Are BZP party pills simply worth it?

[Dalfir]

SWIM has never used BZP pills, but has seen plenty of them around. Charge and Ice and some others. Are the effects of these negligble, even unnoticeable? Or can they be compared to MDMA, at all? Is there any of the trademark empathy and openess of MDMA?

[Abrad]

Are the effects of these negligble, even unnoticeable?

They are powerful psychoactives, the effects would certainly be noticeable.

Or can they be compared to MDMA, at all? Is there any of the trademark empathy and openess of MDMA?

At best they are a poor substitute.

[Dalfir]

Sigh. So disappointing. SWIM doesn't believe he's going to waste his money on a pack. Is MDMA essentially a more rewarding, more comfortable and arguably safer alternative?

Funny how a psychoactive's legal status automatically makes it more acceptable, even to SWIM. BZP, being legal here, just implies that it's safe and alright to use every weekend. SWIM reckons weekly use of MDMA might be less detrimental.

[chemlove]

Lesson time, Just because its legal doesn't mean its safe. My ultra safe uncle drinks whiskey and smokes 2 packs a day, and i'm sure his health is just wonderful.

see its the big misconception that legal things are safe when in fact i believe that to be a true idiots paradise. Not that anyone is an idiot but lots of people drink too much cause its legal makes me a bit sad

[Dalfir]

Yes, SWIM knows that, but years of conditioning has still left him with a faint, trained stigma towards illegal but iconic drugs.

[BackToBasics]

Budgie thinks most people only do BZP once or twice, because of the awful comedown. He only did it a couple of times, and he felt really sick for about 24 hours afterwards.

As Abrad said, they are a poor, poor substitute for MDMA.

[Euphoric]

Won't bother disputing anything here, except that awful comedowns are not present for all users.

[starboy]

BZP is pretty corrosive which means you don't want to snort it or inject it and opinion is divided on how enjoyable it is to consume orally.

What it is good for is to spray all over your overgrown drug legislation to stop it getting out of control. Use it as a starting point to bargain with your government on the failure of prohibition. That's what we use it for in NZ and it has taken nearly ten years but got us to the point where we are at the table renegotiating the whole idea of prohibition, versus allowing development and availability of safer drug alternatives.

It's not the nicest drug in the world but good if you had a methamphetamine binge habit you wanted to substitute something for recreationally to keep partying. That is the problem we had in the city of Auckland in the early naughties and this is how we fixed it. It does not reward binge behaviours. At all.

Reputation Comments on this post:

useful comment

[Zaprenz]

Even looking at other compounds in "party pills" it may be hard to find one that simulates the more complex effects of MDMA.

e.g the potential oxytocin release from stimulating 5-HT(1A) receptors.

[starboy]

They are nothing like MDMA, they are a substitute for methamphetamine not ecstasy.

Some are psychedelic stimulants, but not going make you feel 'loved up.'

[Greenport]

If the (US) government decided which chemicals were legal based on the effects they have on health, this country would have criminalized tobacco and alcohol a long time ago, and legalized pot.

Swim thinks that the government must be finding out that BZP maybe is not as unhealthy as they originally thought ------ because they're making it ILLEGAL soon anyways. (hmm, we're not controlling any population with this chem, yet it's making people happy. Let's ban it!)

This was originally a lot longer but swim thinks he is going to make a separate thread for it.

[starboy]

In NZ alcohol kills 1 people thousand per year, tobacco 5 thousand, medicines about 1500 and "legal party pills" have not been causative in any deaths over 7+ years. Over 26 million pills consumed on 9.5 million occasions by 400,000 consumers over 7 years with no deaths or significant lasting injuries. They may not be the most pleasant drug in the whole world but it is a bit of a stretch to call them "dangerous."

[Greenport]

Thus why they're becoming illegal. They don't kill people and yet they get people high. Oh god, whatever shall we do. Let's all make them illegal...

(So says the crooked politician)

[Mona Lisa]

escapes were my monkey's favourite legal pill. Gave SWIM a nice feeling of trippy euphoria and even some introspection. Quite smooth too and great for enhanced music appreciation. Probably a mixture of bzp, meopp and pfpp.

[OzzBozz]

No piperazine will ever be able to replace MDMA as a subsitute.