Why so little meth in U.K?

[sambo82]

swim was wondering why there is so little meth in the uk? there is lots of people who enjoy amphetmines and lots are into base (strong ampt) but generally there is no meth?

the uk is 1 of the biggest drug users in the world and lots of other countries seem to have meth problems etc but not england?

[angela20377]

lack of trailer parks?

sorry, i couldn't resist.

swim isn't very educated on the meth use in england, but if what swiy says is true, then it is pretty strange, as it seems like there would be a good number of rural areas where meth could be made.

[FuBai]

Methamphetamine is most commonly made from ephedrine or Pseudo-ephedrine, both of which are common in over the counter cold remedies (sudafed being the most well known). In the USA the supplies of ephedrine and Pseudo-ephedrine were mostly unregulated until the latter part of the 1990's, which meant manufacturers could buy them in bulk from overseas, especially from India. This allowed Methamphetamine to become a popular drug, because commercial production levels were able to be so high. Britain's drug scene almost always seems to lag behind that of America - the only real exception being MDMA - so by the time people were looking to manufacture Methamphetamine in Britain the UK government had already had a chance to look at the American situation and place tight controls on ephedrine and pseudo-ephedrine, which limited the market before it had a chance to take off. The American government is not as flexible or homogeneous as the UK government for many reasons, but primarily because we have no fixed constitution and we have 'fused' powers where America has separate, so they still don't have the same level of control over the precursors that the UK government does. Couple that with heavy lobbying by pharmaceutical companies (who want to be able to continue selling sudafed) and an already large demand and you can see why America produces a lot more that the UK. I am not convinced that this will remain so - I know someone who has found and used Methamphetamine in Britain several times, UK police reports say that it can be found in every city in Britain and it can't be long before the big black markets start to trade in ephedrine.

Reputation Comments on this post:

good answer. alot better than my horrible one haha

[Lettish]

My friend thinks it just hasn't made its full way to the UK yet, still a bit quiet perhaps... Adolf Hitler used something similar to it between 1942-45 and it seems that's the closest it's been (Europe).

[JKLJKLJKL]

I read an article about crystal meth being the 'new it drug' in like cosmo or something. obviously not a positive article, but it was some girly magazine that ran a feature on its worrying increase of uk use.

I've never seen it about.

[steven7]

SWIM has took UK base/amp sulphate kinds whizz for well over a decade and found that period of time, some of the best times of his life, well along with other drugs. but amp shulphate is amazing, i hope meth does become a problem, id love to try it.

im along awaiting the day,...

[Paracelsus]

It might be God taking care of the sanity of the British

Different countries, different situations & customs >> different markets. This also applies to the black market drug trade.

[steven7]

Such a small country compared to the usa, meth heads would flood/ruin the country within weeks, lol = population of the uk even more f__ked up then it already is. The prisons are already full to the brim to start with anyways lol I would dread to think. its here, its just finding it. or of coarse making it. Which isnt really that good of a idea for most english folk.

[enquirewithin]

Originally Posted by FuBai

Methamphetamine is most commonly made from ephedrine or Pseudo-ephedrine, both of which are common in over the counter cold remedies (sudafed being the most well known). In the USA the supplies of ephedrine and Pseudo-ephedrine were mostly unregulated until the latter part of the 1990's, which meant manufacturers could buy them in bulk from overseas, especially from India.....

Fair enough, but why is amphetamine sulfate (almost always badly adulterated by several greedy dealers) so popular? That (and dexedrine and other pills) have been around for many years. Admittedly, for the sake of their sanity, people are better off with weaker 'speed,' but does 'sulfate' have different precursors to meth?

[Paracelsus]

does 'sulfate' have different precursors to meth?

Methamphetamine can be made by synthesizing amphetamine and then methylating it, but that is not commonly done due to the availability of ephedrine. Generally speaking, the definition of 'speed' is amphetamine in Europe and methamphetamine in the US.

[enquirewithin]

I know that methamphetamine, amphetamine sulfate, dexedrine, etc, are all 'speed.'

I can't work out whether this idea that lack of ephedrine/ pseudoephedrine precursors is the reason for the lack of meth in the UK. What precursors are needed to make amphetamine sulfate in that case?

[Paracelsus]

I didn't really care to ever look into this, maybe you could find more in the chemistry fora?

[FuBai]

I got my information from this documentary - http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/meth/view/, and from the fact that know that ephedrine has come under tight control in the UK. I think others may be right in saying that the meth scene is still waiting to take off, because I don't understand why we don't just import already made Meth.

[English_T]

Amphetamine sulphate has got the market pretty much covered and is cheap as hell.

[enquirewithin]

^That sounds like the reason to me!

[Jatelka]

There's an interesting document in the archive here...

http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/loc...=3335&catid=57

About Amphetamine and Meth in the UK

[FuBai]

Originally Posted by Jatelka

There's an interesting document in the archive here...

http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/loc...=3335&catid=57

About Amphetamine and Meth in the UK

I love how the first recommendation they gave was:

"MA is a potent derivative of amphetamines with a substantial health risk and dependence liability. However, based on our review, there does not appear to be a firm foundation and rationale for reclassifying the drug under the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971, at least at the present time. There does not appear to be evidence at present in the UK that MA is causing much harm - but there is evidence form other countries in terms of brain damage from heavy use – also there is evidence in preclinical studies as to why this might be and the fact that MA can be smoked means it is more addictive if used in this way – as AMP cannot be smoked. It is also possible that reclassification could have the unintended consequence of increasing interest in the drug amongst potential users."

What did the government do upon reading this? They re-classified it.

("Methamphetamine - often referred to as crystal meth - was reclassified as a Class A drug on 18th January 2007." - Talk to Frank website)

[rocksmokinmachine]

Low quality, amphetamine sulphate dominates the market.

It is available, just more underground and prevelent in the gay scene. Go to a gay bar in London and one should have no problem.

Another reason is that sudafed tablets now contain phenylepherine instead of pseudoephedrine. The precusors are very tightly controlled in the UK as to prevent what Tony Blair once called a 'meth epedemic'.

[insanec10wnz]

Originally Posted by Hydroxy

My friend thinks it just hasn't made its full way to the UK yet, still a bit quiet perhaps... Adolf Hitler used something similar to it between 1942-45 and it seems that's the closest it's been (Europe).

SWIM Has Gotten Great Glass In The U.K When He Visted With No Problems.
Did'nt Know Anyone That Had Lived There/Had Connections. It's Out There Mabey Scarce But No Doubt Present.

[English_T]

It always has been in the UK but just in small amounts but since the media have splashed it around on tv/newspapers it has created an interest that wasn't there before. That said, I don't think the UK is any closer to meth gaining a big following in the UK now than it was before. Sure there will always be some around but amphetamine sulphate will keep market dominance.

Any surveys are inaccurate because you always get people who will say "oh yeah, I've had that!...I'm connected" and its just bullshit. Apparently, the vast majority of what little does make it here is from Eastern Europe.

Apparently, gay clubs are the first place to look for any indication of its presence due to its uninhibiting effects/prolonged sex overdrive.

[rocksmokinmachine]

SWIM has recently visted his old town and found it available easily. Amphetamine Sulphate is also scarcer than it used to be.

Maybe it is gradually creeping its way in.

[English_T]

Originally Posted by insanec10wnz

SWIM Has Gotten Great Glass In The U.K When He Visted With No Problems.
Did'nt Know Anyone That Had Lived There/Had Connections. It's Out There Mabey Scarce But No Doubt Present.

Hitler was using Methamphetamine via daily injection and many, many other pharmaceuticals and weird concoctions. Problem was he met a Dr and that Dr totally took over his life with various drugs resulting in him losing touch with reality/mental problems. In conjunction with the parkinson's disease he had led to serious mental degradation and possibly lost Germany the war.

(Look at Hitler pre War and post war, the difference is frightening. Or better still check photo's prior to his meeting this Dr and then each year after that, that Dr sucked all the life/intelligence out of him)

[cook_justakid]

meth is definitely here in England, swims "friend" smoked ice & crack working in some London broffle, that same friend doesn't reveal all but clearly has a lust for crystal, talks passionately in craving about the type of pipe they would be smoking from... swim can see the memories of it's power in swiys acting out explainations of it all, swims mate got a base amp problem, drink problem, hits the crack pipe like no other (even as swiys hiding half swiys use from swim) and claims to not have any benzo or opiate addiction, but has done smack dozens upon dozens of times (swims friend lies to herself too much for swims comfort). swim wishes swim did not care.

[raissa de saia]

Originally Posted by FuBai

Methamphetamine is most commonly made from ephedrine or Pseudo-ephedrine, both of which are common in over the counter cold remedies (sudafed being the most well known). In the USA the supplies of ephedrine and Pseudo-ephedrine were mostly unregulated until the latter part of the 1990's, which meant manufacturers could buy them in bulk from overseas, especially from India. This allowed Methamphetamine to become a popular drug, because commercial production levels were able to be so high. Britain's drug scene almost always seems to lag behind that of America - the only real exception being MDMA - so by the time people were looking to manufacture Methamphetamine in Britain the UK government had already had a chance to look at the American situation and place tight controls on ephedrine and pseudo-ephedrine, which limited the market before it had a chance to take off. The American government is not as flexible or homogeneous as the UK government for many reasons, but primarily because we have no fixed constitution and we have 'fused' powers where America has separate, so they still don't have the same level of control over the precursors that the UK government does. Couple that with heavy lobbying by pharmaceutical companies (who want to be able to continue selling sudafed) and an already large demand and you can see why America produces a lot more that the UK. I am not convinced that this will remain so - I know someone who has found and used Methamphetamine in Britain several times, UK police reports say that it can be found in every city in Britain and it can't be long before the big black markets start to trade in ephedrine.

Although the historical quote matches reality I d think it d be much easier in the uk to produce meth as the regulations are not so tight in respect of many raw material for meth production: I2 being an example of which one can get a bunch and no one will say a thing. I d rely a lot more on the cultural aspect. although a huge populatin in the UK is driven by drugs during weekends and so on there is still a lot of scepticism and prejudice in these drug communities as to the use of meth. The situation is changing though

[rocksmokinmachine]

Originally Posted by raissa de saia

Although the historical quote matches reality I d think it d be much easier in the uk to produce meth as the regulations are not so tight in respect of many raw material for meth production:

Yes, you would think so, but now even cough and cold remedies are starting to contain phenylepherine instead of pseudoepherine in a Labour style "new super drug threat". Also illict produced amphetamine sulphate dominates the European market. Methamphetamine is scarcley available in bigger cities. This was probably 6 months ago, things may have changed.