Drug info - Possible to get a buzz/high from 5-HTP?

[Lettish]

My friend's looking into 5-HTP recently, he's very fascinated by it. He can't seem to find any information about the above question though.

As far as he is aware, 5-HTP produces serotonin but does not necessarily release it (like MDMA does). His question is, if enough 5-HTP was consumed to produce enough serotonin, would the body try to release it? And if so, would that release give him a buzz/high?

Secondly, if he consumes 5-HTP to produce serotonin, and then consumes MDMA, would he experience a better/stronger/higher trip?

[sterling77]

The mechanism of serotonin production is under repressible control- meaning it prevents excess amounts of accumulated serotonin by slowing down production, aka feedback inhibition. That being said, swim has felt a pleasurable "high" a handful of times but it is hit or miss. It usually just consists of a drowsy type of feeling. For the question about mdma UTFSE.

[Lettish]

My friend says it's hard to search for the answer to a question like that, without sifting through pages of threads. Keywords? MDMA, 5-htp, trip. Extremely common in this forum. Isn't it just easier for someone to give the answer again?

[chrisn]

Hydroxy, check out this Erowid report: http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=42885

It certainly seems to indicate the possibility of the combination being amazing, however I do wonder about the safety of such a high amount of 5-htp and whether serotonin syndrome would be a risk. Can anyone comment on the safety of what the person in this erowid report did?

[fnord]

a friend of mine and another user of this forum hempy666 has a friend who has injected 5-htp cant remember what his friends results were.(pm him with a link to this thread if you want to know)

grandma loves 5-htp she finds it increases the effects of pot and dxm greatly even thought many claim mixing it with dxm is risky,she has yet to find/see any evidence confirming that anyone has had problems mixing these two.

[Lettish]

My friend says thanks for the responses - he found an old thread after sifting through this forum. He notices much talk of piracetam and 5-HTP. Some people say 5-HTP hasn't enhanced the roll at all, in fact in some cases it weakens it. Others say it makes their roll better. Strange how it varys. My friend guesses there's only one way to find out how it affects him... He is just unsure how much to take.

[meep]

Swim finds 5-HTP will give him a mild mood lift in the form of patience but once that wears off, swim will feel sleepy (which is almost never when hes stright)


Swim always preloads and doesn't notice an different on the roll, the preload is all about the day after. Swim finds preloading 100mg of 5-HTP each night, 5 nights before the roll and 100mg the morning of his roll then 300mg the morning after his roll bring his head round quicker and has yet to suffer the crippling blues he once had without 5-HTP.


L-tyrosine give a caffeine type buzz and gives the initial come up a speedy buzzy feel that fades into the roll nicely though.

If swiy's not planning to preload that week, take around 400mg. Some say it can make you feel sick but swim never does - this has not affected swims roll he doesn't think.

[fnord]

Originally Posted by Micklemouse

Can you give us a justification for those claims, Sarbanes?

many say that comining 5-htp with serotonegic drugs can cause serotonin syndrome grandma has taken massive doses of 5-htp along side pot and heroic dxm doses in the distant past without a single problem besides once her brain farted for a day.

http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/sho...ighlight=5-htp

[meep]

Swims packet of 5-HTP is sold in the form of sleep aids (which it also does, very well) and 2 before bed are advised. Each pill is 100mg.

Originally Posted by fnord

5-htp along side pot and heroic dxm doses in the distant past without a single problem

It might well have been this granny that turned swim onto the idea of 5-HTP with pot and it certainly goes well.

[Jacco]

Swim wonders about combining 5-HTP with 5-HTP->5-HT enzymes or drugs that encourage production of serotonin. Do such exist?

[Paracelsus]

Jacco: 5-HTP is converted to serotonin by l-aromatic amino acid decarboxylase, which is present in large amounts just about anywhere in the body. Consuming more of the enzyme would not do much except if taken in heroic doses.

[Micklemouse]

Originally Posted by Paracelsus

Jacco: 5-HTP is converted to serotonin by l-aromatic amino acid decarboxylase, which is present in large amounts just about anywhere in the body. Consuming more of the enzyme would not do much except if taken in heroic doses.

Or if clinically deficient in it...

From The National Dysautonomia Research Foundation (NDRF)

Aromatic L- Amino Acid Decarboxylase Deficiency: an enzyme of the lyase class that catalyzes the decarboxylation of aromatic amino acids, notably converting dopa to dopamine, tryptophan to tryptamine, and hydroxytryptophan to serotonin. The enzyme is then bound to a pyridoxal phosphate cofactor and occurs particularly in the liver, kidney, brain, and vas deferens.
Clinical Presentation: Symptoms may include temperature instability, ptosis of the eyelids, hypersalivation, distal chorea, swallowing difficulties, drowsiness, irritability, truncal hypotonia, oculogyric crises, pinpoint pupils.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aromati..._decarboxylase

Cannot find any info on effects of excess of AAAD, but I'll keep looking. Meanwhile, if not clinically diagnosed, by a professional, with a deficiency there should, as Paracelsus states, be no reason to supplement.

[Lettish]

My friend is doing a little experiment. He is going to consume MDMA on 5-Jan-08. On 17-Dec-07 he got some 5-HTP and has been taking 3 x 100mg daily. He will continue this dosage until 5-Jan-08 and see what happens.

What he has discovered so far, even after just six days of dosing, his mood has generally been a lot happier and he is sleeping so much better. Is this normal or is this just placebo?

He will post his findings here after the 5-Jan-08 event.

[meep]

Originally Posted by Hydroxy

his mood has generally been a lot happier and he is sleeping so much better. Is this normal or is this just placebo?

Totally normal. Cant recomend 5-HTP enough.

[Jucifer]

SWIM once took 200mg of 5-HTP for 3 days and noticed that he felt happier, and in a better mood than normal. SWIM also said that during this time period his HPPD was more noticable.

[Euphoric]

What was his HPPD a result of? Any theories on why extra serotonin may increase symptoms of HPPD?

[lago]

SWIM discovered the combination of 5htp and piracetam consistently resulted in a calm mild euphoria not unlike hydrocodone. It also made the smallest amount of alcohol give him a horrible headache. He also found that slightly larger amounts of 5htp gave him horrible flatulence and caused the opposite of euphoria in his roommate.

[Zaprenz]

Originally Posted by Jacco

Swim wonders about combining 5-HTP with 5-HTP->5-HT enzymes or drugs that encourage production of serotonin. Do such exist?

It actually makes more pharmacological sense to give 5-HTP with peripheral INHIBITORS of aromatic-L-amino-acid decarboxylase. [Very similar to how L-Dopa is given in parkinson's patients] - Well in theory anyway.

Why?

5-HT (Serotonin) does not pass the BBB (Blood Brain Barrier) so any 5-HTP converted in to 5-HT(serotonin) in the blood (by peripheral aromatic-L-amino-acid decarboxylase enzymes) will not get in to the brain and will cause numerous peripheral side effects.

So the logic:

E.g Carbidopa (peripherally acting aromatic-L-amino-acid decarboxylase inhibitor, not active inside brain)

• Decreased 5-HTP -> 5-HT (Serotonin) in blood. (less peripheral 5-HT - good, more remains as 5-HTP )
• More 5-HTP available & enters via BBB (more 5-HTP converted in to 5-HT(serotonin) inside brain)

Well that's the theory!

It works very well for L-Dopa in treating parkinsons disease. However very little evidence of benefit with 5-HTP & possibly more side effects (could be from inhibitors themselves). Essentially not much evidence either way when dealing with 5-HTP & inhibitors.

The combination may also have more interactions with other medication.

4.2.2. Coadministration of carbidopa

The conversion of 5-HTP to serotonin is regulated by the enzyme aromatic l-amino acid decarboxylase (Boadle-Biber, 1993), the same enzyme that regulates the conversion of l-3,4-dihydroxyphenylalanine (l-DOPA) to dopamine. Patients with Parkinson's disease often receive treatment with carbidopa–levodopa, a combination of the decarboxylase inhibitor carbidopa and l-DOPA. By blocking peripheral conversion of l-DOPA to dopamine in the periphery, more l-DOPA penetrates the blood–brain barrier. The same rationale exists for administering carbidopa along with 5-HTP. In a recent study of healthy volunteers, the addition of carbidopa resulted in a 14-fold increase in 5-HTP plasma levels (Gijsman et al., 2002). Efficacy studies have been conducted both with and without the addition of a peripheral decarboxylase inhibitor (PDI). However, there seems to be no consensus as to whether the addition increases the effect of 5-HTP (Zmilacher et al., 1988).

PMID:16023217

SWIMS opinion:

SWIM is not disputing the potential benefit of reasonable doses of 5-HTP but there is probably a upper limit to any "buzz" or pleasant effects one can get from 5-HTP before side effects emerge. It's a bit like L-Dopa, everyone knows dopamine plays a crucial role in the pleasant effects of many drugs but crudely increasing the precursor can lead to quite unpleasant side effects.

Reputation Comments on this post:

	Good stuff.
	Great post, thanks.