SWIM is going to try kratom for his first time

[dark12]

Hey everyone,
SWIM just ordered 4 ounces of "Kratom Premium Dried Leaves" from an online vendor. SWIM loves opiates and has a good amount of experience with hydrocodone. He heard that this is like a weak opiate so he became quickly interested.
SWIM's girlfriend doesn't like the idea of SWIM experimenting with drugs harder than pot. SWIM knows that she won't mind legal herbs at all though. SWIM has read many tasty recipes on this forum, but is looking for some opinions on a good/non-intimidating way to introduce the herb to his girlfriend. He really likes the idea of a milkshake, but he wonders if it is as effective to prepare it this way. He assumes he will just have to crush the leaves until they are near powder and toss about a teaspoon and a half in each shake. His concern with this is that it doesn't seem as effective as putting the herb in vodka and heating it.
SWIM would really appreciate any advice or comments.

[veroner]

About two weeks ago SWIM tryed Kratom for the first time SWIM got a small sauce pan put two cups of water and 12g of thai leaf in and reduced by about half and made tea with the remaining liquid,leaf and all (you may wish to shiv the leaf out and just use the liquid but SWIM drank it all down not wanting to waste the leaf) SWIM felt quite strong rushing feelings for a couple of hours afterwards SWIM was pleasantly surprised with this one

[Dole654]

SWIM can't see any reason why throwing it in a milkshake wouldn't work.

[dark12]

SWIM is 4 hours away from home going to school at the moment so he has no access to a scale. He wants to know if there is any method to dose the correct amount of crushed leaves for ingestion? He is probably going to start with 11 grams of hand crushed leaves. Stems and all.

[veroner]

Where possible remove the stems as for amount you could guess by eye but the problem there is to much and it could act as a sedative or to little no effect at all. But I've heard of doses as low as 6g having an effect as a upper SWIM would split an oz into four by eye take one of the four(7g) then if no effect is felt then top up (scales are always the best way especially with more dangerous plants which SWIM would never guess)

[dark12]

SWIM absolutely agrees with SWIy's comment about the importance of exact measurements with some substances. SWIM just thinks when dealing you kratom that she should be able to measure approximate doses by eye. He has heard of people recommending a teaspoon and a half, but he doesn't know if that was for the extract or the dried leaf.

[veroner]

SWIM thinks that sounds like a very low dose for leaf they must have meant
extract SWIM prefers the leaf to extract. If it was the difference between
guessing the amount by eye or not haveing it at all SWIM would guess it

[dark12]

Great. How much does SWIy generally use? 5 leaves? or maybe like a quarter cup of crushed leaves?

[dark12]

The package arrived today.
SWIM wasn't sure how much to use and didn't have a scale to measure. He used about 6 teaspoons of the leaf and stirred it into a some applesauce. After taking the first bite SWIM strongly regretted this method, but nevertheless he finished the rest of it without throwing up.
After 30 minutes he could sort of feel some of the effects, but nothing really that noticeable.
At that point SWIM boosted with 2 more teaspoons of the leaf to make a strained tea.
Wow. Now he was REALLY feeling it. Big rush and some euphoria. MUCH stronger than SWIM anticipated. This continued for atleast 3 hours.
As his plateau was coming to an end he began to get the massive opiate like itches. It didn't really bother swim. Throughout the whole experience he didn't feel nauseas at all. When he came down he felt content and relaxed.
SWIM has found a new drug that he plans to use atleast weekly. A+

[skylined]

Unfortunately, SWIM has never felt the euphoria that he did his first time with kratom, and is noticing a very fast tolerance... SWIM suggests using weekly to be able to get those wonderful effects from kratom.

[AceOvArts]

SWIM has used Kratom daily and thinks tolerance buillds, though fairly slowly it builds nonetheless. use wisely

[mitchellca]

Swim wanted to know a little more about kratom with downers(lorazepam and diazepam).
Firstly swim would like to state that he is not planning to take kratom with the downers. Swim read somewhere a while back that the 2 mixed(or with alcohol) can bring on fatal respiratory failure and although he would assume this is uncommon but thought he would check to be safe than sorry first.

Anyway the question swim actually had was swim takes diazepam and lorazepam when needed for anxiety and is planning to takeKratom for the first time soon and wondered what sort of time frame it would be best to avoid doing the downers in? ie/ How long before and after the Kratom should swim wait?

Hope that makes some sense

[AceOvArts]

SWIM wouldnt take both on the same day, in fact, to be safe, it would be best to wait until Diazepam is out of SWIYs system before taking Kratom. Check out Diazepams halflife and find out how long it takes to be clean. Tell SWIY to base his jugement on the results.
SWIM suggests the same deal for lorazepam

Reputation Comments on this post:

Helpful answer to my question

[dark12]

To be completely honest SWIM wouldn't worry too much about it.
SWIM thinks kratom is one of the best anti-anxiety meds out there so you don't need both at the same time. Unless you are taking large benzo doses you should be alright.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Helpful answer to my question

[mitchellca]

Thanks alot Ace and Dark. Swim is about to purchase 28g of bali leaf from a well known auction site. He thinks he will try either making a tea or doing a toss and wash with about 5g to start with and see how it goes. He will also avoid the downers on that say at least just as a precaution
Swim will let you know how it goes.
Thanks again for the help.

[shitlocks]

personally i hear that SWIM is gonna chuck a gram and a half of 15x into a shot of tequilla/whisky/sambucca (whatever is closet to hand) tomorrow so an answer is close to hand...

[dark12]

Hey mitchellca,
I purchased nearly the same product from an auction site a few months ago and ended up tossing it because it gave me massive stomach pains and no positive effects. Hopefully you don't get scammed like I did.

[mitchellca]

Doh haha well swim will give it a go and see how it goes. There wasnt a lot of choice of leaves, most of it was extract which swim didnt want. The only other option on the site was a company swim bought baby woodrose seeds from which did nothing at all so he avoided that one.
What dosage did swiy do of it before swiy got the stomach pains?

[dark12]

SWIM bought the powdered bali leaf.
He took 2 teaspoons with no effect then an hour later another 2 teaspoons. Later on he spent the night puking up nasty brown liquid. That happened both times he tried that batch.

[mitchellca]

This could apply to the anixety and kratom thread but since swim started in this thread he will continue.
Today swim got the 30g of kratom and had a couple of friends over. Swim tossed and washed using cola. Swim was not weighing it out but estimated by eye and estimates about 5g, it was certainly not even near 10g.
Anyway about an hour after swim started feeling 'fuzzy' and shortly afterwards he began rushing pretty intensely (almost like a speed rush) and started feeling ill.
Swim suffers from social anxiety and illness symptoms felt similiar to that of his panic attacks. Swim feels that the illness was definately because of anxiety but was wondering if the 'rushing' and such would be a likely effect of the kratom or more likely of a panic attack? Is there anyway the kratom could have actually made swim more anxious? It was still fairly enjoyable but swim did have to leave the room several times to take a breather from his friends.

[StarryEyedNoOne]

First, I'd like to say I'm very sorry that SWIY experiences panic attacks - SWIM has been through it and took benzos and ssris, no fun. The rushing might well have been from the Kratom - SWIM usually feels speedy and talkative, with body tingles that seem to come in waves, and then gets a sedtive effect afterward. The illness might certainly have been from the Kratom, many people experience nausea as a side effect. My friend has luckily not experienced this, but has experienced the Kratom "hang-over" after overindulging. So, it's hard to say if SWIY's effects were due to a panic attack or Kratom, best for SWIY to follow their own instincts, maybe try a lower dose next time just to make sure.

Reputation Comments on this post:

helpful and empathetic response

[dark12]

Hey,
SWIM thinks you should lower the dose and sit down alone with some music and just take note of where your thoughts take you. Find the right dosage that eases your mind the most effectively.

[mitchellca]

Thanks again for the helpful replies. 'StarryEyedNoOne,' yes swim has been given citalopram, diazepam, and more recently lorazepam all with little to no effect, so i was hoping this could be helpful for it. It certainly does seem possible that swim overdid it, especially for his first time. Before swim peaked his anxiety did go away for a little while but its hard to tell if that was to do with the effects of kratom or just naturally relaxing.
But swim will certainly try your idea 'dark12' and take a smaller dosage by himself. Swim thinks he'll wait for a few days but he'll post how it goes again.
Thanks again, All the help has been much appreciated.

[mitchellca]

Apologies for the double post and reviving a slightly older thread but swim thought he would give an update. After being put off by swims previous negative experience (as previously described) swim for some reason today felt that today was the day that he would try again.
Swim is on his own this time. He has weighed out roughly 10g (bad scales) and has crushed it up slightly, he will once again be using the toss and wash method. He intends to do around half and wait for onset and see how he feels and then possibly follow it with the second half depending on the effects. Wish swim luck and he shall post back, hopefully with more positive results!

[dark12]

Hope you enjoy it more this time!