Oral use - How to chew twist?

[baron samedi]

Can any SWIMMERS with experience of chewing twist give SWIM a beginner's guide on how to? He's never tried it before or even witnessed someone else doing so (pretty rare in SWIM's country, he thinks), so is an amateur.
Basically, how much to use, which part of mouth to put it in, whether to chew or suck, how long to keep it in mouth etc?
Any advice appreciated.

[mouthwater]

How experienced are you with chewing or dipping tobacco? Moist dipping tobacco (such as Copenhagen and Skoal) is often kept in the front of the mouth, either in the dead centre of one's lower lip or offset to either side about an inch.

Chew is often placed a little further towards the back of the jaw. Whereas dipping tobacco generally just sits in one place, and the user occasionally 'juices' it by sucking their lower lip, chew is moved around more frequently. It holds together much better than dip, because it's not shredded. The user manuevers the chew out of its pocket and onto their teeth and softly bites down on it. This will 'juice' the chaw and the user will need to spit soon afterwards. This is done to help shape the chew and to 'juice' it. Then, the user manuevers the chew into either side of his jaw until they feel inclined to gnaw on it in the phuture.

I keep my chews in for about 45 minutes, but most only leave theirs in for 15-20 minutes. Don't chew too much your first few times or you will get sick. For now, a piece about the size of the end of one of your fingers to the first joint below the nail is a good size to begin with. Roughly about the volume of six quarters stacked on top of each other.

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thorough instruction

[baron samedi]

Thanks a lot Mouthwater, really helpful.
SWIM has zilch experience with any kind of chewing tobacco, chew or dip, unless one counts nicotine gum, which SWIM gave up on after receiving nothing in the way of effects the only time he tried it.
Pretty much all of SWIM's queries were covered, but just wondered what you meant by the six quarters reference at the end?
Incidentally can SWIY give any comment on the merits of chew vs dip? So far SWIM has only seen twist for sale in his country, but would like to experiment with all the various types.

[mouthwater]

I'm happy to help. The six quarters bit was an attempt at giving SWIY a rough estimate of how much chew SWIY should put in for SWIY's first time, since I don't want SWIY to get sick. The following picture gives an example of how much chew I'd recommend SWIY put in SWIY's mouth for the first time. The size of the finger outlined in the box.

http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/7389/dickshitoh0.jpg

I prefer dipping tobacco because it's easier to carry around, it's more available than other smokeless tobacco products in my area, and because I've grown to appreciate various products. The stickied thread in the tobacco forum has some information about the different types of products.

Chew is easier to put in and take out, although juicing it (biting down on it) is typically more nauseating for the user than juicing dipping tobacco.

[baron samedi]

Just to report back on SWIMs first experience with twist he followed SWIMouthwater's advice as closely as possible, but still feels he may have been doing something wrong. He was certainly bringing up plenty of foul-looking brown spittle and had very bad cottonmouth after he finished chewing, but did not seem to experience the overwhelming nicotine hit that he had been expecting.
Could SWIMouthwater clear up a few of the finer points of chewing this type of tobacco for SWIM, at least as much as he can.
Can SWIY tell SWIM a bit about the mechanism through which the nicotine is absorbed i.e. do you absorb it through the juice in the mouth or the lump of baccy held in the cheek?
How often and how long would the average SWIM chew for?
Does SWIM just let the baccy sit between his gum and cheek or does he literally suck on it a bit to absorb the nicotine?
How long should SWIM be holding the spit in his mouth and how often should he get rid of it, on average?

Sorry if some of SWIM's queries are impossible to answer properly. He's sure most baccy chewers don't have any particular timescale and have different methods of chewing but SWIM doesn't know anyone who chews, so is really in the dark. Maybe twist is not the most convenient for a beginner.

[mouthwater]

Originally Posted by baron samedi

Can SWIY tell SWIM a bit about the mechanism through which the nicotine is absorbed i.e. do you absorb it through the juice in the mouth or the lump of baccy held in the cheek?

From what I understand, it is absorbed by the inferior and superior labial arteries (probably more from the inferior, since that's on the lower lip). The juice, I believe, is where the nicotine is absorbed, because, if I recall correctly, saliva carries the nicotine to these arteries.

How often and how long would the average SWIM chew for?

Well, SWIM dips tobacco about four or five times a day, leaving the chaw in for about 45 min. SWIMost users probably chew as frequently, but perhaps keeping the chaw in for less time (in my experience, most nicotine users use frequently; for casual users, once a day is common).

Does SWIM just let the baccy sit between his gum and cheek or does he literally suck on it a bit to absorb the nicotine?

SWIY literally wants to suck on it. Not constantly, but whenever s/he feels inclined. Biting will help juice the wad.

How long should SWIM be holding the spit in his mouth and how often should he get rid of it, on average?

Most users spit once they can't talk anymore, or when they no longer feel like holding it in their mouth. Once a minute for some, once every five for others. SWIM doesn't salivate as much anymore, so he spits less frequently than when he began.

If SWIY didn't get nauseous from SWIY's first experience, SWIY could try pinching more his/her next time.

[JaWill88]

swim dips constintly about a can a day for a few years. but swims has chewed chew many times before like redman and what not. that is similar to twist, just chew on it, suck on juices, and spit. this is done repetitively while in the mouth. from what swim knows, one gets a lot more nicotine from dip tobacco, such as skoal, copenhagen, and others (swim chews grizzly wintergreen). swiy probably won't get the same nicotine punch from chew tobacco. swim really reccomends dip over chew. it's much better but at the same time probably way more addicting then chew cause of the nicotine one gets out of it. one gets way more nicotine out of a dip for like 20 minutes then they do from a cigarette. a lot more. swim used to smoke cigarettes consitently but started lifting weights so he started dipping. in swims opinion its way harder to quit then cigs. so if swiy isn't addicted to nicotine now, then swim REALLY recommends not doing any of the above. but if swim is, dipping is really the way to go IMO.

[baron samedi]

Yeah, thanks for that. SWIM has been addicted to cigarettes for many years so its too late for him not to start at all.
SWIM doesn't know the merits of the various kinds of chewing baccy, so maybe its not surprising he didn't feel overwhelmed from chewing twist.
From what SWIY says it must be the sucking on the juice which absorbs the nicotine. He must try this rather than spitting the saliva out so quickly.

[mouthwater]

Well, a standard tin of Amerikkkan dipping tobacco weighs 34.02 grams (as indicated on the label). After estimation, I'd suggest the average user gets ~10-15 chews/tin (2.2 - 3.5 grams/chew). If SWIY is chewing 5 grams of twist, I'd explain the weight difference by guessing that twist has more water weight than dipping tobacco, and assume that SWIY is using a "normal[ish]" amount.

[baron samedi]

Yeah thanks,
SWIM was just unsure whether he was using too much for a beginner.
He can definately see how chewing can be addictive. For a long term smoker like SWIM it delivers a superior nicotine hit than he's used to from smoking all day, so is arguably more enjoyable.

[mouthwater]

I love chew because I can pick the banjo while indulging.

[Ididnotinhale]

Change from twists to "dip" it's stronger and in swims opinion works better.

[baron samedi]

PHP Code:

I love chew because I can pick the banjo while indulging 


Do you wear dungarees and drive a pick-up as well?


1 more question regarding weight. SWIM has also tried Oliver Twist bits but they only weigh about 0.2 grams each. He knows they are generally held in the mouth a lot longer than other twist and you don't chew them but would SWIY recommend using several at a time to replicate the good 'ol fashioned chew experience?

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Change from twists to "dip" its stronger and in swims opinion works better. 


SWIM would like to but not sure if its available in EU where SWIM lives.

[mouthwater]

Originally Posted by baron samedi

Do you wear dungarees and drive a pick-up as well?

I wear strapped snow pants and plaid button-downs :)

1 more question regarding weight. SWIM has also tried Oliver Twist bits but they only weigh about 0.2 grams each. He knows they are generally held in the mouth a lot longer than other twist and you don't chew them but would SWIY recommend using several at a time to replicate the good 'ol fashioned chew experience?

I know very little about Oliver Twist bits, sorry.

SWIM would like to but not sure if its available in EU where SWIM lives.

I live in Amerika, so I'm not entirely sure, but from what I understand, dry snuff is much more popular in your area. EU regulations seem to be more objective towards health effects of smokeless tobacco. Ex:

We believe that the partial ban applied to some forms of smokeless tobacco in the EU should be replaced by regulation of the toxicity of all smokeless tobacco. We hold this view for public health reasons: smokeless tobacco is substantially less harmful than smoking and evidence from Sweden suggests it is used as a substitute for smoking and for smoking cessation. To the extent there is a "gateway" it appears not to lead to smoking, but away from it and is an important reason why Sweden has the lowest rates of tobacco related disease in Europe.

- European Union policy on smokeless tobacco: a statement in favour of evidence based on regulation for public health. Tobacco Control. 2004 Dec: 12(4):360-7.

Sorry I can't help you more, I'm mostly phamiliar with Amerikan brands. I'd love to hear about your experience with Twist Bits, though, for educational purposes.

[baron samedi]

I wear strapped snow pants and plaid button-downs :)

That's the spirit!!

AFA SWIM's experience with Oliver Twist goes, he has only tried it once. Probably unsuitable for those with a lot of experience with chew/dip but worth trying if SWIY is looking for a discreet method if unable to smoke or chew openly.
One uses it more like dip than other twists, i.e. sucking as oppose to chewing. It's meant to be kept in the mouth for an hour or so and has a pretty mild, slow-acting nicotine release. SWIM did definately notice a mild, long-lasting nicotine "buzz" but reckons the experienced chewer would probably need a lot more. SWIM needs to experiment further but thinks it would be useful for a non-smoking environment like office, class, bar etc..

[baron samedi]

Would SWIM be right in assuming that the method used and quantities involved for chewing plug or scrap are the same as the twist method?

[mouthwater]

I've been unable to afford tobacco recently, but stumbled upon a tin of Skoal Citrus. It's owner disliked the flavour and generously offered it to me (he's in a giving-away stage, where belongings "weigh" him down). Sure, I don't prefer Citrus-- ideally, a tin of Copenhagen Long Cut would've hit the spot-- but I'm more than happy to have taken it off his hands.

baron samedi, I definitely received those vibes from a few weeks ago, so here's some for you. Enjoy!

[baron samedi]

SWIM sure got those vibes man! He could almost make out the sweet sound of a banjo being picked on a front porch swing if he strained his ears enough!

Out of interest SWIY mentioned you chew/dip 4 or 5 times a day, on average. Does SWIY leave a specific amount of time between each session i.e several hours or so, or just whenever it takes SWIY's fancy? SWIM likes to space out his nicotine intake so as to enjoy each "buzz" all the more.

[mouthwater]

Originally Posted by baron samedi

SWIM sure got those vibes man! He could almost make out the sweet sound of a banjo being picked on a front porch swing if he strained his ears enough!

Out of interest SWIY mentioned you chew/dip 4 or 5 times a day, on average. Does SWIY leave a specific amount of time between each session i.e several hours or so, or just whenever it takes SWIY's fancy? SWIM likes to space out his nicotine intake so as to enjoy each "buzz" all the more.

It really depends how the week is going. This last has been hell; just picked up two cans-- Cope Straight & Cope Long-- after killing my last tin in 30 hours. When I don't have so much work, I go through about two-three tins a week; six chews/day, for an average of 45 minutes each. I kept one in yesterday for ten minutes and another in for almost two hours. At that point, though (2 hour chaw), the nicotine was long gong and I was satisfying my oral fixation. I usually chew for 30-45 minutes. I think that's on the longer-side of most smokeless use.

Hopefully, once I have time to alleviate my stress w/o using drugs, I can cut back to a tin/week.

So where are all the other dippers at? Surely there must be some chewers living outside of your lightbulbs and paradise...