could no longer feel oxys or heroin.. Methadone fills all the opiate receptors and blocks other opioids when one reaches a certain dose..

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Succinctly put description of methadone's role when in treatment.
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Old 18-11-2008, 00:26
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Re: [b]Does methadone block out abit of a hit of heroin??[/b]

Quote:
Originally Posted by methadone_lad View Post
swim is on 80mls of meth, so methadone does block some full effects of heroin??
That is why then try and get your methadone put down otherwise SWIY have to take large amounts to get an effect like SWIM
  #8  
Old 20-11-2008, 17:38
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Re: [b]Does methadone block out abit of a hit of heroin??[/b]

SWIM is on 60ml and only takes half his/her methadone when he/she knows he/she is going to score.

That way SWIM can feel the gear and doesnt waste the methadone.
  #9  
Old 21-11-2008, 04:20
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Re: [b]Does methadone block out abit of a hit of heroin??[/b]

if methadone is used first it will saturate your receptors as it is fat soluble you r also just toping those levels up more. then useing on top swiy wont feel as much. try useing first then toping up with green if needed. or use less of your methadone and wait longer befor having the gear. also be aware risk of od is increased by useing both.

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  #10  
Old 22-11-2008, 01:35
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Re: [b]Does methadone block out abit of a hit of heroin??[/b]

methadone is made to block out opiates. So yes, it does. However. I would say just come completely off the dope and switch over to the dones man. The first day wont be that great, but the second day when you dose the dose from the day before will still be in you. I dunno man, swim prefers dones over dope. lasts alot longer and easier to get.
  #11  
Old 22-11-2008, 04:32
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Re: [b]Does methadone block out abit of a hit of heroin??[/b]

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeadLegend View Post
methadone is made to block out opiates. So yes, it does. However. I would say just come completely off the dope and switch over to the dones man. The first day wont be that great, but the second day when you dose the dose from the day before will still be in you. I dunno man, swim prefers dones over dope. lasts alot longer and easier to get.
While some of this might be true, IMO, I would switch to Methadone for a short while and then come off of that quickly as trying to detox off methadone can be a major bitch which several threads on here are dedicated to just that
  #12  
Old 22-11-2008, 12:39
adzket Gold member adzket is offline
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Re: Does methadone block out a bit of a hit of heroin?

also methadone is not made to block opiates at all !!! it just saturates so most others if taken after cant bind to receptors.

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correct correction of myth
  #13  
Old 04-12-2008, 21:30
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Re: Does methadone block out a bit of a hit of heroin?

During my methadone treatment I was told that doses over 30mls reduce the effects of other opiates, especially any euphoric effects. And swim can say that is definetly true.
When swim got below 20mls the 'proper' heroin effects came back, and under 15mls it was as if he was taking the heroin straight.
100mls is 'methadone saturation' and you'll get absolutely sod all noticeable from taking heroin.

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Good point about dosage and receptor saturation.
  #14  
Old 04-12-2008, 21:41
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Re: Does methadone block out a bit of a hit of heroin?

even if swim doesnt take his meth,swim the other day dug up a HOLE BAG IN ONE PIN in one go,and didnt really get anything off it was very surprised,swim then drunk his meth after it and still didnt gouch,swim knws that meth and gear can od,but even when he doesnt take his meth he cant get a goof!!his friends all took the same gear,and they all got a hit they arent on meth,anyone else have this problem thats on meth?????
  #15  
Old 15-12-2008, 09:44
Birkill Birkill is offline
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Re: Does methadone block out a bit of a hit of heroin?

Yea swim gets this and he`s only on 25ml although he`s not had any for 2 days so i think he`s guna score a bag today, the dirty cunt!!!

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This adds little or nothing to the thread.
  #16  
Old 15-12-2008, 11:00
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Re: Does methadone block out a bit of a hit of heroin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by methadone_lad View Post
even if swim doesnt take his meth,swim the other day dug up a HOLE BAG IN ONE PIN in one go,and didnt really get anything off it was very surprised,swim then drunk his meth after it and still didnt gouch,swim knws that meth and gear can od,but even when he doesnt take his meth he cant get a goof!!his friends all took the same gear,and they all got a hit they arent on meth,anyone else have this problem thats on meth?????
The way methadone works is, when someone takes their first dose, it goes into the body and begins to fill one's organs, then on the next day of taking the same dose, it finishes filling up the organs and begins to raise one's blood levels. Then, on the third day of taking the same dose, it raises the blood level to the max for that dose, which can be effected by metabolism, etc..

This long acting opioid then maintains an endorphin level, so that if the same dose is taken each day, one's endorphins do not drop to the point of being sick.. When one is stabilized at a proper dose for treatment of addiction, which can vary widely from person to person, depending on their tolerance and metabolism, among other things, then they can often skip a day, without really noticing any withdrawal. The methadone stays in the receptors longer than any short acting opioid, so this causes any short acting opiate transmitters to not bind to the sites, resulting in a decreased or even no feeling at all.

If one desires to use methadone as a supplement, and wishes to remain able to use shorter acting opiates and experience effects, they should keep their methadone dose low enough to keep from getting really sick, but not high enough to notice no withdrawal symptoms, as this is the point where many receptors are full, but not all of them. The shorter acting, more euphoric opiate transmitters can bind to unfilled sites..

As stated above, this dose can vary widely from person to person depending on multiple factors, but for SWIM, when he was beginning methadone, he stopped noticing as strong effects from heroin, at around the 50-60mg level, and by 80mgs a day, he could no longer feel any of what his usual dose of heroin would normally do. At about 40mgs, SWIM wasn't totally comfortable, but noticed that when he used heorin, the effects seemed stronger when mixed with the methadone, than a proper dose of heroin alone..

Hope this helps..
  #17  
Old 17-12-2008, 14:37
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Re: Does methadone block out a bit of a hit of heroin?

yes, it's rght, methadone blocks heroine when methadone is taken in doses
of 20 - 30 ml / mg.
however, SWIM is on 80 mg and tried some dope that hit the area some
while ago, was estimated 70 % at least. SWIM did a hit, and felt a nice
rush, but the effects somehow aren't that strong as when taking heroin
without any other substance. dangerous for newbies is, that they take their
methadone and then start iv'ing heroin. then they say "hey, i feel nothing,
so now let in more of the stuff. that could be lethal...
  #18  
Old 25-07-2009, 05:36
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how much is a blocking dose of methadone?

i am sorry if this has already been answered, i searched the forum and couldnt find anything but i have been told that methadone does not block your opioid receptors yet some people say it does. swim goes to the methadone clinic everyday and is up to 140mg and has noticed that large amounts of herion used interveniously (.5g in one shot) does not have any effect on them at all. where as the same amount would get swim to a nice warm place but now they dont even get a rush... and someone at the same clinic is on 180mg and claims that they still get high off a smaller amount of diesel. i know everyones body is different, it just doesnt make sense to me. could anyone help swim out?

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This has already been covered.
  #19  
Old 25-07-2009, 05:43
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Re: how much is a blocking dose of methadone?

A lot of reports that Red Rock has read say that 70mg is the level at which methadone "blocks" any other opiates. Red Rock has heard reports from methadone blocking people from using heroin as low as 40mg-80mg. Methadone doesn't block like buprenorphine, but instead saturates the opiate receptor sites enough that no other opiate can get through...Opiate antagonists can get through however such as naloxone or naltrexone.
  #20  
Old 25-07-2009, 08:19
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Re: how much is a blocking dose of methadone?

Swim was able to get high on methadone and on buprenorphine (suboxone). He didnt really mess with heroin when on high doses of suboxone but when he got down to lower doses like 2-4mg he was able to do a dime bag of H and feel damn nice. I agree with the whole thing about methadone just kind of taking over. The high for swim was less when on methadone but he still felt it. He got up to 180mg of methadone too and was still using. Who knows though, it may have just been a mental thing for him at that time.
Sorry that this post didnt really give any factual information like what was being asked for. Just thought I would share swims personal experience with what was in question.
  #21  
Old 25-07-2009, 14:09
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AW: how much is a blocking dose of methadone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmunny fo twunny View Post
i am sorry if this has already been answered, i searched the forum and couldnt find anything but i have been told that methadone does not block your opioid receptors yet some people say it does.
Methadone have a strong affinity to the Mu-Receptor (MOR),
afaik a Opioid Receptor!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmunny fo twunny View Post
swim goes to the methadone clinic everyday and is up to 140mg and has noticed that large amounts of herion used interveniously (.5g in one shot) does not have any effect on them at all. where as the same amount would get swim to a nice warm place but now they dont even get a rush... and someone at the same clinic is on 180mg and claims that they still get high off a smaller amount of diesel. i know everyones body is different, it just doesnt make sense to me. could anyone help swim out?
1. it`s really depends on the Metabolism, some People have a strong one
and the Half-life Periode can be low as 7 Hours, other People have a low one and the Methadone stays 50 until 60 Hours in a steady state!
2. also some People have a low and some People a high amount of Enzymes!

But dont feel jealous,
the Feelings from Opioids are only something shitty
compare to the "Real Feelings"!

For more information look for "Nyswander and Dole"

Quote:
Nyswander and Dole based their approach on the theory that, once addicted, opiate addicts suffer from a metabolic disorder, similar in principle to metabolic disorders such as diabetes. Just as insulin normalises the dysfunction in diabetes, so methadone was proposed to normalise the dysfunction of opiate addiction. They argued the necessity for large doses of methadone (80mg to 150mg) to establish a 'pharmacological blockade' against the effects of heroin, that would prevent addicts from experiencing euphoria if they took it.
and here: http://web.archive.org/web/200311202.../section1.html
Also in the Deeps of the DF-Forum is a lot of Information.
Have look into the File Section!



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A very informative post with an apt reference to "real feelings". Well rounded off with citations.

Last edited by Spucky; 25-07-2009 at 14:25.
  #22  
Old 26-07-2009, 17:32
jmunny fo twunny jmunny fo twunny is offline
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Re: how much is a blocking dose of methadone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chillinwill View Post
Methadone doesn't block like buprenorphine, but instead saturates the opiate receptor sites enough that no other opiate can get through
thanks man this is exactly what i was wondering becuase i was told that methadone contains no narcan and was wondering how it still had the "blocking" effect.

haha and im not jealous i have just been wondering about this since i have been on the clinic and thank all of you guys for your help

and spucky i am a little slow but can you explain this to me
2. also some People have a low and some People a high amount of Enzymes!


thanks again guys!
  #23  
Old 27-07-2009, 03:31
Rightnow289 Rightnow289 is offline
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Re: how much is a blocking dose of methadone?

Pacman has been told at clinic blocking starts at 80mls but he has certainly noticed a blockade effect at 70mls. Others also mention blockade effect at much lower doses than 70ls and he is inclined to agree with them.
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Old 27-07-2009, 04:44
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AW: Re: how much is a blocking dose of methadone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmunny fo twunny View Post

and spucky i am a little slow but can you explain this to me
2. also some People have a low and some People a high amount of Enzymes!
Methadone need like all the other Stuff Enzymes to get metabolize!
I am not native in English and it will be very difficult to explain all
this relationships without errors.
I recommend to have a look for "Ligands" (ATM) and "CYP3A4 (Visa-Card), CYP2B6 (Husband) and CYP2D6 (Bills)".

Mmmh, it`s like two Women who want to go shopping to get satisfaction,
both have the agreement to spend a certain amount of Money,
one is in a Shopping Mall and the other one is in a Desert
  #25  
Old 27-07-2009, 09:06
Birkill Birkill is offline
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Re: how much is a blocking dose of methadone?

Swims down to 21ml daily , well will be 18 as of today and the gear dosnt do half as much as it used to!!!

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