Experiences - 5-htp

[Dj-ob]

Hey all
I was wondering if SWIY has had any experiences of taking the 5-HTP supplement while dropping? SWIM wants to know does it have an increased effect on the pills?

[Peppy]

SWIM has experimented thouroughly with 5-HTP and no longer takes it after the experiment sort of ended with bad results. 5-HTP is supposed to "stimulate production of seratonin" (from wikipedia), SWIM would take a dose prior to the big night (on the actual day), along with vitamins. And then would take doses three days post night out. The three days were to cover the day where SWIM would cry at a margerine advert on TV for no reason

1 - SWIM noticed no improvement to the trip when using 5-HTP in this way.
2 - SWIM always watches the diet post trip and would eat bananas, healthy meals, fruit, nuts and vits to get the body back on track.
3 - SWIM noticed increased dizzy spells with the post 5-HTP doses and would suffer more for taking 5-HTP.
4 - SWIM concluded that SWIM was getting enough 'stimulation' from the good diet, bananas and nuts (also supposed to help stimulate seratonin) and the 5-HTP was maybe pushing the brain over its limit of stiumlation and producing dizzyness, after stopping the 5-HTP doses, SWIM no longer has a problem with this.

SWIM never took more than the recommended dose of 5-HTP, this was purchased from a health food store. SWIM thinks this is a personal experience and others may not have the same results, but really thinks 5-HTP is probably just another gimmick from the health food store that in this case did more harm than good. SWIM feels less is better, if SWIM can recover from a night with good food and TLC then SWIM thinks this is better than more artificial medication.

[metalupyour455]

Originally Posted by Peppy

SWIM has experimented thouroughly with 5-HTP and no longer takes it after the experiment sort of ended with bad results. 5-HTP is supposed to "stimulate production of seratonin" (from wikipedia), SWIM would take a dose prior to the big night (on the actual day), along with vitamins. And then would take doses three days post night out. The three days were to cover the day where SWIM would cry at a margerine advert on TV for no reason

1 - SWIM noticed no improvement to the trip when using 5-HTP in this way.
2 - SWIM always watches the diet post trip and would eat bananas, healthy meals, fruit, nuts and vits to get the body back on track.
3 - SWIM noticed increased dizzy spells with the post 5-HTP doses and would suffer more for taking 5-HTP.
4 - SWIM concluded that SWIM was getting enough 'stimulation' from the good diet, bananas and nuts (also supposed to help stimulate seratonin) and the 5-HTP was maybe pushing the brain over its limit of stiumlation and producing dizzyness, after stopping the 5-HTP doses, SWIM no longer has a problem with this.

SWIM never took more than the recommended dose of 5-HTP, this was purchased from a health food store. SWIM thinks this is a personal experience and others may not have the same results, but really thinks 5-HTP is probably just another gimmick from the health food store that in this case did more harm than good. SWIM feels less is better, if SWIM can recover from a night with good food and TLC then SWIM thinks this is better than more artificial medication.

SWIM used 5-HTP for the first time this weekend along with vitamins. He took 30 mg of 5-HTP the day of it, and the day after. SWIM noticed that it did help him recover better from rolling, and that it was overall effective. SWIM isnt sure why it did work for SWIY, but to the threadstarter, SWIY should try it out and see how it is. However, if SWIM were SWIY, he would try it after rolling and hte day after, and see what happens. SWIM does not think that this is merely a cheap gimmick, or else many other ravers would not have agreed with 5-HTP (the people who told SWIM to try 5-HTP).

[Dj-ob]

Thanks for your responses guys

SWIM was originally thinking of taking 5-HTP in order to restore his serotonin levels after a session on pills. But after SWIM learned about 5-HTP's psychoactive action, it was believed that an artificially high supply of 5-HTP causes the brain's serotonin-producing neurons to increase production. Increased serotonin production then leads to increased serotonin release.

SWIM then thought if theres more serotonin available by taking a high dose of 5-HTP, then maybe if a high dose was taken a couple of hours (or however long the absorption period of the body is) before SWIM was to take pills, it could possibly lead to a more intensified trip / heightened state of euphoria?

SWIM is uneducated when it comes to chemistry, but it just seems to make sense

5-HTP = More serotonin being produced
MDMA = Releases this serotonin

[KyleM]

Originally Posted by Dj-ob

Thanks for your responses guys

SWIM was originally thinking of taking 5-HTP in order to restore his serotonin levels after a session on pills. But after SWIM learned about 5-HTP's psychoactive action, it was believed that an artificially high supply of 5-HTP causes the brain's serotonin-producing neurons to increase production. Increased serotonin production then leads to increased serotonin release.

SWIM then thought if theres more serotonin available by taking a high dose of 5-HTP, then maybe if a high dose was taken a couple of hours (or however long the absorption period of the body is) before SWIM was to take pills, it could possibly lead to a more intensified trip / heightened state of euphoria?

SWIM is uneducated when it comes to chemistry, but it just seems to make sense

5-HTP = More serotonin being produced
MDMA = Releases this serotonin

Yes that does make logical sense in general. A few things to keep in mind: The recommended doses of 5-HTP (what the bottle says to take) are normally just to slightly elevate one's serotonin levels, it was not labeled to be a fix for the massive serotonin depletion caused by MDMA. With that being said, a few small doses of 5-HTP may not make any significant difference to SWIY's next MDMA experience other than placebo effects. Higher doses for a longer period of time may be more beneficial. To add to that, much 5-HTP is converted to serotonin before it reaches the brain, meaning much of it is wasted. Higher doses/longer period of time will guarantee more eventually will become serotonin inside the brain.

This topic is really debatable because some people get diminished MDMA effects (or think they do) after 5-HTP, when at least scientifically it would seem higher serotonin means more for MDMA to release. It has not been proven why some get these results, but SWIM thinks the reasons are: excess serotonin in the transporters preventing MDMA from freely accessing them. SWIM believes this can be remedied by either slightly increasing MDMA dosage or taking in a way that allows for faster/higher absorbtion, as MDMA does have greater affinity for the transporters than serotonin so it may take a little more MDMA to to take them over. Another possible reason is that increased serotonin can downregulate serotonin receptors, with or without MDMA, especially if one already has significant downregulation. The lowered levels of serotonin after MDMA are partly responsible for the re-upregulation of receptors after MDMA, so 5-HTP may slow down or prevent that re-upregulation. Expectations could be another factor; one takes 5-HTP and expects a great roll and doesn't get it and then says 5-HTP doesn't work. SWIM has had excellent results with 5-HTP and can vouch for its effectiveness, but everyone is different of course..

[metalupyour455]

Originally Posted by KyleM

Yes that does make logical sense in general. A few things to keep in mind: The recommended doses of 5-HTP (what the bottle says to take) are normally just to slightly elevate one's serotonin levels, it was not labeled to be a fix for the massive serotonin depletion caused by MDMA. With that being said, a few small doses of 5-HTP may not make any significant difference to SWIY's next MDMA experience other than placebo effects. Higher doses for a longer period of time may be more beneficial. To add to that, much 5-HTP is converted to serotonin before it reaches the brain, meaning much of it is wasted. Higher doses/longer period of time will guarantee more eventually will become serotonin inside the brain.

This topic is really debatable because some people get diminished MDMA effects (or think they do) after 5-HTP, when at least scientifically it would seem higher serotonin means more for MDMA to release. It has not been proven why some get these results, but SWIM thinks the reasons are: excess serotonin in the transporters preventing MDMA from freely accessing them. SWIM believes this can be remedied by either slightly increasing MDMA dosage or taking in a way that allows for faster/higher absorbtion, as MDMA does have greater affinity for the transporters than serotonin so it may take a little more MDMA to to take them over. Another possible reason is that increased serotonin can downregulate serotonin receptors, with or without MDMA, especially if one already has significant downregulation. The lowered levels of serotonin after MDMA are partly responsible for the re-upregulation of receptors after MDMA, so 5-HTP may slow down or prevent that re-upregulation. Expectations could be another factor; one takes 5-HTP and expects a great roll and doesn't get it and then says 5-HTP doesn't work. SWIM has had excellent results with 5-HTP and can vouch for its effectiveness, but everyone is different of course..

SWIM didnt really feel a difference in rolling because when he did, he rolled hard, but off of 3.5 doublestacks... and only his 4th time (with a 7-week break and lots of Vitamin C, which btw lowers one's tolerance to MDMA and helps reduce the free-radicals caused by MDMA, which in turn lowers the possiblity of neurotoxicity when doing e) but SWIM felt better mentally on sunday (physically not because swim has a major grinding problem... his mouth had a lot of cuts in it, and his teeth were sore, and his teeth were a little chipped even after wearing a binky the whole time). the last time SWIM did it, there was some sense of depression, but not much. this time, none at all!

[RaverHippie]

There's been a general consensus that there is no effect by taking a pre-load of 5HTP but merely that it helps bring SWIY back to baseline after MDMA use.

[Treesniper119]

Ok, here's the deal...
Swim weighs 160 lbs. and is 5ft. 9in. tall. swim has rolled on occasion over the last 2 years and swim has very little tolerance because swim spaces out rolling months apart. Swim eats relatively healthy and works out. Swims wife is 5ft. 5in. tall has rolled only once a while back and has no tolerance at all. She eats healthy and works out.

Swim and wife will be the testers in this experiment using these variables in this order:

a. The 5-HTP supplement by NATROL will be taken by swim for a week and 3 days. (10 days total monday >>> next wed.) Swim will take as directed on bottle (1 - 100mg. pill daily with a meal, not exceeding this ammount.)

b. After Day 10 (wednsday) swim will stop taking the supplement untill Day 13 (saturday - the comedown). The reason for this is because of previous reports with pre-loading 5-HTP on the day of rolling and it negating the mdma effect... Swim doesn't want to compromise the experiment.

c. Day 11 (thursday) will be an exciting anticipation day where swim will gather good CDs of trance techno, LED glowsticks, OJ, etc.. everything swim could possibly need for the experiment. making sure to eat 3 full meals and getting to bed early. (No 5-HTP taken today)

d. Day 12 (friday) will start off with a good breakfast, later a good lunch, a snack around 4:00pm and finally at 6:00pm swim and wife will take 1 pure 120 mg molly cap each. (pure mdma) and roll till it rolls no more... also drinking OJ and ocassionally taking hits of either weed or a black'n'mild to enhance and elongate rollin' face. (No 5-HTP taken today)

e. Day 13 (saturday) breakfast will be the start of the 5-HTP again. And also the recording of everything that happend the previous night. Swims wife will also be with me taking 5-HTP after the molly roll of last night, though she has not pre-loaded at all as swim had. This will be her first experience using the 5-HTP suppliment. (post-loading is only for her, another angle of this experiment).

f. Day 14 (sunday) record all findings online.

Wish SWI-US luck. hopefully this will shed some light on the situation at hand and provide positive results for all of SWI-US planning on having a safer, richer, and longer lasting roll.

Since it is already tuesday right now Swim will begin this test starting next monday 3/31/08. In the mean time if anyone has any usefull things to add or ideas of what or what not to do, please feel free to mention them. or message me.

[metalupyour455]

Thank you SWIY for the being the brave lab rat to help SWUS and all others needing this info. greatly appreciated! and enjoy the roll!

Originally Posted by Treesniper119

Ok, here's the deal...
Swim weighs 160 lbs. and is 5ft. 9in. tall. swim has rolled on occasion over the last 2 years and swim has very little tolerance because swim spaces out rolling months apart. Swim eats relatively healthy and works out. Swims wife is 5ft. 5in. tall has rolled only once a while back and has no tolerance at all. She eats healthy and works out.

Swim and wife will be the testers in this experiment using these variables in this order:

a. The 5-HTP supplement by NATROL will be taken by swim for a week and 3 days. (10 days total monday >>> next wed.) Swim will take as directed on bottle (1 - 100mg. pill daily with a meal, not exceeding this ammount.)

b. After Day 10 (wednsday) swim will stop taking the supplement untill Day 13 (saturday - the comedown). The reason for this is because of previous reports with pre-loading 5-HTP on the day of rolling and it negating the mdma effect... Swim doesn't want to compromise the experiment.

c. Day 11 (thursday) will be an exciting anticipation day where swim will gather good CDs of trance techno, LED glowsticks, OJ, etc.. everything swim could possibly need for the experiment. making sure to eat 3 full meals and getting to bed early. (No 5-HTP taken today)

d. Day 12 (friday) will start off with a good breakfast, later a good lunch, a snack around 4:00pm and finally at 6:00pm swim and wife will take 1 pure 120 mg molly cap each. (pure mdma) and roll till it rolls no more... also drinking OJ and ocassionally taking hits of either weed or a black'n'mild to enhance and elongate rollin' face. (No 5-HTP taken today)

e. Day 13 (saturday) breakfast will be the start of the 5-HTP again. And also the recording of everything that happend the previous night. Swims wife will also be with me taking 5-HTP after the molly roll of last night, though she has not pre-loaded at all as swim had. This will be her first experience using the 5-HTP suppliment. (post-loading is only for her, another angle of this experiment).

f. Day 14 (sunday) record all findings online.

Wish SWI-US luck. hopefully this will shed some light on the situation at hand and provide positive results for all of SWI-US planning on having a safer, richer, and longer lasting roll.

Since it is already tuesday right now Swim will begin this test starting next monday 3/31/08. In the mean time if anyone has any usefull things to add or ideas of what or what not to do, please feel free to mention them. or message me.

[Fantasian]

SWIF is undergoing a similar experiment but with a long preloading profile and higher dosages. All will also report in due time. SWIF also against popular advice will be taking 5HTP on the day of use.

[metalupyour455]

Originally Posted by Fantasian

SWIF is undergoing a similar experiment but with a long preloading profile and higher dosages. All will also report in due time. SWIF also against popular advice will be taking 5HTP on the day of use.

Thats a good idea, so as to compare to see what happens. When SWIM took 5-HTP on the day of his roll, there didnt appear to be any real hindrance in the drug's effect.

[RaverHippie]

It's kind of hard to judge if something affected a roll. SWIY never knows the exact strength (purity) of whatever MDMA containing substance SWIY consumes.

It would be wise to do a benchmark roll to get a standard with which the following roll could be measured against. I hope SWIY has yet to begin the regimen. Taking down extensive notes to try and accurately describe the qualitative effects would be useful.

Good Luck.

[metalupyour455]

Originally Posted by RaverHippie

It's kind of hard to judge if something affected a roll. SWIY never knows the exact strength (purity) of whatever MDMA containing substance SWIY consumes.

It would be wise to do a benchmark roll to get a standard with which the following roll could be measured against. I hope SWIY has yet to begin the regimen. Taking down extensive notes to try and accurately describe the qualitative effects would be useful.

Good Luck.

true, but SWIM is pretty sure it didnt effect the roll (or at least to a very small degree) considering how hard he rolled and hte amoutn of time he rolled for.

[RaverHippie]

I was putting that out there for general purposes, in SWIY's specific situation I would say that 5HTP taken the day-of I doubt it would have enough time to change the neurochemistry that much.

[metalupyour455]

Originally Posted by RaverHippie

I was putting that out there for general purposes, in SWIY's specific situation I would say that 5HTP taken the day-of I doubt it would have enough time to change the neurochemistry that much.

Right, but would starting from that day and continuing for hte next few days after the roll help SWIM's comedown days more so than just taking it after the roll?

[RaverHippie]

SWIM is no expert on the matter but 5HTP has been known to help SWIM and friends fall asleep at the end of the roll so it serves a double purpose. Right at the end of the roll SWIM takes 5htp then after waking up from the crash swim takes another 100mg 5htp, then the next time SWIM wakes up SWIM takes another one. After that SWIM has a very nice afterglow and no suicide tuesday.

[metalupyour455]

Originally Posted by Treesniper119

Ok, here's the deal...
Swim weighs 160 lbs. and is 5ft. 9in. tall. swim has rolled on occasion over the last 2 years and swim has very little tolerance because swim spaces out rolling months apart. Swim eats relatively healthy and works out. Swims wife is 5ft. 5in. tall has rolled only once a while back and has no tolerance at all. She eats healthy and works out.

Swim and wife will be the testers in this experiment using these variables in this order:

a. The 5-HTP supplement by NATROL will be taken by swim for a week and 3 days. (10 days total monday >>> next wed.) Swim will take as directed on bottle (1 - 100mg. pill daily with a meal, not exceeding this ammount.)

b. After Day 10 (wednsday) swim will stop taking the supplement untill Day 13 (saturday - the comedown). The reason for this is because of previous reports with pre-loading 5-HTP on the day of rolling and it negating the mdma effect... Swim doesn't want to compromise the experiment.

c. Day 11 (thursday) will be an exciting anticipation day where swim will gather good CDs of trance techno, LED glowsticks, OJ, etc.. everything swim could possibly need for the experiment. making sure to eat 3 full meals and getting to bed early. (No 5-HTP taken today)

d. Day 12 (friday) will start off with a good breakfast, later a good lunch, a snack around 4:00pm and finally at 6:00pm swim and wife will take 1 pure 120 mg molly cap each. (pure mdma) and roll till it rolls no more... also drinking OJ and ocassionally taking hits of either weed or a black'n'mild to enhance and elongate rollin' face. (No 5-HTP taken today)

e. Day 13 (saturday) breakfast will be the start of the 5-HTP again. And also the recording of everything that happend the previous night. Swims wife will also be with me taking 5-HTP after the molly roll of last night, though she has not pre-loaded at all as swim had. This will be her first experience using the 5-HTP suppliment. (post-loading is only for her, another angle of this experiment).

f. Day 14 (sunday) record all findings online.

Wish SWI-US luck. hopefully this will shed some light on the situation at hand and provide positive results for all of SWI-US planning on having a safer, richer, and longer lasting roll.

Since it is already tuesday right now Swim will begin this test starting next monday 3/31/08. In the mean time if anyone has any usefull things to add or ideas of what or what not to do, please feel free to mention them. or message me.

hey so how did the experiment go?

[Conkermon]

SWIM's friend took 5-HTP when his roll was wearing off and he had passed the peak. He said it made him start rushing again. SWIM isn't sure if he was telling the truth but he was acting more messed up after he had taken it.

[Dj-ob]

Hey guys..
So yea.. any word on that experiment? or any more input from people who have tried this before? or any neuroscientific or psychological information regarding how the substances could work together?

Cheers!

[Fantasian]

posted my findings here - http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/sho...595#post398595

didnt want to double post but in short taking that much 5HTP prior definately enhanced the roll but like i said something was still missing to make it 'perfect'. That said SWIF's aim was not to help someone who hasnt rolled much, roll harder it was more aimed at regaining some of those magical first experiences, many people believe the idea to be somewhat futile including me but its interesting to see how close one can get.

[altnipper]

swim has found 5-htp to be really good in the days after with no hint of real depression, however swim has found that if he has alcohol at all (even 12 hrs after 5-htp) it has a nasty effect making swim really moody and not feel nice at all, swim is pretty sure it's the alcohol as when this stops next day mood becomes lovely again.

[raverbaby1988]

Well SWIM has only used 5htp after dropping and has found that doses of 100 mg (2 tablets) produced side effects(feeling nauseous &dizzy) but 50mg calmed SWIM down and aided sleep. SWIM feels that low doses are extremely helpful in controlling SWIMS panic attacks and very helpful when coming down.

[UpAllNiteOCXTC]

did swiy take it with food? everytime swim takes any type of supplement on an empty stomach she gets reeal sick.

Swim has not heard of taking 5-htp DURING the peak and/or experience, but has heard of taking it prior and afterwards but has yet to try it. Swim finds that Vitamin C, liquids (gatorade, water), and pot do the trick. Then again, Swim hasn't ever really had a comedown with X.

[s3nate]

SWIM's friends all praise 5-htp as the ultimate Ecstasy come down pill. A few have said pre-loading made their roll better and some others have said it dulled it. I guess it must be your body type.

[metalupyour455]

Originally Posted by s3nate

SWIM's friends all praise 5-htp as the ultimate Ecstasy come down pill. A few have said pre-loading made their roll better and some others have said it dulled it. I guess it must be your body type.

did they take it the day after they rolled or right after they rolled?