No pills possible!

[Tjaalie]

Dear Thread reader,

I have a friend with a problem. He wants to do codeine (with the possibility to make morphine out of it some day but first just codeine). But where he lives (holland) there is no way to get the codeine pills without a perscription wich he isn't going to get. Now he knows of some cough syrups that contain codeine but also some stuff that kills you, and he wants the pure thing. So he read this whole forum and the Chemistry forum and there where some Acid Base methods recommendend but those where all for pills. So what is the best way to get it out of the syrup with the heigest yeild? Can he just everporate the syrup at say 60 degrees in his oven and be left with some powder or something and then use the acid base thing? All help will be welcome he says.

[trptamene]

Originally Posted by Tjaalie

Dear Thread reader,

I have a friend with a problem. He wants to do codeine (with the possibility to make morphine out of it some day but first just codeine). But where he lives (holland) there is no way to get the codeine pills without a perscription wich he isn't going to get. Now he knows of some cough syrups that contain codeine but also some stuff that kills you, and he wants the pure thing. So he read this whole forum and the Chemistry forum and there where some Acid Base methods recommendend but those where all for pills. So what is the best way to get it out of the syrup with the heigest yeild? Can he just everporate the syrup at say 60 degrees in his oven and be left with some powder or something and then use the acid base thing? All help will be welcome he says.

Syrup=sugar+water if you evaporate you will be left with the sugar plus whatever flavors/dies/colors are added to the conconction along with the active(s)

BUT,

codeine=codeine=codeine it does not matter where it is, in a pill, in a syrup, or in a reaction mixture.

Therefore, the same principles used to extract codeine from pills should apply to it in syrup form...I have not used TFSE...but off the top of my head i could easily see swiy evaporating the syrup to a solid

then taking this and "pretending" it is some crushed up pills and doing the a/b thing. The exact method may not work because one may have to do extra steps to get rid of whatever is in syrup (maybe washing the aqeuous layer that containes the salted opiates goods) with a some strong solvents like toluene or xylenes and maybe something like DCM. (again i did not read the procedure so this may already be called for)

Now...depending on what exactly is in the syrup one may not have pure codeine but it is definately purer than before!

The most important thing one probably needs to keep in mind is what other active(s) are in with the codeine as these impurities actually cause a physial response in the body unlike something like cellulose. Plus these are frequently added to detract people from using these recreationally.

[Tjaalie]

Thanks for your fast reply.
This will be some expensive thing but if there ain't any bad stuff
in the syrup my friend might just force the gunk into some gelcaps.
He hopes to it only once (or twice) and just buy enough the first time and don't be a cheap ass and have half experiences.

[trptamene]

Originally Posted by Tjaalie

Thanks for your fast reply.
This will be some expensive thing but if there ain't any bad stuff
in the syrup my friend might just force the gunk into some gelcaps.
He hopes to it only once (or twice) and just buy enough the first time and don't be a cheap ass and have half experiences.

If there are no other inactives there would be little problem in capsulating them other than that it may have a high sugar content which can cause nausea (esp on an empty stomach, like one should have when popping opies) plus opiates can be nauseating on their own so this is a triple problem (empty stomach+sugar+opiates=nausea)

Two suggestions:

1)
Research, Research, Research

I can not tell you how many time swim has decided he wants to use a said procedure, sets out to do it and while the stuff is extracting/evaporating/ w/e he will be on D-F and find more, and sometimes conflicting, info about it and find a better procedure or a new thread about the EXACT SAME THING but with much better posts by better posters and people that have much more experience than swim. Read all the info and make sure you understand the chemistry/thought process behind what one is doing...this WILL improve yields and purity because you can edit the process as you see fit and tweek it as the process is ongoing


2) swiy says they only want to do it once or twice and that it is expensive...this is a bad idea!!

you get your stuff through it all in one batch and doesnt work? What do you do then? You have to try to fish out the goods (this can be a lot of work) and try the purification again.

practice practice practice...do the procedure on small scale, see how it goes and tweak it if needed...if it works great awesome!

do it again on the same scale, are the results the same? are you happy with them? Did they improve? If so why? Are they worse? If so why? What did swiy do different?

If they improved, keep going...do more of w/e you did that improved it and see if that makes it better or worse...if it is better than you have to decide if you want to scale up or if you think can keep making better...if it is worse, go back to the previous one...scale that up!

This seems like a lot of work (and it may be), but it is worth it if swiy is wanting a lot of product...and may not really be that much work at all...if swiy tries one on small scale and it works great and swiy is satisfied, screw it, scale it up!

Although it should be noted that not all things scale up good...in general do not scale up greater than a factor of 3 or so if scaling up by 3 fold produces expected results than try scaling up by 10 or 20.

This method is surely tweakable and just shows the thought process behind what swiy is trying to do [take something that is WAY impure (may 1 or 2%) and making it someting WAY purer (>90% and hopefully >97%)] It is worth taking the time to thinking about it and figuring out how to do it right.

[Tjaalie]

Per bottle (100ml) it contains:
0.5mg codeine per ml (so that makes 50mg total)
0.04mg plant stuff with no name per ml
800mg saccharose (seems a lot to me will this kill me?)

So I would need at least 2 bottles for it to take effect.
This is the most well known brand and as with dxm there might be stronger un branded brands that may contain more. But this might not be true.

[trptamene]

-ose=suger

saccharaose=sugar AKA fuel for the body. I don't think 0.8 g of sugar is a problem, my 12oz can of soda i am drinking has 52g in it.

.04mg plant stuff...this is odd? Is this pharmaceutical grade? You just buy this over the counter? Usually plant matter can be removed during the defatting step of and A/B workup (Search for defatting). Or if one is just wanting to evap the water I don't think the plant matter would be bad, but I would be more worried about it than the sugar as "plant stuff" is very indescriptive and seems almost sketch to swim.

What dose does the bottle say to take?

As far as finding a brand that contains more...I think it will be simply finding a bigger bottle....I believe regulations of opiates like these is based on concentration not on total opium weight in a bottle...if this bottle has 0.5mg/ml, I would expect most or all other bottles/brands having the same concentration.

[Tjaalie]

Yeah they all have 0.5mg/ml and the plant matter is some alcohol based union extraction (they use it as advertise on the front of the packet).

[trptamene]

hmm....well, im guesssing/hoping it is poppy plant matter? Are their poppies on the bottle? (that'd be a sweet bottle)

Perhaps the plant matter is more like a "full spectrum extraction" containing many of the minor alkaloids in poppies? I really don't know about this?

How is this advertised? As some type of natural/organic/w/e remedy?

[Tjaalie]

No more a old school grandma grade bottle (looks like it tasts like hell but works).

[Tjaalie]

This is the thing.