Netherlands - Holland bans Magic Mushrooms

[Alfa]

Last week a 17 year old girl jumped from a viaduct/bridge while under the influence of magic mushrooms. Her parents want to sue the Dutch state because magic mushrooms are legal in Holland. Now a majority of the Dutch government wants to ban magic mushrooms.

Magic mushrooms have been legally for sale in the Netherlands since 1994. During this time millions of doses have been consumed. This is the second person dying in the Netherlands during those 13 years. The other person was a tourist which fell out of a window.

[Abrad]

Isn't there an age restriction on the sale of mushrooms?
As you know, this is almost identical to the incidnet which led to the mushroom ban in Ireland. If she had died under the influence of alcohol would they be campaigning for it to banned?
I do feel deeply sorry for her family but do not feel that her death death warrants a ban on what is an extremely safe drug.
Any links to news articles Alfa?

[Alfa]

There is no legal age restriction, but many shops do apply an age restriction to the sales of magic mushrooms. It is unclear if the girl bought the mushrooms herself. Giving out information is somewhat restricted by law.
All articles and video's are in Dutch so far and can be found here: Kamer wil alle paddo's verbieden

[Nature Boy]

Pretty similar to what happened in Ireland. I fear that magic mushrooms will no longer be legal in the Netherlands soon. If the majority of the government want to ban them, it will happen. I can't see anyone making that hard a stand for their legality. What a shame.

[Abrad]

Just found this article;

www.rte.ie

Dutch consider 'magic' mushroom ban

The Netherlands, well known for its liberal policies on soft drugs like marijuana, may follow Ireland and ban the sale of hallucinogenic mushrooms.

Recently, a teenage tourist in the Netherlands died after jumping off a bridge during a trip.

The Irish government banned the sale and possession of hallucinogenic mushrooms under similar circumstances last year after a Dublin man fell to his death at a Halloween party in 2005.
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Dutch Health Minister Ab Klink ordered a special study into the 'magic' mushrooms and their effects Tuesday. A majority of lawmakers in the Netherlands is in favour of a ban, according to the Dutch news agency ANP.

Both dried and fresh mushrooms can be bought freely in so-called 'smart shops' even though 'actively' dried mushrooms are technically illegal.

Amsterdam, the Dutch capital, has become an international tourist destination because of its tolerance for soft drug use and government-regulated coffee shops that legally sell small amounts of cannabis.

[_caesar_]

That’s terrible news.

The crusade that led to the amendment to the Misuse of Drugs act in Ireland which resulted in the scheduling of Psilocybin was lead by a few.

I hope in the Netherlands there is no blanket ban without a some debate and a thorough investigation to the real risks posed to society from these ethnobotanicals.

It’s unfortunate that the individual in question was not yet an adult; I do believe that the supply of any psychotropic substance to a minor is grossly irresponsible.

Another News Article:

Dutch parliament to ban hallucinogenic mushrooms

A majority in the Dutch Parliament are in favor of a full ban on the sale of all hallucinogenic mushrooms after a French girl committed suicide after taking the drugs, Dutch news agency ANP reported Tuesday.

Dried hallucinogenic mushrooms, or so called "magic mushrooms," are already banned under the Dutch narcotics act, but the sale of fresh mushrooms are allowed.

Ruling parties Christian Democrats and the Christian Union, as well as opposition Liberals and the Freedom Party, all expressed support Tuesday for a full ban of fresh mushrooms.

A 17-year-old French girl died Saturday after jumping off a bridge in Amsterdam while under the influence of hallucinogenic mushrooms. Her parents said the Dutch government should be responsible for their daughter's death because it allows the free sale of the drugs.

The Dutch law makes a distinction between "hard drugs" like cocaine and heroin, and "soft drugs" like the psychedelic psilocybin mushrooms and marijuana, which are considered to be only psychologically addictive.

In the Netherlands, so-called coffee shops are allowed to sell soft drugs openly to individuals for personal use. People are not prosecuted for possession of small quantities of soft drugs for personal use.

The Dutch government hopes such a drug policy can help separate the markets for soft and hard drugs so that soft drug users are less likely to come into contact with hard drugs.

Source: Xinhua

[_caesar_]

Calls for Dutch ban on magic mushrooms

by Gert-Jan Wijma*
28-03-2007

A French couple is holding the Dutch state responsible for the death of their 17-year-old daughter who jumped to her death from a bridge in Amsterdam last Saturday. Her parents say she was not suicidal and that she killed herself whilst under the influence of hallucinogenic or 'magic' mushrooms, and they argue that the Dutch authorities are liable because the sale and consumption of these mushrooms is legal in the Netherlands.

Meanwhile, doubts have been raised as to whether the young woman actually consumed any magic mushrooms. Nonethless, this incident has again brought the issue of these hallucinogenic mushrooms back to the top of the Dutch political agenda, with the main question being whether or not they can indeed bring someone to commit suicide.

Then there is the additional question of whether the Dutch state can indeed be held accountable for the death of the French 17-year-old.
Magic mushrooms - known as paddos in Dutch - is the collective terms used for a number of mushrooms that contain psilocybin and which affect a person's consciousness and can cause hallucinations.
Risky behaviour
According to Harold Wiegel of Trimbos-Instituut, a centre with specialist knowledge in the field of addiction treatment, these mushrooms tend to heighten and strengthen a person's emotions at the time when they are ingested. However, he says that they won't drive someone to suicide:
"But, under the influence of this kind of drug, you do have the tendency to engage in riskier behaviour... to take more risks. That's something we're also familiar with in the case of alcohol. Someone who's drunk too much and drives into a tree isn't out to commit suicide, but does things that are risky whilst under the influence [of alcohol]."
Harold Wiegel says it's important for customers of 'smart shops' - where the magic mushrooms are sold - to be properly informed about what to expect if they actually use the mushrooms. The smart shop in Amsterdam where the young French tourist possibly bought some of these mushrooms had information available in Dutch about the product, and also folders in English and Spanish, but not in the French language.

Alcohol
Erik van der Maal represents a national consultative body of smart shop operators, and he too compares magic mushroom with alcohol. He believes the claim made by the French couple to the effect that the Dutch state is responsible for their daughter's death is absurd:
"If I were in Paris and drunk myself silly on absinthe in some or other sleazy bar, and then went and jumped from the Eiffel Tower, than no one would call the French state to account, would they?"But the death of the young French tourist has revived the debate about magic mushrooms, and there are now calls from some quarters for them to be classified as hard drugs. Ed Anker is a member of parliament for the Christian Union, the smallest party in the current three-way coalition government, and he supports the idea of a ban. He believe the effects of magic mushrooms are in fact much greater than those of, for example, alcohol:"I have the impression that use of magic mushrooms are a forgotten drug. They are not extremely well-known and they're simply heavy stuff. As it is now, young people of 17 are using magic mushrooms while [here] on holiday, and that's because they're so easily available."
Re-examination
The parliamentary bloc of the Labour Party - also part of the current Dutch government - is also calling for a re-examination of the effects of consuming these mushrooms, as party member Lea Bouwmeester explains:
"We need to find out exactly what the active ingredients are, and how many accidents have occurred. Only then would we want to take action."Although the death of the young French tourist has again focussed attention on the effect of magic mushrooms, the likelihood of her parent's proving successful in holding the Dutch state liable for her death is very small. When asked about this, experts point to the detrimental - and sometimes fatal - effects of alcohol, and the fact that these, too, cannot be used as a basis on which to build a legal claim.

From radionetherlands.nl

[Psych0naut]

Unfortunenately the ban on mushrooms is very real. The leading parties in the Dutch goverment are for the biggest part right wing christian parties. One of the major parties in the Dutch goverment, the Christian Union can be regarded as very conservative, and if it's up to them, all drugs are going to be banned. I'm afraid it's going downhill with our liberal policy.

[Bajeda]

Take a look at this -----> http://www.petitiononline.com/paddovb/

I can't read Dutch, but I think I get the general idea. If someone fluent in the language could translate that would be helpful.

Any other petitions / protests or the like around for this yet?

[BBrian]

I'm from the netherlands so I did a translation even though my english isn't perfect, so I hope it's understandable for everyone.

To: Tweede Kamer der Staten Generaal (This is similiar to the Houses of Commons in brittain) I will use 'the government' as a translation for it since that's what it practicly is.

The government is planning on putting a ban on the so called magic mushrooms as a result of the death of a 17 year old french girl that commit suicide under the influence of magic mushrooms. Magic mushrooms should not be legal to sell anymore according to a majority of the of government.


Alcohol and Tobacco are causing for billions of healthcare costs for decades. Alcohol is also causing for deaths, injuries and many illegal actions are taken under the influence of this harddrug. Because alcohol and tobacco became community goods it's normal that these are sold everywhere and a ban on these stimulants has never came to order. Hypocrisy in it's purest form. As long as the politicians can enjoy their wine's and smoke their cigarette we will never have to adress the dangers of these resources?


The fact that there are almost no incidents with these magic mushrooms is proof that the current legislation of hallucinogen mushrooms is sufficient.

However, people under the 18/21 and people with a unstable psyche shouldn't be using psychedelic drugs. A warning that every decent smartshop (the places where they are legally sold in the netherlands) should give to the buyer of the mushrooms. A proper education on drugs is important to anyone before using drugs of any kind. The french girl was most probably not in a good mental condition to take these mushrooms or perhaps not well prepared for what was to come. Everyone knows what happend because of that.




Every grown-up person dat wants to open her of his mind for what magic mushrooms can offer should have the chance to do so. Proper education and checking on the compliance of the rules to sell these mushrooms is what should be looked at, instead of putting a ban on a drugs everytime there is a drugincident. Magic mushrooms have been used by hundredthousands of people with fun and great surprise without many problems for years. Should the dead of one thoughtless girl (which is very sad) be the cause of a complete ban? No, unnecessary. Freedom of Mind is a great thing, let our politicians realise that. Is it up to them to decide whether we may or may not use a almost harmless mind-expanding drug?


What's next, the closing of all the coffeeshops? It's not unthinkable that's also on the list of plans of our new government (it's only been in order for a few months now). The dutch citizen is apparently not allowed to bring himself to another state of mind with natural resources even if he doesn't form a threat to to others, offcourse with some exceptions.


Here by we call for a good reconsideration by the dutch government before putting a complete ban on magic mushrooms. Go with the facts instead of the emotions that came with the death of a girl. A well prepared person with a healthy mind can take magic mushrooms without too much risk. Research and experience of many users have shown this. Take all of this into consideration when forming your judgement and you can only come to one conlusion: The sale of fresh magic mushrooms can stay legal as long as the current compliance of rules is better checked upon. Are you really out there to restrict healthrisks even further? Then obligate the smartshops to give out honest and sufficient information on the magic mushrooms. Let them give out a informative educational (governments)flyer to every buyer. Then there's really not much that can go wrong. We trust upon your objectivity when making a decision.

Sign this petition if you too think its rediculous that the government wants to ban the sale of magic mushrooms as a result of the death of a french girl.


Check out the following links for more information regarding this subject (in dutch):
http://www.nu.nl/news/1020544/12/rss...addo-dode.html
http://www.nu.nl/news/1022467/11/Kam...verbieden.html
Sincerely,
The Undersigned

If you want to sign this petition then click the button and fill out the fields.

Name and email adress seem clear.
The opmerkingen field is for any comment you got.
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Reputation Comments on this post:

	Thank you for providing translation- very helpful and appreciated!
	Very helpful, nice follow up aswell.

[black_chih]

Why is the knee-jerk reaction always to ban? Politicians are too lazy and want a quick and easy solution.

How about alternatives, such as required education or licensing people for being allowed to consume?

I was just in Amsterdam discussing this matter with a local bartender and came to the conclusion that politicians aren't threatened by liquor or cigarettes because when was the last time that someone voiced discontent with a political / social / economic system on these drugs as opposed to mushrooms or cannabis. Conversely how many violent incidents have had alcohol involved?

I've said it before, but the long term effect of banning people from spiritual exploration will be a lot more damaging to society than the few idiots who hurt themselves by trying to recklessly explode their mind instead of using these substances properly, carefully and with respect - for the purpose of personal growth.

[BBrian]

Originally Posted by black_chih

Why is the knee-jerk reaction always to ban? Politicians are too lazy and want a quick and easy solution.

The problem, I think, is that many of the politicians are uninformed about mushrooms, they're no different from most people thinking; mushrooms -> drugs -> bad. That plus international 'pressure' about the freedom of the use of some drugs in the netherlands is what causes the government to think mushrooms should be banned.

How about alternatives, such as required education or licensing people for being allowed to consume?

That is exactly what this petition is asking for... proper education. Many people just underestimate psychedelic drugs, thinking it will just get some euphoric high combined with seeing some weird colour changes or something like that.

How many violent incidents have had alcohol involved?

Well, a lot.. But what most people don't get is that it's not the drugs, it's the psyche of the people using the drugs at the moment they are using it. The drugs just enhance the feeling causing the problems. That is the biggest problem, imo, the ignorance of the many people that alcohol (or any other drug and cause problems) and then get violent or take the car back home.

[stoneinfocus]

Originally Posted by BBrian

The problem, I think, is that many of the politicians are uninformed about mushrooms, they're no different from most people thinking; mushrooms -> drugs -> bad. That plus international 'pressure' about the freedom of the use of some drugs in the netherlands is what causes the government to think mushrooms should be banned.

I´ve seen some inevstigations, orderd by the Netherland government, that were done in order to estimate the dangers and loss of productivity to public health and wealth, resp.,
and the comssion came to the conclusion that mushrooms don´t present a risk to the health or are particularasly dangerous nor that they´re good for
infulenicng the work-capacity.

In swim´s land, the sheet given out by the goernment includes that most unintentional digestions of shroom, are more a pleasant experience, when it was made clear that it´s not toxic or life-threatening.

So I dont know where all these rather positive suggestions are getting lost along the way, to prevent more and more drastic law-making or vice versa.

[johnsonbiscuit]

Originally Posted by black_chih

I was just in Amsterdam discussing this matter with a local bartender and came to the conclusion that politicians aren't threatened by liquor or cigarettes because when was the last time that someone voiced discontent with a political / social / economic system on these drugs as opposed to mushrooms or cannabis.

You've been into a pub right??

[Salvinorum]

MatthijsV, instead of blaming the tourists, your country should accept them and pride itself of its popularity for this reason. I absolutely cringe every time I see a Hollander trying to justify his countrys drug laws to some statist American, when I would think at this point justification shouldn't even enter their mind, they should preach their system by now as a morally and legally superior way of governance.

[Tamadragon]

well it was never legal over here. for any age. or any situation
Doesn't stop SWIM. never has, never will

[stoneinfocus]

I don´t think that giving psychedelics to younger people would be a bad thing, I think giving smokes to them, or letting them buy cigarettes like candies is worse, seen in the view of the kind of addictive patterns it may and in most cases does create, it´s much worse than e.g shrooms LSD et al. and the "pseudo"-hallucinogen cannabis.

And who said, that it wasn´t the girls intention to commit suicide, maybe secretly? -how many suicides are done/year and how good/bad are chances, that those commiting suicide, will plan it and inculde using a drug of any kind in this plan - I mean, hey, you´re about to end your life, why not do anything you think that might help?

[stoneinfocus]

Where swim lives buying shrooms warrants a home search -what a joke! Because it´s class I. So then, hail!

[Tamadragon]

i agree. who cares if SWIM uses mushrooms. it's because it's not taxed by the Man.

the so called war on drugs, more like the war on free thinkers, sucks.

big time

[Alfa]

Back on topic please.

[Tamadragon]

Sorry. But i thought the topic was the war on drugs. which in this case there could be a quick and harsh reaction in Netherlands to the death. It seems that quite a few drugs were banned after someone died. which is unfortunate. i personally thing that anyone under the age of 18 should not use drugs. any form.
but the general banning of drugs is not a good idea.

i'm curious as to how long mushrooms were legal in Netherlands anyway. what sort of restrictions? could you grow them too or only buy in headshops?

because it's pretty hard to ban something that grows in the wild in the fields. it will just go underground. Too many tourists are asking to buy it, for it to just disappear. maybe public education and warnings on the possible dangers (ie harm reduction) would be a better reaction then to outright banning of mushrooms. i hope that was on topic.

anywhich way, first Japan, then GB, Ireland, now the rest of liberal EU. it's a disturbing trend.

in the mean time, the use of real dangerous drugs like alcohol, tobacco etc is going up with the youth. not to mention the fact that meth and cocaine have a real chokehold with the youth here.

we need to change our gov'ts. we need a revolution. away from neo-conservative towards a humanist gov't.

[stoneinfocus]

Originally Posted by Tamadragon

Sorry. But i thought the topic was the war on drugs. which in this case there could be a quick and harsh reaction in Netherlands to the death. It seems that quite a few drugs were banned after someone died. which is unfortunate. i personally thing that anyone under the age of 18 should not use drugs. any form.
but the general banning of drugs is not a good idea.

there shouldn´t be any borders or age limits, just appropiate and loveful education within the human´s growth, depending on his ability to understanding and the pragmatism of the things he´s unevitably in contact with and doing.

we need to change our gov'ts. we need a revolution. away from neo-conservative towards a humanist gov't.

Therefore you´re first statement is pretyy damn conservative, ever thought of throwing all over board, instead of half-assing a so-so-neoconseravative-lpseudo-iberal-deontic livestyle?

What if swim thoughtwith about 7 years of age, that his penis must be good for somethign else than peeing, because girsl are made differently for no obvious reasonm considering th eproces of peeing, will touch it every day thinking of it and chasing orgasms soon later-on? Forbidding it or punish him for doing so and "infecting" others, with his "desease" , because 7 years sis just too young for having wood?

You see, if you set up laws, or borders, there´ll be inevitably the need to punish(so the child will want to punsh and exert power over others too), and the destruction and hinderance, of what could be the most productive way of living, it´s a bad way to educate and usually a very unsuccessive one, not to mention the million other ways of education that can be applied and are just a little more work, but will pay milions in the end, if one was onyl willing to apply some working techniques of education and some love and empythy, along with an own life of experimenting and experiencing as much as possible.

Of course, bad things in life are goin to happen anyway and will always happen, that´s just life, but that´s no reason to cut the peaks for no reasnon at all and let the people become dumb and dumber and in the end make up for a hate-driven, extreme and depressive-stress-full ife, without freedome, creativity and relaxd happieness.

[lulz]

Originally Posted by co-incidence

there shouldn´t be any borders or age limits, just appropiate and loveful education within the human´s growth, depending on his ability to understanding and the pragmatism of the things he´s unevitably in contact with and doing.

Sorry, but I couldn't disagree more with you about age limits.

Educating young people should be a top priority, because if an adolescent really wants to get high they're probably going to do so no matter what laws and controls are in place. Given the fact that it's impossible to restrict all drugs from all people under 18, they should at least have adequete knowledge to reduce any possible harmful usage.

But drug use among people under 18 should be controlled as much as possible, and it would be irresponsible of us to get rid of age limits. An adolescent's brain is still going through tremendous growth and development, and hasn't fully formed yet.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontl...ews/giedd.html

Because it is still going through a period of critical development, mind altering substances affect an adolescent brain with significantly greater consequences than with an adult brain. Some studies have shown a connection between the use of drugs as a teenager, and increased risk of psychological disorders later in life.

http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/325/7374/1195

Because of this potential risk to adolescents, they should be prevented as much as possible from taking mind altering substances until their brain structure has stablised. As soon as their brains have finished developing, let them take whatever drugs they want!

Letting them take whatever drugs they want at whatever age, just because they are mature enough and know what they are doing, would still be completely irresponsible.

Reputation Comments on this post:

	Well stated.
	good points

[podge]

Has there been any update on the legal status of mushrooms in the netherlands yet ?

[Alfa]

No, we are awaiting the new mushroom study.