Dose - Maoi + opiates

[fnord]

Does anyone have experience mixing opiates with maoi's?

another thread here sparked my interest where a user said:

Originally Posted by TWINE006

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monoami...dase_inhibitor

"Purely opiate-acting analgesics, such as morphine and buprenorphine may be used safely with MAOIs, but may require a dosage adjustment."

Just searching the web, I'm not seeing much to indicate that there's a danger involved. I'm sure someone more resourceful will pop up with a more definitive source giving a clearer and better explained answer soon enough, haha.

leading me to believe that if one mixed a maoi with the right opiate a good buzz could be achieved with less drugs.

[samuraigecko]

Since one never plays with antidepresant or antipsychotic drugs then one would have no idea or any incination of even trying. He mistrusts drugs which change the actual chemical channel which is used for a specific brain function.

Just ones opinion.

[Paracelsus]

Should NEVER be attempted with: tramadol, pethidine (AKA meperidine), (dextro)propoxyphene, fentanyl (possibly also its analogues), and methadone.

I don't know how effective this would be, though. My opinion: there are less serious ways to potentiate opiates.

[fiveleggedrat]

So it's clear that opioids affecting serotonin or norepinephrine should not be mixed with MAOI's. Literature says MAOI gives a sharp increase in CNS depression and hypotension.

It seems the more simple opioids like morphine would be safer with this. Still does not sound safe to Swim, though.

Swim's leaning towards not trying this out firsthand. Sounds too risky and dangerous.

Can anyone give any statistics, like a percentage change to find equivalent dose with MAOI or such. Any info in general's great.

Any experiences on this would be great too. Searched on the internet, but not much on opioid interactions. Tons of info on why not to mix with stims and various serotonin drugs.

[SeconalClerek]

Also Dxm (dextromethorphan) due to a serotonin releasing attribute.

[killersnowman]

swim seems to remember starting that thread. he has yet to get a hold of a maoi like... what is the plant one? ahh syrian rue. he hasnt gotten it yet but he still wants to try and see if the dopamine used in the opioid reaction would lingure longer and produce a profound and long lasting state of innebriation. he only hopes his hypothisis will prove correct.

if you have the link to the original thread could you post it. swim cant seem to find it right now...

nvm http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=91654

the consensus of the group discussing this was that any non synthetic full agonist derived directly from the opium poppy would be the safest to consume with an maoi. but the results have not yet been brought to light // or no one has tried it. which seems unlikely as opiates and maois are amoung the most prescribed in the world.

[SeconalClerek]

SWIMS taking Buprenorphine (Subutex) 2mg daily and Phenelzine (Nardil) 45mg daily, SWIMS noticed no changes in the effect of the opiate due to the MAOI.

Diphenhydramines effect is potentiated with what seems a stronger effect and longer half life i.e. sedation in the morning. SWIMS taken other drugs with Phenelzine always using 10% of the original dose LevoDopa at 10mg usually 100mg it gave a strong stimulating effect but mainly on the body.

Alcohol, only clear spirits (Gin, Vodka, Rum, and Tequila) not tap beer or dark spirits i.e. whisky. The alcohol was potentiated about 1.5x and lasted only slightly longer but gave no different reactions.

Coffee is fine and a slight amount of Tyramine is ok. SWIM thinks that only those whom have headaches from Cheese and Red Wine should be very careful with Tyramine and MAOIs those who don’t should just moderate.

SWIMs also used PEA (Phenylethylamine) with the MAOI Phenelzine and Buprenorphine anyway with once again 10% of the normal dose so about 10mg. Quite mentally stimulating and enjoyable but risky and therefore unadvisable, for Phenelzine inhibits isoform MAO-A and can cause Adrenaline related effects with PEA. SWIM will keep informed on other combinations.

Mixing MAOIs of any type with other drugs and/or chemicals is VERY DANGEROUS and should NOT be tried by persons inexperienced in the use of and treatment of MAOIs.

Seconal Clerek

Reputation Comments on this post:

Very informative post,exccelent job pointig out the dangers of mixing PEA and others with MAOIS.

[fnord]

Which opiates has your friend tried while on the Phenelzine?

[SeconalClerek]

SWIMs only tried Buprenorphine with Phenelzine, however smoking with the Buprenorphine and Phenelzine makes SWIM very tired. Weed also becomes a little stronger but SWIMs found moderation with everything will get SWIY just as high and happy as without the MAOI. Moderation seems to be the key with MAOI's and drugs which don't seriously interact i.e. Weed, Alcohol and tobacco.

Once again MAOIs are DANGEROUS and should NEVER be mixed with other DRUGS!