Opinions - Cannabis smokers brainwashed?

[Creeping Death]

Many people that swim knows who smoke weed think that its gods gift to them. There is nothing negative about weed, its all just propaganda, and weed would save the world if everyone smoked it etc. Why is this?

People who use other drugs know the negative effects and what it can do to you, but cannabis smokers kind of ignore reality and always find reasons to say weed is the greatest thing that ever happened and so on. I used to be like this too until i stopped smoking, and realised that i was actually addicted to it. Marijuana has its price like any other drug, and it IS addictive.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Totally agree - but expect some serious reactions to this thread (from stoners who live in their bubble).

[grg3135]

Originally Posted by Creeping Death

Marijuana has its price like any other drug, and it IS addictive.

Marijuana is not physically addictive. It is mentally addictive because it is enjoyable, so people want to do it more. It would be like me saying that I am addicted to books, because I enjoy reading them. Or it could be that a little kid is addicted to playing tag. Or that Michael Jordan was addicted to basketball. There are no physical withdrawl symptoms when a habitual mj smoker takes a break.

Marijuana has many consequences. For instance...its fun, it can help people in a great deal of pain, it can help people with insomnia, it can help people with anorexia, and sometimes it can make people sit on a couch and eat junk food while watching tv.

A mature, responsible marijuana smoker can smoke for decades without it having a negative effect on his life. If one has a hectic job or a lot of responsibilities that he cannot cope with whilst smoking pot, he simply STOPS SMOKING. I have never heard anyone being checked into rehab for a pot smoking problem.

Marijuana users may act like there is little harm in smoking it because THERE IS LITTLE HARM IN SMOKING IT. When was the last time you heard a heroin addict raving about how heroin was the best thing in the world and how there are no negative aspects to it and how everyone should do it?

[Stiney]

Originally Posted by grg3135

Marijuana is not physically addictive. It is mentally addictive because it is enjoyable, so people want to do it more. It would be like me saying that I am addicted to books, because I enjoy reading them.

It's not really a fair comparison to make between something that alters your brain chemistry significantly and reading a book. It is not the same at all and the fact that you claim it to be is a good example of Creepings point.

Crreping, I think it's simply that if someone enjoys something they don't like to think of the negative effects. People who sleep around don't like when others start talking about STI's, people who drive in rallies don't like when others start talking about permanent spinal injuries. No one wants to be lectured to, and sometimes the way people respond is simply by flat out denying the arguments against what they are doing. Alot of the people you know might talk about smoking weed having zero negatives or risks but I'm sure some of them don't actually believe what they are saying. Then again there is a lot of pro-cannabis propoganda just as there is anit-cannabis propoganda and some of them may simply chose to believe the pro stuff over the anti as any of the negatives haven't effected them directly. I think possibly the reason you have the difference between those that smoke marijuana and those that use harder drugs is that the negatives are alot less serious and possibly less prevalent but for the record i have listened to plenty of people that smoke ciggerettes tell me, in between coughing thier guts up, that thier 10 a day habit is completely harmless despite the vast body of research into the harm tobacco can do to you. So like I said, when people enjoy things and are willing to except the risks they usually dislike being lectured to, and some people are more stubborn or prone to denial and will edig thier heels in harder than others over admiting the risks they may be running. Just my opinion.

[grg3135]

Originally Posted by Stiney

It's not really a fair comparison to make between something that alters your brain chemistry significantly and reading a book. It is not the same at all and the fact that you claim it to be is a good example of Creepings point.

Please elaborate on this. Exclude the users who are simply trying to escape reality or depression or similar circumstances. Also, I dont see how ignorance, whether conciously embraced or otherwise, plays much of a factor in the thoughts of those who dont think that smoking a joint will be the end of the world. Due to the expense of marijuana, its lack of physical addiction, as well as the risk involved with its legal status, it would be very easy for one to stop smoking it if he felt that it was a great detriment to his health or had any big problems associated with it for that matter (aside from the negative social stigma and the aforementioned legality).

While youre at it, please give me links to all of the negative side effects of responsible marijuana use (excluding the obvious- ie lung cancer, driving stoned, operating heavy equiptment, or any other circumstances where one's judgement should not be impaired).

There are risks involved with nearly everything in life, but one has to consider the benefit of his actions against the probability and severity of those risks.

[Stiney]

Originally Posted by grg3135

(1)Please elaborate on this.
(2)While youre at it, please give me links to all of the negative side effects of responsible marijuana use (excluding the obvious- ie lung cancer, driving stoned, operating heavy equiptment, or any other circumstances where one's judgement should not be impaired).

(1) I can't see how I could elaborate any more. There is a difference between psychological dependance on a chemical and liking to read books or go fishing.

(2) Why excluding the obvious? Thats like saying please give me links to all of the negative side effects of cutting your fingers off (excluding the obvious - i.e loss of blood, extreme pain, possible infection......)

[Salvinorin A]

Actually, I think reading books and other stuff also make you dependent on a chemical because you're releasing your own when you do this stuff......but that's the difference....endogenous vs. foreign (But there is endogenous THC isn't there? swim hasn't read up in a long while)

A veteran narcotics officer once told swim (a long time ago), that swiy is addicted if swiy keeps a certain amount (xxxug) of a substance constantly in swiy's bloodstream constantly.....and that it is very possible to get addicted to weed.

As for thinking it's the greatest thing in the world.......in swim's opinion, the drug is nice and all.......but what a lame drug compared to other drugs out there for one......2....weed just feels so dirty. But that's all swim's bias. But since this thread isn't about why weed is lame (in comparison to other things)....swim will shut up about that and apologizes for digressing.

SWIM thinks it has a lot to do with what Stiney was mentioning. No one likes to talk about negative effects...personal ones. SWIM knows many people who can standby mature use of opiates without any problems as well...and many other drugs.

Why does it seem that weed-users display the most of this "brain washing"? SWIM highly thinks that this is because of the age group. By far (no data but) swim has seen marijuana be the first purposely abused illegal substance for teenagers to start drugs with. Because of all these rumors and stuff about hardcore drugs (down here, LSD is like super hardcore cus it makes ur brain bleed...woooooaaaah...super hardcore.....gah...ignorance), so they grow with only weed and it becomes most of their thoughts in terms of drugs.

But most of the adults that swim knows that are responsible users don't have any super-liberal stoner stereotype thoughts....but they do heavily smash the negative effects of weed just like a user of any other drug would (and yes there are bad effects of weed......they may not be that significant....but they exist and everyone knows it.....they were mentioned briefly earlier in this thread).

Sal-A

[grg3135]

Originally Posted by Stiney

(1) I can't see how I could elaborate any more. There is a difference between psychological dependance on a chemical and liking to read books or go fishing.

I dont see how there is. One can enjoy smoking a joint just as I enjoy reading a good book. There is no physical addiction to either and, as far as I am aware, there are no permanant negative effects from either. The only difference from your statement is that you say dependence when refering to marijuana, but this is an intentional differentiation on your part. People can become addicted to many things (sex, skydiving, street racing, etc.) but this is not the norm, nor is it a true physical addiction. People can enjoy the effects of marijuana and they can become accustomed to its use/effects, but the same goes for any of the alternatives that I have mentioned as well as virtually ANY medication (allergy, anxiety, arthritis, asthma, the list is endless).

[/QUOTE](2) Why excluding the obvious? Thats like saying please give me links to all of the negative side effects of cutting your fingers off (excluding the obvious - i.e loss of blood, extreme pain, possible infection......)[/QUOTE]

excluding the obvious because I said RESPONSIBLE use. Those are not effects of marijuana, they are effects of the abuse or irresponsible use of marijuana. For obvious reasons, one should not drive while having an intense conversation, whilst extremely angry or in any other extreme emotional distress, or while tired. This does not mean that these things are harmful, it just means that one should use common sense. If an allergy medication, for example, made one tired and unable to concentrate, one should not drive on it. This information alone does not mean that the medication is harmful or that the user should stop taking it, it just means that they should be aware of its effects and act accordingly. I assumed this was common sense.

I am not saying that marijuana is perfect or that it has no negative side effects, but there are negative aspects to virtually everything in life. As far as I am aware, there are far less negative effects with marijuana as there are with most other recreational drugs.

[staples]

Originally Posted by grg3135

There are no physical withdrawl symptoms when a habitual mj smoker takes a break.


I have never heard anyone being checked into rehab for a pot smoking problem.

From a research paper published last year entitled "A within-subject comparison of withdrawal symptoms during abstinence from cannabis, tobacco, and both substances":

Cannabis is currently the most widely used illicit drug in the United States and treatment admissions in which cannabis was the primary problem substance have more than doubled since the early 1990s and are now comparable in number with treatment admissions for cocaine and heroin (SAMHSA, 1998, 2001, 2003). A reliable cannabis withdrawal syndrome that involves increased anger and aggression, anxiety, depressed mood, irritability, restlessness, sleep difficulty and strange dreams, decreased appetite, and weight loss has been clearly demonstrated (Budney et al., 2004).

emphasis added, I'm not sure if this is in the file archive or not, I can add it if you want.

[Nature Boy]

Originally Posted by Creeping Death

Many people that swim knows who smoke weed think that its gods gift to them. There is nothing negative about weed, its all just propaganda, and weed would save the world if everyone smoked it etc. Why is this?

Relatively benign effects that are manageable and compatible within many lifestyles and personality types.

Originally Posted by Creeping Death

People who use other drugs know the negative effects and what it can do to you, but cannabis smokers kind of ignore reality and always find reasons to say weed is the greatest thing that ever happened and so on.

When something doesn't cause obvious problems it can often be paraded as a great thing. This applies to anything from moderate drinking to the emotion of patriotism. Go figure.

Originally Posted by Creeping Death

I used to be like this too until i stopped smoking, and realised that i was actually addicted to it. Marijuana has its price like any other drug, and it IS addictive.

Mr X used to go out with Miss Y but when they broke up he realised he was addicted to (or in love with) her.

Your argument seems a bit weak and hypocritical to me. Cannabis isn't actually physically addictive although it is damn popular. Your opinion is comparable to the jilted lover who has decided to move on.

[Kid A]

Well there are very few things in this world that come without consequences. Nothing is perfect. Coffee has a negative side too, so does drawing and sex and reading.

"I've had good times on drugs, that's a fact. I've had bad times on drugs, too, ok? But I've had good and bad relationships...an I'm not giving up pussy." - i think we all know this guy...

[AntiAimer]

There are plenty of studies that have came out to disapprove the negative effects. Even the risk of lung cancer, has been found to be inconclusive. While smoking in general is bad no matter what, Marijuana itself or the cannabinoids in the plant, have never been found to cause harm. They have only found the opposite, from the slowing of cancers and brain tumors to brain cell growth. Smoking Marijuana is only ONE form of injestion, yet the most common.

When you do your research, you can come to the conclusion that Marijuana itself, is relatively harmless when used in a responsible moderation basis. Which also has been prooven by the many, many users throughout history who were(are)healthy productive members of society.

So the common conception that Marijuana is safe, is a very valid theory. Alot safer then the government wants people to believe. It's not a miracle but it's no demon either, it's just another tool humans should have the right to exploit.

Here's a starting point for research. http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3376

[staples]

Originally Posted by AntiAimer

There are plenty of studies that have came out to disapprove the negative effects. Even the risk of lung cancer, has been found to be inconclusive. While smoking in general is bad no matter what, Marijuana itself or the cannabinoids in the plant, have never been found to cause harm. They have only found the opposite, from the slowing of cancers and brain tumors to brain cell growth. Smoking Marijuana is only ONE form of injestion, yet the most common.

When you do your research, you can come to the conclusion that Marijuana itself, is relatively harmless when used in a responsible moderation basis. Which also has been prooven by the many, many users throughout history who were(are)healthy productive members of society.

So the common conception that Marijuana is safe, is a very valid theory. Alot safer then the government wants people to believe. It's not a miracle but it's no demon either, it's just another tool humans should have the right to exploit.

Here's a starting point for research. http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3376

Oh, I'm not saying that it's all bad, or a demon, at all. My concern is more the statement that it doesn't have any physical dependence at all, as opposed to the statement that current studies are, as you said, inconclusive.

As you also say, it is still theory that MJ is safe, which leads to the discussion on the attitudes of cannabis users, and why they seem to state such theories as facts.

I'm not sure why you would link me to a site about medical use to persuade me that it is a safe drug? Medical use certainly does not imply that a drug is safe, and nowhere did I express any opinion as to whether MJ should be used medically.

[AntiAimer]

Originally Posted by staples

Oh, I'm not saying that it's all bad, or a demon, at all. My concern is more the statement that it doesn't have any physical dependence at all, as opposed to the statement that current studies are, as you said, inconclusive.

As you also say, it is still theory that MJ is safe, which leads to the discussion on the attitudes of cannabis users, and why they seem to state such theories as facts.

I'm not sure why you would link me to a site about medical use to persuade me that it is a safe drug? Medical use certainly does not imply that a drug is safe, and nowhere did I express any opinion as to whether MJ should be used medically.

I posted the link for reference to all the studies(since most people want links to back up what is stated), it shows medical use studies AND it also has shows the many studies on topics like, does it cause cancer, does it kill brain cells and so on. Which would all be included in the medical and benefits area. If it's "safe" as you put it, which nothing is safe it's just not as harmful.

Personally Smurf likes knowing he could abuse Marijuana all his life(if not smoked) and probably live as normal life as someone who didn't(maybe even healthier?), atleast with the facts he has and what he has seen in society from the effects Marijuana has had on it.

[Nature Boy]

Marijuana has been around long enough to be understood as being relatively safe. That's the point here. It can't be compared to the perception of cigarettes back in the 1920s when people thought they were fine. Marijuana has been smoked for centuries and has gained huge worldwide popularity, albeit inadvertently, ever since narcotics prohibition. If there were any very obvious dangerous side effects, we would know all about them because we've come through several marijuana-smoking generations with improved testing knowledge and have seen no public health crisis comparable to alcoholism or tobacco-smoking diseases.

The whole argument is bollocks IMO because people should be left to their vices if they choose so. If anything, a little bit of variety might help society out.

[Stiney]

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

can't be compared to the perception of cigarettes back in the 1920s when people thought they were fine. Marijuana has been smoked for centuries

To be fair tobaco was smoked for centuries aswell before anyone discovered it wasn't fine. Its hardly a recently used psychoactive...

[staples]

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

Marijuana has been around long enough to be understood as being relatively safe. That's the point here. It can't be compared to the perception of cigarettes back in the 1920s when people thought they were fine. Marijuana has been smoked for centuries and has gained huge worldwide popularity, albeit inadvertently, ever since narcotics prohibition. If there were any very obvious dangerous side effects, we would know all about them because we've come through several marijuana-smoking generations with improved testing knowledge and have seen no public health crisis comparable to alcoholism or tobacco-smoking diseases.

The whole argument is bollocks IMO because people should be left to their vices if they choose so. If anything, a little bit of variety might help society out.

While I will agree that it seems relatively safe, this isn't really a comparison to other drugs. Other than that, the rest of what you say demonstrates another natural bias we have with inductive reasoning, I believe this is the "confirmation bias" where we tend to accept an idea if everything presented to us thus far doesn't contradict when instead we should be testing those ideas. I'm beginning to think that cannabis use increases susceptibility to these biases of inductive reasoning, which to me seems very dangerous.

Originally Posted by AntiAimer

I posted the link for reference to all the studies(since most people want links to back up what is stated), it shows medical use studies AND it also has shows the many studies on topics like, does it cause cancer, does it kill brain cells and so on. Which would all be included in the medical and benefits area. If it's "safe" as you put it, which nothing is safe it's just not as harmful.

Personally Smurf likes knowing he could abuse Marijuana all his life(if not smoked) and probably live as normal life as someone who didn't(maybe even healthier?), atleast with the facts he has and what he has seen in society from the effects Marijuana has had on it.

Instead, I see a lot of interest in the potential therapeutic effects of weed, which I do not contest. Please do not misunderstand what I am saying to mean that I do not think those who want to should be allowed to partake.

[Ididnotinhale]

Going back to one of the original posts. There actually is a small physical withdrawal with marijuana. It does not happen for up to a month though and lasts for about two weeks. Withdrawal usually just causes mild depression due to a lack of serotonin that normally would be released by the canibinoids.

[AquafinaOrbit]

Because Weed users mostly start as kids/teens and do not do any research on the drug. As they are healthy and fit they choose to believe pretty much any BS a stoner friend of theirs will tell them about the drug. As for addiction, there really is not much of one to speak of beyond the fact that someone may enjoy the effect so much they don't want to stop. My friend for years has gone months smoking everyday to dropping it instantly for various reasons and not touching for 6 months or more. (No headaches, no urges, no nothing)