Amphetamines and Opiates - Synergy or Danger?

[nleksan]

SWIM is prescribed 10mg of Desoxyn (d-Methamphetamine) a day. He also loves his opiates, primarily hydrocodone, oxycodone, codeine, and morphine. SWIM is aware that mixing uppers and downers is dangerous, but what he does not know is exactly how dangerous it is. SWIM is in good physical health, normal BP and HR.

SWIM has become very accustomed to his Desoxyn, and does not feel any sort of "high" off of it anymore. In fact, it makes him feel very normal and able to focus. In short, he has developed a tolerance for it.

SWIM does not take opiates daily, but his tolerance is growing. SWIM enjoys 150-240mg of codeine, 30-40mg Hydrocodone, 15-25mg Oxycodone, OR 30-50mg of Morphine (he does not combine any of the stronger ones, but will sometimes add 30-50mg codeine to "boost" the high). SWIM knows these are not terribly high doses, he does not even get nausea or vertigo from them anymore.

SWIM really just wants to know if there is any real danger in the doses that he is taking (he never takes more than is listed). SWIM feels that it is safe, but would like to hear fellow SWIMmers' opinions on the matter. Thanks in advance.

Reputation Comments on this post:

	very interesting question, swim is also curious
	i was wrong, meth can be prescribed in the U.S. you taught me something i didn't know

[Laudaphun]

SWIM is in sort of the opposite situation of SWIY. She is prescribed both suboxone(buprenorphine) and methylphenidate. While suboxone use is daily as she is physically dependent on it, her use of methylphenidate is infrequent... SWIM typically only uses methylphenidate in the academic setting or for school-related activities. When she takes methylphenidate, it is typically about 1-2 hours after taking suboxone.

EDIT: SWIM is afraid to take the methylphenidate TWICE a day EVERY day as it is prescribed in fear that she will become at the least psychologically dependent on it. Actually some chronic pain patients are prescribed stimulants to fight over-sedation caused by large doses of pain meds(probably mostly opiates).

[GForce]

SWIM takes adderall very often since he is prescribed it and he has taken opiates on top of his prescription without any problems. He is very "experienced" in taking amphetamines though so if SWIY is looking to take recreational doses of both SWIM's experience might not be of much help. SWIM is curious about how medical professionals would approach the situation though because he has a prescription to adderall and has to get his wisdom teeth out in the next few months. He doesn't want to not get prescribed an opiate pain-killer because of adderall so if that would happen he would want to know ahead of time not to mention he takes adderall. He would probably stop taking adderall while he was medicating himself for pain anyways.

[Donmeka]

SWIM enjoys opiates as well and takes desoxyn (methamphetamine) daily, he was taking hydromorphone everyday before he refilled his scripts and the desoxyn stops his urge to do opiates whatsoever which SWIM sees as fantastic but maybe once a month SWIM would like to enjoy some opiate like OC, hydromorphone or heroine IF it is safe. if not SWIM will stay away for good or only take an opiate on an extremely special occasion many many months apart.

[nleksan]

Wow, SWIM had forgotten that he had started this thread, lol! A little update since he first started this thread; he is now on 20mg Desoxyn a day along with 2mg clonazepam and 30mg temazepam. Recently (past two months) he has had access to a virtually limitless supply of codeine, hydrocodone, oxycodone, hydromorphone, morphine, methadone, you name it. He started to really indulge in opiates (100mg hydrocodone could be taken to little effect; 8-12mg IV Dilaudid or 50-75mg IV morphine had him feeling good and itchy). He stopped taking opiates with a 4 day taper ending yesterday. He went from the previously mentioned doses to nothing in four days with the help of some Norco's (10mg Hydrocodone/325mg APAP) and Percocet (7.5/10mg Oxycodone 500mg APAP), which seems to him a fast taper. Luckily, the only withdrawal so far has been diarrhea and increase in knee pain (he has a chronic degenerative knee problem that still can't get him adequate pain control/opiates from doctors), which was expected; maybe a bit of dysphoria.

But his main point is that over those two months, not once did he have an issue regarding the (meth)amphetamine use combined with opiates. The only thing he might have noticed is that it would take a higher dose of opiates to "nod", which he usually didn't shoot (edit: sweet unintentional pun) for anyway. In that respect, though, he can see how speedballing is so dangerous because he could have easily upped his opiate dose 30-50% which very well could have been too much.

So, SWIM has learned that moderation is key. Take SWIY's normal dose of each for a decent time, or tilt the scales one way or the other depending on SWIY's mood: i.e. half usual dose of amphetamine and 150% dose opiate. It has made for pleasurable experiences for SWIM (and in said ratio he still slept damn well!).

[IntrepidTraveler]

Yes, SWIM tells me that the only real danger when using the two in low to moderate doses is that sometimes he feels like the extreme effects of each--i.e. the soothing feelings of well-being on opiates and the amped up feelings and euphoria on amphetamines--somehow get obscured or dampened when the two are taken in combination. However, since SWIY is mixing uppers and downers, it's always advisable to keep doses moderate and to remain cautious at all times.

[ro3bot]

SWIM has been researching benzodiazepines and amphetamines (specifically Clonazepam [Klonopin], Dextroamphetamine [Adderall XR], and Lisdexamfetamine [Vyvanse]) pretty thuroughly for the past 8 hours, ironically, completely ignoring the paper SWIM took the adderall to write! SWIM got too interested in the new pills SWIM had recently aquired from a friend, and decided to figure out how to make the best of them.
SWIM is pretty new to the whole realm of pharms and SWIM is very insterested in the effects of these drugs and the effects of combining them with each other as well as other substances.
Reading SWInlek's post, SWIM has become slightly confused. SWInlek speaks of combining amphetamines and opiates without much of a problem. SWInlek specifically cites combining Clonazepam and Hydrocodone. In SWIMs extremely limited experience SWIM has come to believe that Clonazepam is a benzodiazepine, not an amphetamine. Can someone (preferably SWInlek) straighten out wether SWInlek is saying that SWInlek can combine amphetamines and opiates w/o a problem? Or did SWInlek just mistake/miscategorize Clonazepam for an amphetamine? It would really be fantastic if someone could tell SWIM if its safe to mix low doses of Hydrocodone (or Oxycodone) with equally low doses of Clonazepam? When SWIM says "low Doses" SWIM is refering to SWIM's usual recreational dose. SWIM happens to be a lightweight so thats about 20-25mg Hydrocodone and SWIM isn't too sure about the Clonazepam quite yet. SWIM plans to take some Clonazepam (probably about 1.5mg) as SWIM's first benzo tomorrow night to see how it goes. If the effect of the Clonazepam is as dissapointing as some accounts lead it to be SWIM plans to take a couple more (no more than 3.5mg total for this is SWIM's first time on any benzo.) Regardless of how SWIM feels after taking the Clonazepams SWIM plans to experiment with the effects of caffine, alcohol, nicotine, possibly Marijuana (Although SWIM will only smoke weed as a last resort on account of reading much information about how if anything marijuana would offset a majority of the desireable effects of the Clonazepams.) SWIM has read all the information he could possibly find about the dangers of mixing benzo's with too much alcohol ad SWIM plans to consume at a slow pace and to keep careful track of SWIMs drink count. Now SWIM wouldn't want to black out or do something too stupid.

[Laudaphun]

SWIM is doesn't know much about amphetamine but methylphenidate and buprenorphine seem to be a relatively friendly combination. Please keep in mind that SWIM has been taking buprenorphine at a regular daily dose for 2 years and is thus tolerant to it. Basically, buprenorphine has little effect on SWIM. However, after SWIM got prescribed methylphendiate, SWIM discovered that when the effects of the two drugs took effect at the same time, it seemed to have a stronger effect. Normally, SWIM can barely tell when she takes her daily buprenorphine dose, however the methylphenidate seems to bring some of it's old magic back. Nothing spectacular, but worthwhile to mention. So far, SWIM doesn't see any negative side-effects from the combo. Both drugs are taken only as prescribed... SWIM has finally learned that drugs are far more beneficial when used rather than abused.

SWIM's big question right now is how to most effectively use benzos with methylphenidate. SWIM has become more comfortable with taking the methylphendiate regularly, but isn't comfortable combining benzos with methylphenidate quite yet as she lacks the experience. SWIM doesn't often take a benzo during the day, but occasionally runs into the situation where it is needed. I guess that is a discussion for another thread.

[Ididnotinhale]

The major danger of mixing the two is that the upper will likely make the user to not fully feel the opiate making him/her more likely to take more. The mix between uppers and downers seem to be the major reason why people overdose, so just be careful, with the mg of opiates swiy claims to take he should be totally safe, just don't go up swiys doses.