The big chill : My annual withdrawal from opiates.

[samuraigecko]

The annual dry spell rally . . . .

SWIM is about to start (well just started . . ) his annual dry out spell. He has all of the weapons of choice to battle his usual yearly dry out . . .

Certain Benzo's, the kind used will be changed every 3 days as not to deveop a tolerance to any particular benzo. The ones he has on hand are as follows:

Oxazepam
Xanax
Clonazepam
Diazepam.

He will start with the short half life benzo's at first then work his way down to Diazepam which has an EXTREMELY long half life. The reasoning for this taper is so that the effects can be largely reduced over a number of days until one wants off and then can taper fairly sharply because of the long half life of the Diazepam.

Lots of green tea, helps clean out the system.

A packet of OxyNorm 5mg. One per night for 20 nights to take the "edge" of the symptoms.

Other than that, it is usually just a basic "will power" thing. Legs always hurt, stomach always upset, the small dosage of Oxy fortunately keeps the cold/flu like symptoms away except for the excessive mucous accumulation in the throat, thats just something ya have to live with for the duration.

The bright side is, this only lasts for about 20 to 25 days MAX for SWIM. Then he can remain clean for a number of months until he feels it is time to have some fun again etc. It sorta makes sense to him to clean out every year, like spring cleaning for the body and time for the mind to re-sort itself. Should be rather fun as both the comedown and the precluding straitness are a trip of their own.

One finds it an amusing thing that a fair number of addicts are actually scared of this sickness and comedown. It is an experience in itself. Sure, it isn't a pleasant experience but then again there are a lot of other things humans do electively that are also not pleasant experiences. A fair number of users / addicts never actually give away their addiction for any length of time because of the deep seated need for the drug which the body does produce. This is not psychological but rather the body getting fairly sick from the lack of endomorphin production (the body naturally uses endomorphin as a defense mechanism) which is a real physical addiction. This physical addiction is not to be taken lightly, it can affect people extremely adversely especially for those whom are not mentally prepared for whats coming. The physical pain experienced can be extreme, especially in the legs in SWIMs own experience. With perseverance and will power it CAN be over come and sometimes the grass is greener over there . . . sometimes. Even though SWIM has a legitimate physical pain which he will have to deal with while he is strait he still chooses to do this each year. The normal physical pain he is in is quite extreme and he does use opiates for a legitimate reason, though excessively and more often than not . . . not as prescribed. He also supplements this intake with CFO and H while he is being a user every year.

The next 4 to 6 months (depending on how long SWIM decides its time to have more fun) will be a trial as always, but a good trial. It strengthens the mind and soul. It hardens the outer shell. It allows his immune system to build back up (opiates do degrade the immune system over time). But most of all, it allows SWIM to remember whom SWIM is . . . . .

It is also of note that SWIM will still have opiates in the house and not be tempted by them, this extreme mental ability has only been achieved by YEARS of doing this and at first he was prone to slip from time to time. Now he is quite able to still have his regular meds on hand and perhaps some left over CFO and not even blink an eye at it. He knows what is coming and he also knows the result that is to be achieved. In the long run he knows it is for the best so he is able to do things wisely.

Another good thing is that after this stint of straitness his tolerance will drop (in another thread it was suggested that a drop in tolerance may help SWIM get an effect from Tramadol, he will try this and report back on it when this break is finished with).

This is not to say that SWIM will be gone, he will still be here for posts and conversation and advise to those whom need it in areas he is knowledgeable in.

Peace . . . .

Reputation Comments on this post:

	Very interesting. Look forward to seeing how you get on.
	GREAT post!

[samuraigecko]

So SWIM is now on his second day. The usual leg aches, sweats, etc . . . .
he says "bring it oooon muthaf**cker!!!!!" as he is almost masochistic in this sense as he already knows what is to come and has been through it more times than most people here have been alive in years.

"SWIM is 20 and he is going through WD what can he do?"

He can take a leaf out of SWIMs book because SWIM has been an addict for more than 20 years and still manages to dry out once a year and stay strait for about 4 to 6 months.

(sometimes only 3 LOL )

So SWIM has already done this over 20 times already and is well prepared for what is to come, He will keep this little journal so that perhaps a few people can learn a few things from it.

So far on this second day he has been surprised that it has not been as bad as he thought it would be. He did have mass cravings and ached legs and an upset stomach so he took the following medications.

Pack of ciggies (essential)

2 xanax, got rid of the leg pains and cramps and helped to stop his stomach from being upset.

An antacid drink to help stop the upset stomach. Seemed to work well.

A couple of small snifter glasses of cognac (not crap brandy, real cognac, believe SWIM there is a BIG difference). This helped his body stop the sweats quite a bit.

[NOTE: Alcohol should be treated carefully during this period especially if benzo's are being used, dont go overboard]

On another note, SWIM has found that though dangerous, binge drinking has helped him in the past a few times. A week strait at the pub on the sauce and he wakes up not even feeling like having any opiates. This USED to work a treat for him in the early years but SWIM is now far too old to be at the pub every night getting sauced up.

One wonders if this phenomenon has helped anyone else in the past? please feel free to post away in my little journal if SWIyou have something of the kind to contribute.

He has his 5gm OxyNorms ready for nightly dispensing. His girlfriend gives them to him when it is time. for the first 5 nights he has 2, which would be 10mg. The remaining sheet in the packet has 10 and only 1 a night will be dispensed to him after that so that would be another 10 nights of 5mg . . . meaning 15 nights in total until absolute zero opiate intake is reached.

Even though SWIM is still having 10mg of oxycodone a night his WD symptoms have still started because he is used to MUCH higher dosages than this. He still has a few MScontin 100mg pills kickin' around somewhere and he still has half a batch of CFO. He still even has a nice half gram of "eagle white" as it was called by his supplier (a VERY nice H4 which will be fun to return to after he has had his period of dryness). None of these opiates will be taken during this period, SWIM wont even be tempted (well perhaps a little but he still wont do it) as SWIM has done this many times and likes to know he has some good grade opiates waiting for him at the end of his dry out period.

After he has dried out for a few months (usually anywhere from 3 to 6 months, he usually tries for the higher end to get the maximum benefit from it all) He has to be vary careful. Normally he knows he would be able to load up half a gram of nice H4 into his syringe (a rather special one, he will get to that in a minute) and basically blast into happiness. After this period of straitness he will feel a great need to do exactly that but he also knows that his tolerance has dropped right through the floor. Of course from continued opiate use his natural tolerance to opiates has been raised somewhat but it is still a dangerous time where mistakes are easily made, Here is one example:

SWIM had just finished off with one of his dry spells, he was getting ready to have a blast while he was talking to his girlfriend in the bedroom. He was mixing away and talking to her paying very little attention to what he was actually doing. He normally buys a gram of H mixes it into 200 units of purified water and filters it all through and squirts it back into a special vial he has so he can dispense himself shots strait out of that as needed. This means that a "point" usually measures out to be about 20 units when he goes to have a taste out of it. Anyhoo, he was doing this and on the second suck up he totally forgot what it had been that he was doing, preped himself up while still distracted and talking to his girlfriend and proceeded to blast 100 units into himself. He went "uh oh" as soon as he did. His girlfriend said "whats wrong" thats all SWIM remembers about that until the paramedics were standing over him after giving him a shot of naloxone and standing WELL back (one will explain this in a second too). So as SWIyou can see, it pays to remember that ones tolerance has gone down the shitter and SWIMMERS have to be careful . . . . SWIM was distracted and NOT being careful and it nearly got him dead.

[Explanation note 1] SWIM has a special syringe, he has interchangeable tips easily available to him and he usually uses 32g or 33g needle tips. There is no need to worry about sanitation because SWIM only uses this syringe on himself, doesnt let others use it (DUH) and owns an autoclave (which he usually uses for his tattoo equipment) to sterilize his special syringe with. SWIM is rather lucky because he has easily accessible veins all over the place and he never shoots in the same place twice in a row. He has actually found the vein on the back of his hands the most enjoyable to shoot in for some reason, probably just his quirkiness. He has read in a few places that it is bad to shoot into extremities, If anyone has any info to add to that please feel free.

[Explanation note 2] Paramedics have learned from treating addicts all the time that when they give someone naloxone to bring them out of an OD the addict goes into immediate withdrawal and usually gets rather agitated that the parameds have "ruined my high man, you f**king bastards!" etc etc. Paramedics have even had to fight off agitated addicts a fair number of times before usually. A friend of SWIMs whom actually works as a paramed has even been stabbed one time (not by SWIM) for "ruining my high man!" or "saving his life" depending on the way SWIyou look at it. In SWIMs opinion they have a very hard job and are more often than not (in most countries) underpaid for the service they provide.

Hope some of this has been informative and SWIM will keep his journal going for the duration of his WD adventure.

[samuraigecko]

OK so day 3 it is.

This are even more shit today, but thats OK cos SWIM was prepared for it. Same old crap, leg cramps and stomach aches etc. Almost felt a vomit coming on earlier but SWIM caught that just in time.

Over all it has not been too bad. SWIM had a large forearm tattoo job done today so that took his mind off it for a while.

Few sweats are prevalent now but it doesnt seem to be bothering him much. He sleeps pretty well with the 10mg Oxy and the 2 xanax he has of a night time. Only two more days of that though . . . they he is tapering down to one 5mg oxy and some klonopin.

5 days of that then he will start on the valium instead of the klonopin.

until the next installment . . . . peace

[Nucking Futs]

Hello Sir,

I was wondering how bad the pain in the legs is? And what sort of pain it is? IE Is it an intense sharp pain or perhaps a dull throb? Are the chiils/hot flushes not just your reaction to age? lol ok that was a menopausal joke !!!! Are the temp changes the flu like symptoms I have read about?
The pub souns like a well good idea !! lol.
I,m assuming that when you say clean you mean relativly due to your on going opiate meds and all that your taking to help with the WD's. It seems like your swapin opiates for benzos or are these just in the interim purley to fight the WD's?

Regards,

Me.

PS sorry about the spelling im dyslexic and it comes out in me spelling and hand writing.

PPS. Absolutly no offence ment at all!

[samuraigecko]

Originally Posted by Nucking Futs

Hello Sir, I was wondering how bad the pain in the legs is? And what sort of pain it is? IE Is it an intense sharp pain or perhaps a dull throb? Are the chiils/hot flushes not just your reaction to age? lol ok that was a menopausal joke !!!! Are the temp changes the flu like symptoms I have read about?
The pub souns like a well good idea !! lol.
I,m assuming that when you say clean you mean relativly due to your on going opiate meds and all that your taking to help with the WD's. It seems like your swapin opiates for benzos or are these just in the interim purley to fight the WD's?

PS sorry about the spelling im dyslexic and it comes out in me spelling and hand writing.

PPS. Absolutly no offence ment at all!

Hey no offence taken bro, and no need for the sir . . we are all just crew lookin for good information here. And SWIyou have posed some great and potentially informative questions that others may be wondering about also, nice work, SWIM would have given SWIyou more reputation points for that but it says that "SWIM has to spread some more rep points around before he can give it to SWIyou again" LOL.

To answer SWIyour questions about SWIM, one will present them in point form for convenience of readability.

1] Leg aches: The leg pains are like a very intense ache which feels like it is in the actual bones. It does suck but some benzo class drugs like xanax or valium help well with this as they are deep tissue muscle relaxants meaning they have very good relaxation properties to skeletal muscle tissue systems.

2] The hot/cold flushes: LOL, no not to do with age, although SWIM is getting on a bit in his years, but still young enough. But in short, YES very much like the cold and flu hot/cold flushes. Sometimes it even feels as though SWIyou could pass out from it.

3] The pub method: Yes in the past a few nights of good ole binge drinking seemed to do the trick. Rather than staying at home and worrying about his WD's he would go to the pub and get smashed. A few days of this seemed to do the trick and no opiate WD's were apparent after that, or if they were they were VERY mild. SWIMs body has had enough punishment from alcohol though so he no longer uses this method. [NOTE: do not get drunk and confident and think SWIyou can take an opiate, this has lead to SWIM almost dying and some of SWIMs friend ACTUALLY DYING. Opiates and alcohol are not a good mix.

4] The self medication factor: SWIyou are correct in a way. SWIM uses benzo's and SMALL dosages of opiates for the first couple of weeks to make the dry out taper off more easily. There are still WD's and aches and pains to deal with but on the whole it makes it a fair bit more bearable. After the course of a few weeks has gone by SWIM will be and stay totally clean for whatever period of time he desires.

P.S: Dont worry about SWIyour typing, everyone here is fluent in typo anyway.

Hope this has been informative

[Nucking Futs]

Hi Gecko,

I call you sir in the way that an english speaking british raised welsh man would say I THNK YOU SIR as pose to the way that the orfan oliver uses it .

Thank you for answering me questions. I think it's important to have information like this because we get both sides of the story.

Regards,

ME.

[samuraigecko]

Originally Posted by Nucking Futs

I,m assuming that when you say clean you mean relativly due to your on going opiate meds and all that your taking to help with the WD's. It seems like your swapin opiates for benzos or are these just in the interim purley to fight the WD's?

Sorry SWIM had missed this part of the post and did not answer SWIyour question properly.

When SWIM says "stay clean" he means that once he has self-tapered his opiate useage down it will be at Zero intake. The small dosages of Oxycodone are only to help relieve some of the more volatile aspects of the WD symptoms. Even though SWIM is taking these small amounts (which will continue for a total of 15 days) the WD's he experiences are quite intense still as he is used to and tolerant to over 10x the amount he is self administering. The benzo's are not for continued use either, they are only for use for a period of 30 days in total also to help with the WD symptoms.

Self medication and HUGE willpower can work the right way if one has the strength to stick with it. But once one has done that one also has to have the strength to stop the self medication at the end. This is fine for informed peoples whom think or know they do not need a medical professional to get them stuck on some buprenorphine or methadone program. It helps to keep one of the government radar too. Once one is on a methadone or suboxone (buprenorphine) program one is registered as an addict with the government (read the fine print on the clinic patient forms . . . LOL).

Hope this has helped

[poppypreacher]

Hey amigo, much respect to SWIyours will power and strength and I wish him good times without opiates. I feel similar like Swiy, the withdrawal aren't just bad feelings, depressions and pain, it is the beginning of something new, a new life-feeling, new hope, new dreams can develop during this times. So Swiy is at his fourth day, things slowly should become better, but the danger in these times is in swims opinion, that boredom and life-sickness could occur. Swim thinks also, somebody needs a kind of plan how to use the next months useful.

Against the restless legs and the pain in the body it helps swim to make sport; its painful and costs will power to start, but it can help since swiyours head is overflooded with adrenaline. Also good is any kind of wellness-activity like taking a bath or go to a sauna with hot steam to get the circulation in action.

Swim is addicted for six years and have had many minor and four intense withdrawals in this time. His longest abstinent phase in this time were about one year (2006 was nearly opiate free). He thinks, clean times are not necessary better or worse than opiate times; it depends on how somebody handle it.
Hope it has been understandable, my english is not very good
Greetz

[samuraigecko]

SWIM thanks SWIyou for the good wishes, it is much appreciated.

SWIM is on day 5 now . . . . .

Leg aches are progressively worse at the moment but as another pointed out some kind of sport or activity does both ease and also in some way - give reason - to the pain. Instead of SWIMs mind thinking "oh these WDs are so bad SWImy legs ache so much" he is more thinking "gosh SWII did alot of work today, so much SWImy legs are hurting a bit" . . . .

One mind plays a huge role and if one can divert ones mind into thinking it is something else then that can be a powerful thing.

SWIM has been an Opiate user for over 20 years as he has stated many times. He is qualified in a medical area (will not disclose this information) And has been involved in legal opiate farming in the country where he lives. In fact it was these 2 things which made him opiate dependent in the first place (LOL).

SWIM dries out for a few months of every year so SWIM has actually done this over 20 times already and he thought he would share the experience with others step by step for the duration of the WD.

The cold/flu symptoms are not so bad today even though SWIM has not had his dosage of Oxycodone yet (this is not administered to him until bed time). He has had a bit of the coughs going on today but it has not been nearly as bad as it has been in the past.

He does not get many of the depression or anxiety feelings often during this time. This years WD is a little different in that area as his Aunt just died yesterday (god rest her soul, she is in a better place than THIS planet) so he has felt the usual grief and depression little stronger because of this.

During the first few times of opiate WD this is the best way SWIM could describe the feeling . . .

"It is like someone has died but you dont know who, it is an intense grief coupled with physical debilitations. It is almost like a part of you is missing"

SWIM has talked to others within his range of friends whom are users and they also agree on this statement. Now that SWIM knows what is to come each year when he does it and is mentally prepared for what is to come he no longer feels the depression and grief as much now.

SWIM has a funeral to attend now while he is in WD, this is a first for him and it will be interesting to see how he copes with this day of mourning when it is to come (in a few days).

Anyhoo . . . SWIM will report again on the 6th day and let everySWIone know how it has progressed.

peace.

[samuraigecko]

Well . . . . day 6. This day usually sucks pretty hard as does day 7.
It is these 2 days where the worst of the opiate WDs REALLY kick in . . . and also the days that SWIM chooses to taper off his usage a little sharper. The reason he does this is because it is time for the body to fight back a bit harder. The opiate WDs have kicked in a little harder and if one wants to toughen up against it then one is going to need to remain calm and remember that it is "not the end of the world" LOL.

By making the body fight back a little harder during the worst part of the WDs one is preparing ones body to re-enter a state of sobriety. It builds up ones will power and strength, it builds the character needed to pull this off and be able to stay clean for an extended period. It makes one feel as though they have EARNED it. LOL.

The aches are worse, the dry throat and flu symptoms are slightly worse but all of these are manageable with small doses of OTC cold and flu drugs, small dosages of benzos' and small dosags of opiates at night so a good nights sleep can be achieved.

SWIM only has another 8 days to go before total sobriety is achieved. Even then he has to be careful for the next month. It is during this time that SWIM will be the most tempted to pick up where he left off, he will have it in the back of his mind most of the time "perhaps just ONE little taste cant hurt" but he has to tell himself NO.

And in the end it is all worth it. When he chooses to start up again, his tolerance has gone WAAAAAY down so a small amount brings him to almost what it was like when he first had that good hit. People can always chase that first feeling but it is never going to happen, even after remaining sober for quite a while.

Anyhoo . . . SWIM will report back later because even the sound of a keyboard is hammers in his ears.

Peace

[Metomni]

Good luck gecko man!

This is a fantastic idea and is the very definition of responsible drug use. SWIY's methods are to be admired.

As these days are the worst hopefully SWIY can find something to keep them busy and keep their mind off the sickness.

SWIM didn't see this thread before, but now that he knows it's here he'll be keepin' an eye on it.

Cheers!

[samuraigecko]

thanks bro, SWIyour words are much appreciated.

Well . . . day 7-ish now . . . .
REALLY sucks . . no sleep and cravings area really starting to kick in because of the tapered use of Oxycodone. SWIM is down to 5mg now and has decided to use Oxazepam for the moment to supplement it since it has a fairly short half life. only 15mg of the "serax" brand is being used, half of a 30mg tablet. SWIM has also found the antihistamine Czine or "claratine" to also be helpful with the whole mucus / throat thing, almost unnoticeable now. He thinks that perhaps the psydoephidren in the Czine is the culprit for helping in this case.

Onto a more explicit tale of the cravings.
SWIM WANTS . . . .
It is almost unbearable but he is persisting in his struggle as he knows if he can get past this 7th day then the worst of it is mostly over.

God "apparently" made the world in 7 days . . one wonders if he was "coming down" and was bored . . LOL. Then decided to chuck the P.somniferum plant in there as a bit of a joke. Showing that nature itself, is not without irony.

The leg aches got real bad at one point earlier for no reason. SWIM could not get comfortable no matter what he did, he found himself pacing up and down his hall way until he thought to himself "what the fuck are ya doin' ya idiot" and jumped back into bed. But he found that the pacing did help, stretched the legs out a bit and unconsciously gave some relief.

Anyhoo . .. will report again soon.

[jayjohnson81]

Doubt if it'll make you feel better (har, har!) but you're not alone. SWIM is on day 5 herself. Didn't realize how long she was in for. Sick thought now is she can compare alcohol withdrawal and opiate. Everybody should be so lucky! (They're more similiar than not.)

Ganja and showers are her best friends. Get up off thee holy ass and move around. Get outside, and get some air and sun.

A tattoo actually makes sense. `Meet` the noise level of pain, ya' know? Plus the endorphin rush has got to help a little.

Oh yeah - she liked reading about the sense of loss peeps describe. She instantly connected it with the occasional deeply sad reminissing of days past and friends no longer in contact with.

Anyways... just a few more days... it sucks but it's not impossible.

[samuraigecko]

cheers dude, thx for the support, its getting there and well into the worst part of it now but the worst is almost over. So far SWIM has done pretty well with it as he does every year.

Unfortunately the weed is not an option for SWIM as he seems to go a "little weird" when he smokes it, some people can smoke for a lifetime and be sweet and others just develop a mental disorder from it. SWIM believes that he is one of those people whom probably "just shouldnt smoke" LOL.

[bcubed]

S.G., kudos on your post! It ought to be required reading for all those who would equate "physically dependant" with "depraved junkie." I'm glad to hear that you're through the worst of the WDs.

I've always wondered how genuine pain issues complicate dependency issues. I mean, a "use schedule" to avoid addiction becomes more complicated when the drug is medically indicated...

Also, my lizard has tried opiates and has experienced the high, but as withdrawls are such a part of the opiate experience, he is inclined to experience those, also, and would do so if he were sure that the monkey would STAY gone...

(Incidentally, I was wondering if JJ81 would elaborate on how alcohol WDs compare/contrast to opiate WDs. Jimbo's experienced alcohol WDs and would describe it as nausea+insomnia+the worst coffee jitters ever. (People tend to think he's on crack as he's withdrawing, incidentally.))

[jayjohnson81]

Originally Posted by bcubed

(Incidentally, I was wondering if JJ81 would elaborate on how alcohol WDs compare/contrast to opiate WDs.

We'll get back to you on that one after the near constant self-loathing goes away...

Like the flu for a week, when everyone you love dies, and you caused it. (Suicide takes many addicts. When people talk of self control, it's a huge understatement.)

[Nucking Futs]

JJ and SG you both have my full support. This should be made sticky so any would be opie users can get a picture of what it's like to be and addict. It can't be easy to do! I can only imagine what your going through as I haven't been there. But I'm guessing this is a good account!
Peace to ya guys. It will all be over soon and look on the bright side the WDs you feel are nothing compared to the wds from living! depending on how u look at it !

Regards,

Me.

[samuraigecko]

It is hard but if SWIyou stick to the plan stringently and be strict on SWIyourself then it can be done. It may not be able to be done in all cases. SWIM has always said that it takes an extraordinary willpower to do this. He does think that the CAPACITY for this willpower IS in everyone it is just that not everyone takes advantage of their true power.

SWIM agrees that WD is just as much of the opiate experience as the opiate itself. He may sound a little masochistic in this sense but he actually sort of enjoys having to go through the WD every year and then stay clean for a while.

When he resumes again, It makes his continued use after that seem . . . earned (if that makes sense).

Thanks for the kind words and support. It is good to know (and empowering for his willpower) that he has other people around the whole world wishing him well. It boosts his willpower even further and gives him an even larger reason. It is one thing to disappoint yourself, but to disappoint a world audience . . . well . . . that just aint good. LOL.

Thanks (BTW, today has been pretty good really WD has tapered down HEAPS.)

[Orchid_Suspiria]

The benzo one wants for this and the one that was the most help to swim is tranxene(clorazepate)it has a very long half life,it doesn't have the euphoria of benzos with a shorter half life so less potential for abuse and addiction,.Swim has found lunesta(eszopiclone)to be valueable for the same reasons and for sleep.It is very short acting though,swim would reccommend taking these before bed.

[madpad]

Of course it depends on the opioid you've been using SWIM has had a few goes at WDing, not always voluntarily , over the last twenty odd years and has managed to just take some holidays and hit the sack for a week or so cold turkey with H, luckily it tends to put SWIM on his back fairly well and still allows him to get a bit of sleep.
No such luck with methadone as it only really starts to peak at the end of the first week and after around 5 days with no sleep SWIM starts getting a bit loopy loo.
Short periods of intense euphoria followed by crashes with the constant discomfort, sweaty/stickiness and the inability to really sit still.

SWIM doesn't take any benzos or other drugs at all as they all seem to make SWIM worse i.e. the feeling doesn't go away, it's just you can't move or think clearly while suffering.

If it works for SWIY though...

[samuraigecko]

For SWIM it has never been just one opioid. He used to take his CFO and Oxycontin (crushed and snorted of course) jackin H . . . Morphine, grey nurses etc . . . basically whatever opioid he could do or get whenever he can which was every day multiple times a day.

SWIM is now opiate free . . . He has jumped off and is still feeling muscle and bone aches etc but on the whole is feeling quite clear headed and pretty damn good about himself again. After a particular period of time he will start to have fun again . . its just what he does each year. He CHOOSES to do this for his own health and safety.

The benzo cycle has gone down to valium because of its longer half life now (up to 200 hours believe it or not) and it builds in the system. One has to be careful here because benzo dependence can replace the opiate dependence so tapering off the benzo is also required after this period of time.

Will report more later when SWIM has more time to talk
Thank to every SWIMMER whom has been of support, it has helped to read this.

[Orchid_Suspiria]

SwiSamuraiGecko is certainly strong.Swim would never,ever willingly put himself in this situation.Swim doesn't like to think of himself as weak but when it comes to opiates swim guesses he is weak.

[wtjo831]

HI!!!!!!!! SWIM is a newbie and is coming off of 4 years on methadone. SWIM is on day 34 and is just now really having a rough time. SWIM is on Suboxone, though. SWIM is jittery, anxious, depressed, in soooooooooooo much pain(chronic pain sufferer anyway) and on the verge of a nervous breakdown. This change from methadone to Suboxone was not SWIM'S choice. Pain Management Doc started working for the manufacturer of Suboxone and "threw" SWIM on this rollercoaster. Guess it is for the best but SWIM is about to lose it...LITERALLY. SWIM has tried herbal teas, OTC pain meds, taking more of the Suboxone than usual and life just seems to be getting more and more AWFUL! Anyone have any suggestions for SWIM? UGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[samuraigecko]

some benzo's in there to help with the anxiety is always good if SWIyou can get any. Other than that it is just plain determination and will power.

SWIM really feels for SWIyour plight as he knows only too well the distressing situation that is WD. One has heard many reports of suboxone creating reactions in people exactly the way SWIyou describe it. In SWIMs opinion suboxone, methadone etc are all potentially even MORE evil than their slightly more fun counterparts.

If one has the will power to do so then one can remain on their substance and ween it down themselves. Not all will be successful at this though and the decision to do it the way SWIM does it should NOT be taken lightly as it can lead to both opiate and benzo addiction all over again.

Peace

[wtjo831]

Thanks so much for the kind words. SWIM appreciates it. Today was better than yesterday for SWIM. Gotta just keep on keeping on!!!!