Opinions - Using a Vaporizer vs. Smoking

[realitybias]

Some friends of mine got together and bought a vaporizer. They have smoked off of it for a week, and the reaction towards it has varied from "I hate it, it doesnt get me high" to "Wow... this is the highest I've ever been in my life." So they got together to talk about their experiences with using a vaporizer and have come up with a few observations. The things that they found to be true should be similar for any high-end vaporizer. SWIM would recommend against using any vaporizer that costs less than 300 dollars, namely because these vaporizers often use substitute parts that can be hazardous to your health, such as plastics that release toxic fumes, and often have little control of temperature, sometimes releasing tars in the process.

- SWIY's weed will seem to last four times as long. SWIY can buy a gram or a gram and a half and get a whole group of people high. None of my friends were ever able to successfully finish a full bowl off of the volcano to themselves, they simply got too high to keep going. It's funny to see a group of people slowly just shake their head when a bag off of a volcano vaporizer is passed to them, refusing to let themselves get more stoned.

- Vaporized weed tastes GREAT! Stems and seeds turn into schwag, schwag turns into KB, KB turns into chronic, and chronic... well, there is no name for the way it tastes whenever you vaporize it.

- Vaporized weed smells very little. The smell is there, and noticeable, for all of 2 minutes.

- The vaporizer high is VERY different from the smoking high. The vaporizer high seems to ignore couch lock and allows you to function, albeit it will still leave you stoned and happy, possibly more stoned and happy than you've ever been. Its a very energetic brain-buzz.

- The vaporizer high DURATION seems to be shorter than the smoking high duration. This may be because smoking is done over a longer period of time, but people complain about not being able to get high for as long as they can on a joint or a blunt.

- Cigarette smokers seem to crave cigarettes VERY heavily after smoking out of the volcano. We are not sure why this is.

If you have some comments on my friends' observations, please go ahead and let them out. Feel free to also add your own friends' observations.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Thanks for sharing this info.

[Digemlo]

The high from a vaporizer is mostly THC. This is the quality to which SWIM attributes the "clear, clean" high from a volcano, unlike when normally smoking, which adds in many other cannabinoids which, though fun, can cause mild sedation/laziness (in fact, SWIM is greatly annoyed when people call weed "THC" or only talk about the THC on weed, because though it does "get one high", it's usually not the only thing getting one high).

Tell someone's friends to be careful, though--tolerance can build rapidly with a Volcano if one is not careful.

[Digemlo]

Oh, and also, though somewhat "dirty", the used product can be smoked after being used in the Volcano. However, it does taste pretty bad to smoke and can be somewhat harsh.


Another more popular method of not wasting the remains is the put it in brownies. This works, extremely well, and SWIM definitely recommends it.

[cosmicruler]

Originally Posted by Digemlo

Oh, and also, though somewhat "dirty", the used product can be smoked after being used in the Volcano. However, it does taste pretty bad to smoke and can be somewhat harsh.


Another more popular method of not wasting the remains is the put it in brownies. This works, extremely well, and SWIM definitely recommends it.

Doesnt re-using the weed defeat the main purpose of using the vape tho.....???

SWIM find even using hot knives(spots) and letting them cool for a few seconds before picking up the weed and inhaling is a good, efficient way of getting most of the THC without burning all of the unwanted plant material....

[xstalkrx]

When using a vaporizer, such as the high quality Volcano or something of similar quality, how does the high compare to using a bong or smoking from a blunt?

Does swiy become hungry and giggly? Does swiy become tired and enjoy a good sleep a few hours after using? Describe the high in as much detail as possible.

Thanks.

[chemlove]

SWIM found that the "high" is very similar. The taste and easiness on the throat for SWIM (as compared to a bong zong or other instrument) is really nice. At times SWIM feels like you get a higher high, but SWIM has also thought this was all mental. SWIM has always believed that vaps are well worth it especially if you have throat issues or tend to smoke a heavy amount daily/weekly.

[psyche]

Vaporizers should have a lot better efficiency. When you smoke normally, a lot of cannabinoids are burnt instead of vaporized. Could someone throw in some numbers? I'm under the impression that by smoking you would destroy major portion of cannabinoids, and vaporizes would have near 100% efficiency, but that seems like such a big difference that it wouldn't go unnoticed subjectively.

[Whit]

Due to that fact you aren't burning anything (prety much near no burning but maybe there is like 1% or sumin?), you do not inhale any known carcenogens, which can cause cancer

[Shampoo]

Originally Posted by psyche

Vaporizers should have a lot better efficiency. When you smoke normally, a lot of cannabinoids are burnt instead of vaporized. Could someone throw in some numbers? I'm under the impression that by smoking you would destroy major portion of cannabinoids, and vaporizes would have near 100% efficiency, but that seems like such a big difference that it wouldn't go unnoticed subjectively.

There are a few reasons for lost THC in combustion-based ingestion, one of which is in fact the destruction of THC via pyrolysis which yield up to 100 different chemicals. A major portion lost, especially in joints is due to slipstream smoke. For glass, adhesion is a primary loss factor.

Some numbers*
Efficiency of:

Unfiltered joint:
1/13 Cannabanoid/Tar
~20% THC in sample
Single Percolation Waterpipe or Bong:
1/16.9 C/T
Small waterpipe ~25%, Bong ~15% of THC in sample
Filtered joint:
1/16.9 C/T
~20% of sample
[B]Hotplate Vaporizer[/B]:
1/9.75 C/T
~10% of sample
Modern Hot Air Vaporizer:
~9/1 C/T
~60% of THC in sample

Notable difference between vaporizer and combustion-based methods: Due to prolonged exposure and reduced pyrolysis, THC oxidizes to CBN and CBD at a much higher than usual rate, resulting in a less psychoactive smoke, with more physically stimulating components. Thus, more of a "stoney" inebriation results from a vaporizer.

*MAPS, NORML, NIDA

Reputation Comments on this post:

	thanks
	Sweet
	sweet posts in this thread, keep up the good work

[xstalkrx]

What is CBN and CBD? How does this relate to a less psychoactive smoke...or in this case....vapor? swim has a chemistry background so swim should be able to understand the technicalities if swiy could explain them.less psychoactive...more physical? could you explain that a bit more? swim is not very experienced with canabis as it is. basically, is swim going to be laughing uncontrolably at the tv and falling asleep real hard as swim does when smoking it?

[Shampoo]

Originally Posted by xstalkrx

What is CBN and CBD? How does this relate to a less psychoactive smoke...or in this case....vapor? swim has a chemistry background so swim should be able to understand the technicalities if swiy could explain them.less psychoactive...more physical? could you explain that a bit more? swim is not very experienced with canabis as it is. basically, is swim going to be laughing uncontrolably at the tv and falling asleep real hard as swim does when smoking it?

CBN (Cannabinol) and CBD (Cannabidol) are the oxidized analogues of THC. They are non-psychoactive as in have no impact on neurological functions but rather stimulate physical receptors as opposed to psychologically active receptors. This does not mean that the smoke is less inebriating, but that the intoxication is physical rather than psychological. CBN and CBD ingestion results in physical analgesia and pleasure, as well as other physical stimulations commonly associated with a 'stoney' high as opposed to a 'giddy' high. These analogues are also employed in pain-management based medicinal marijuana. Simply put, there will be less giggles, and more 'chill-time'. This degradation is not only a process caused by heat and heat-based decarboxylization (as well as decarb. in the stomach), but also a natural trait of production that varies between strains. Indica dominant strains (Kushs) have higher CBN and CBD contents, while Sativa dominant strains have higher THC v. CBN/CBD contents. Kafiristanica, or "diesel" strains have an even higher THC content with a remarkably low CBN/CBD component, resulting in an almost entirely psychoactive intoxication with little to no physical action.

[BeachBabeluvinlife]

Good question, because Swim too has been wondering the same thing.

[psyche]

The difference of THC/other non-psychoactive cannabinoids ratio between smoking and vaporizing explains a lot, that was the missing piece in my puzzle that bothered me when I long time ago read about the vast efficiency difference in methods. SWIM prefers more mental high than the stoney one, but hasn't ever tried vaporizes. He should propably look into kafiristanica or diesel strains. Or try isomerization of CBD into thc.

[bman1]

smoking brings out cannabinoids and vaporising mainly THC.
Swib prefers to vap all day since to swib Just THC is more " upy" type high. This is what swib prefers also to swib it taste better. swib is a non smoker and really does not like the fullness of the smoke from a joint when burnt. When using a vap it just seems to have the nice sweet flavor of what is smoother not as full or harsh.

when swib uses a bong and burns it release the cannabinoids which bring swib down

[xstalkrx]

So CBN and CBD will still be released in your body, but at a much faster rate? So, there would be some psychological effects, but not as much?

Why is it that the strain with the lowest CBN/CBD profile had the highest psychoactive smoke?

[psyche]

By the way, I looked up "diesel" seeds, which turned out to be "NYC Diesel", and all three sites that I checked said it's mostly indica. They all had the same introduction text of it though.

[cosmicruler]

SWIM finds vaping to be a cleaner and more energetic type of a high...and also saves SWIMs lungs from all that tar and carcinogens....

[xstalkrx]

The last thing I am struggling to understand, is the relationship between CBN, CBD, THC and the kind of highs that they induce.

Why is it that the strand with the lowest CBN/CBD profile produced the most psychoactive smoke? How does this change with vapes?

Confusing. :/

[ThirdEyeFloond]

In SWIMs opinion the high you get by vaporizing depends solely on whatever charateristics what SWIY evaporates has. Smoking soapbar hash will get you the same headache no matter what the route of administration is. Vaporizing kind bud will get SWIY stoned like he usually gets stoned though less material is required. Unless broke SWIM actually dislikes vaporizers, they may be more effective and one could save some bud, the taste is without a doubt better and less hard on the lungs, but the social / ritualistic part of toking is lacking. SWIM likes messing with a joint for eternities, than he can pass it around, have people enjoy themselves for a full ~15 minutes, with vaporizers one hit and the show is over.

@xstalkrx
The indica / couchlock stonedness is dominated by CBN/CBD while the sativa / psychedelic high is dominated by THC. THC will 'degrade' into the others by heat and light. Most hash is more CBD/CBN as it has been heated while being pressed. SWIM stumples upon coldpressed hash made from sativa buds every now and then, if he smokes it as is, it produces a high similar to sativa strains, if he heats it (alot) before smoking it, it turns into the regular stonedness of most hash. Vaporizing shouldn't change this unless the material is heated for long periods of time.

[xstalkrx]

So vaporizing a sativa strand should give swim a psychoactive high while vaporizing an indica strand should give swim a stoney sleepy high?

Will the THC degrade into CBN and CBD once it is in swims body after he uses a vaporizer? Is it inevitable for THC to degrade into the two components?

[psyche]

Indica strains have always more stoney/sleepy high than sativas, indicas contain more CBN and CBD than sativas. When vaporized some of the THC is degraded to CBN/CBD, resulting in more stoney high than the strain would otherwise have. But it's also a stronger high, since cannabinoids aren't burnt, but vaporized. When you smoke cannabis, most of the cannabinoids are burnt to ash or whatever, and only a small portion in front of the fire is vaporized.

In body THC converts to 11-hydroxy-THC by the liver enzyme cytochrome P450 2C9, and that metabolite is even more psychoactive than THC by itself. That is metabolised to 11-nor-9-carboxy-THC, which is excrated mostly in feces and some in urine.

[xstalkrx]

ok so if swim were to vaporize an indica strand....the heat from the vaporizer is going to bring the CBN and CBD out of the THC? Or...does the CBN/CBD exist in the strand by itself as a lone entity alongside the THC?

If the CBN/CBD exist by themselves...then that means that the Indica strands simply have more of them than the Sativa strands?

swim is close to getting a full grasp on this...he promises.

[Shampoo]

Originally Posted by xstalkrx

ok so if swim were to vaporize an indica strand....the heat from the vaporizer is going to bring the CBN and CBD out of the THC? Or...does the CBN/CBD exist in the strand by itself as a lone entity alongside the THC?

If the CBN/CBD exist by themselves...then that means that the Indica strands simply have more of them than the Sativa strands?

swim is close to getting a full grasp on this...he promises.

The CBN/CBD exist endogenously in the plant, but prolonged low heat, like with a vaporizer (as opposed to rapid heat introduction i.e. smoking), will increase the rate and quantity at which THC is oxidized, producing more CBN/CBD as the THC degrades. Indicas do in fact have higher CBN/CBD contents when compared to Sativas, and even more when compared to Kafiristanicas. CBN/CBD define their 'high' through a more analgesic and relaxant related intoxication, and do not have a psychoactive component.

@Psyche. Common terminology for cannabis strains is a wildly mixed up world. Diesels, which range from "Sour Diesel", to "NYC Diesel" and many more, are exceptionally high in THC and notably low in CBN and CBD, and though debated on the "street" market and even argued about at the Cannabis Cup, they are bred from a genus known as Cannabis var. Kafiristanica. As a part-owner and breeder for a medicinal marijuana distribution center, swim has had to keep up with relatively esoteric terminology, which is now being revised to more accurately describe the bredth of the Cannabis spectrum. Kafiristanica strains grow naturally in Southern Asia and some African countries, and have slowly migrated to N. America during the past decade or so. With their introduction came a new need for classification, due to their unpredictable phenotypes and varied breeding patterns.

[psyche]

ok so if swim were to vaporize an indica strand....the heat from the vaporizer is going to bring the CBN and CBD out of the THC? Or...does the CBN/CBD exist in the strand by itself as a lone entity alongside the THC?

If the CBN/CBD exist by themselves...then that means that the Indica strands simply have more of them than the Sativa strands?

All of that is true. Different strains have different amounts of CBN/CBD and THC. When you use vaporizer instead of smoking cannabis, THC is converted to CBN or CBD, so it's like sliding the strain a little bit towards indica. So there's two factors that determine whether the high will be stoney or mental high: strain(CBN vs THC content) and method of ingestion(smoked vs vaporized).

In addition, when you smoke cannabis, you destroy a lot of all of the cannabinoids, THC, CBN, CBD. But when you vaporize, not much will be destroyed, so there will be more cannabinoids left in a vapour. I don't know how much of CBN/CBD is converted to THC, so I can't tell if there's less THC in vapour than in smoke, but I'm pretty sure there's more THC.

[jkolt89]

Although the volcano is one of the best vapes on the market there are several excellent vapes that cost about 120-150. Important thing to consider when looking for one is that it uses convection heating (super hot air blowing through the tobacco) and not conduction

The light bulb vape can be made easily and costs nothing. It works pretty well too, when swiy gets the hang of it

Reputation Comments on this post:

Excellent points for swims who have never used one.