official name change for bridgesii

[Cakes]

Trichocereus bridgesii is now called Echinopsis lageniformis.

[Alfa]

Is there a reason behind this?

[fnord]

GRRRRR!!!! this angers me,jesus christ if the world of entheogens isnt confusing enough as it is grandmas got to start calling 100+ of her children by diffrent names now...


i blame this all on you cakes!


i cant find a reason but:

sobriquet - the renaming isn't new. Even the most recalcitrant old farts at the cactus club accept Echinopsis. As I said, the only group that doesn't are 'ethnobotany enthusiasts'.
And I presume you hadn't thought the 'room for both' through all that well. I've given a few examples below.

The naming brings about a few other issues. what about those Trich species that have been taken out of Echinopsis altogether? They have been taken out for the same reasons that Trich were moved into Echinopsis, that being the microscopic seed morphology.

What about all the multiple Trichs that have been sunk into single Echinopsis species? Will we also hold onto these defunct species names? well, we would have to, because you can't just arbitrarily exchange Echinopsis for Trichocereus.

There are more than just the 4 or 5 Trich species we generally talk about and as people's interest in the genus broadens the naming will become problematic if it is not consistent. And the only way to stay consistent with Trichocereus is to maintain a taxonomic snapshot from 15 or 20 years ago.

What about in a few years time when no plant or seed dealer will supply Trichocereus anymore. Then suddenly most plants that are not the pachanoi/peruvianus/ etc types belong to a different genus? So when you buy Echinopsis lageniformis seed overseas, you will actually post about your Trichocereus bridgesii plants here?

How about all the lesser known Trichs? Are we going to look up each Echinopsis import whether it was previously in the Trichocereus group and then rename it for our community use? Or will we simply leave the obscure Echinopsis as Echinopsis and rename the pachanoi/peruvianus/bridgesii group to Trichocereus?
If you don't know the answer to that question then think about what you will label your plant that you grew from imported Echinopsis nigripilis seed? If you will label it Echinopsis nigripilis then you must also label all other Trich Echinopsis. Ask yourself, will you make the effort to look up whether this was a Trichocereus species or not?

What about your imported Echinopsis deserticola seed? will you call this Trichocereus deserticola or T.fulvilanatus, and how will you know which one of these is correct? In fact you can't.

What about the E.peruvianus seed? Is that T.torataensis, T.tacnaensis, T.puquiensis, or T.peruvianus?

I don't like jumping on the bandwagon of the first person or group who wants to change a taxonomic group, but it's been over a decade now and you have to draw a line at some stage.


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If Pacman had affected us as kids we'd be running around in dark rooms, munching pills and listening to repetitive music.

and yes i just had to include the sig line..

[Cakes]

I think he does better research than he slows down to notice sometimes.

Originally Posted by fnord

...find a reason...

and ok on the blame thing as long as there is no fine. ha ha. It did sound like i was issuing an edict of some sort didn't it?

[grandbaby]

Interesting. Thanks for the info, Fnord. And I love your sig line, too:

Subliminal messages don't exist.fFnord- you would enjoy donating to the forum -fnord

[fnord]

Whats the difference in the seeds?

i blame this all on you cakes!

Sorry for shooting the messenger! twas a joke,but as Mr.G has pointed out i have no sense of humor.

[Cakes]

They are grouped together because their seeds are similar. Instead of using the old classification of putting together plants that look the same at maturity, they are now trying to group according to more refined standards aka according to similarities in their microscopic seed morphology.

If a species was previously called "Trichocereus X", then it is probably called "Echinopsis X" now. except for Trichocereus bridgesii. there was already a Echniposis bridgesii.

Kind of convenient that the one that gets a complete name change is the most popular entheogen among them.

Kind of convenient in the same way that the oriental garden poppy has gone though two different name changes.

It's already pretty hard for SWIn00b to tell the players apart without a scorecard. just think what fun it will be when they change the scorecard.