Most intense hallucinogen

[Jacco]

Hey,

I'm not sure where to post this, so excuse me if I'm in error posting it here. A friend of mine has lost his interest in drugs recently, I think because he abused one he had access to and lost respect for them. He said he'd try anything that was recommended however, to reinterest him in drugs.

What would you say is the most intense, most life-changing drug that could rekindle appreciation for hallucinogens?

[augentier]

Many will say DMT is the most potent psychedelic known to man..

My cat isn't sure about the level of self-exploration and soul searching DMT allows, so her suggestion is shrooms..she just loves 'em

[Schwag]

Swim says:
Salvia Divinorum hands down (although I haven't tried DMT or 5-MeO-DMT). Salvia has taught me some amazing things about myself, I've come to conclusions I never would have come to without it. Changed my life for the better and it seems to get more interesting each time. I recommend it, easier to find than the above mentioned tryptamines.

[Jacco]

Originally Posted by Schwag

Swim says:
Salvia Divinorum hands down (although I haven't tried DMT or 5-MeO-DMT). Salvia has taught me some amazing things about myself, I've come to conclusions I never would have come to without it. Changed my life for the better and it seems to get more interesting each time. I recommend it, easier to find than the above mentioned tryptamines.

We've tried it before (using a water pipe, 10x standardized extract after attempts with seeds.) I just noticed that something was wrong somehow and then I was pinned to the floor and the wall was the new floor, and light patterns formed in the walls. Not very intense though, I was hoping for more (though it was enjoyable.) Do you have any recommendations on how to make it more intense?

[icantremembermylegs]

get some 40x

SWIM has gone through a gram or 2 of 60x organic standardized and each time it gets more intense

SWIMs friend has done LSD and says salvia is much much more intense and more fun

not to mention the after-glow.. feel good for hours

[Schwag]

Originally Posted by Jacco

We've tried it before (using a water pipe, 10x standardized extract after attempts with seeds.) I just noticed that something was wrong somehow and then I was pinned to the floor and the wall was the new floor, and light patterns formed in the walls. Not very intense though, I was hoping for more (though it was enjoyable.) Do you have any recommendations on how to make it more intense?

Swim says:
A couple things you can do, as SWIicantremembermylegs said getting a higher extract will help. 20x should be enough to throw you into another dimension if you burn a good sized bowl of it. I would suggest using a bong to smoke salvia and a torch lighter to light it, seems to work best that way. Also, like I said before it gets better every time.

[vcdman]

If a person has lost interest in drugs, then perhaps whatever he was gaining from them is no longer there!?

If your friend continued into the land of mind-altering substances without gaining something from it then it sounds like your stressing/hurting your body for no reason! Take up Cigarettes!

On the other hand perhaps a soft gentle experience would be more approriate to re-interest....

[Jacco]

Originally Posted by vcdman

If a person has lost interest in drugs, then perhaps whatever he was gaining from them is no longer there!?

If your friend continued into the land of mind-altering substances without gaining something from it then it sounds like your stressing/hurting your body for no reason! Take up Cigarettes!

On the other hand perhaps a soft gentle experience would be more approriate to re-interest....

Well, when I say he was "abusing" it, I meant he was taking them daily and just accepting the mild visuals as commonplace and unworthwhile, that they couldn't bring him anything. SWIM is trying to get him to gain something from it.

[Nagognog2]

Hallucinogen:BZ

Psychedelic: LSD-25

[Schwag]

Swim says:
I just thought of another thing you might want to try, Ketamine. Never tried it myself but I've been told the K-hole is on the same level as Salvia as far as intensity goes. For a K-hole most people have to snort around 250mg+ and IM inject 100mg+.

[JDreaming]

SWIM recently tried smoked 5-MeO-DMT freebase for a first few times (will be posting on it along with other trips soon). On the question of "what makes one feel like they are hallucinating most intensely", Five is SWIM's new record holder. No, it's not very visual, but in terms of raw physical and emotional reactions, as well as dose-response sensitivity, few if any compounds could possibly beat the sheer intensity of 5-MeO-DMT. One gets feelings of gravity and energy shifting comparable to suddenly rocketing thousands of miles through space only to find oneself back in the exact same spot one started in.

N,N-DMT, while slightly less physically intense, is more likely to leave an experienced tripper coming away with a feeling of discovery. The cohesive, highly visual nature of it's effects make it generally preferable and practically unbeatable for intense psychedelic exploration.

Salvia can come very close to the dimethyltryptamines for raw hallucinogenic intensity at times, but it's much more unpredictable. When SWIM smokes powerful salvia extracts, he sometimes hallucinates very intensely while other times having little or no effects. When other people SWIM knows have taken salvia extracts, response has ranged from intense and life changing, to totally non-hallucinogenic and uninteresting. On the other hand, while SWIM only knows a few other people who have smoked 5-MeO-DMT, it seems like NOBODY escapes a good hit of it without hallucinating.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Very good comparisons

[sp0rkeh]

my yeah ok

[Perception Addict]

4-aco-mipt was lifechanging for swim. Swim thinks it is an alien experience unlike any other hallucinogen (although all hallucinogens are different and everyone feels differently about them, obviously). Swim's only ever taken a small to moderate dose and felt amazing, feeling as though everything around her was creatively inspiring and just having an all around great time. Swim's SO has tried this one at a much higher dose and was equally happy with the results. If swiy's friend has already tried the traditional shrooms, acid etc. miproceten might be just what this person needs to see how magical and new the world can still be.

[fnord]

Originally Posted by Nagognog2

Hallucinogen:BZ

Psychedelic: LSD-25

has bongo tried bz?please post a report for him if so!


for my grandmother,5-meo-amt/dmt was very intense.dmt alone was intense.lsd in the right amounts is awsome.

[robertone]

If some-one lost interest in [taking] drugs he should not take anymore. Losing interest could have a inconcious physical or psychical cause. So don't force or try to force. It is not like he is not eating anymore and getting more skinny every day. It is more like some-one who, appearntly without any reason, has stopped drinking beer. It isn't bad and could just be the next step in personal awareness. Let time do its thing.

[runfrom MURDER]

Doing many-day binges while on the meth. SWIM would see *PEOPLE MADE OUT OF CHAINS* following behind him, and he would actually hear the chains clanking and such.

Then at his guy's house, the paint of the walls would melt off and go all over the carpet.

It was insane.

[Heyoka]

I agree with those who say that working to rekindle interest in drugs is wrongheaded. In time your friend will change and the experience will as well. Don't force it. Consensus reality can be very rewarding.

Playing with meth is asking for trouble.

[Nagognog2]

Originally Posted by fnord

has bongo tried bz?please post a report for him if so!

Bongo had the option of buying BZ from a reputable chemical company, where they listed it as a muscarine antagonist, but decided against it. It would end up as a souvenir in a freezer. Certainly not ingested. It is/was legal. But a three day trip down the rabbit hole to meet the Mad Hatter? Uh uh.

[Beeker]

SWIM would say smoked DMT or shrooms. With shrooms you have to push the dose twice as high as most people would swiy and that can be scary for many. DMT isn't around long enough to give much anxiety to SWIM.

[enquirewithin]

Dissociatives probably give the most intense and and massive visuals. Dr John Lilly, after taking LSD a few hundred times, discovered ketamine and said that it was a 'super hallucinogen."

[Salvinorin A]

Yeah, swim thinks dissociatives are indeed the most powerful.

Salvinorin A can be a whopper and swim's choice if wanting power w/o damaging one's brain.

Otherwise, PCP gets first place. The hallucinations caused by that monster swim thinks surpasses anything else.

Sal-A

[Heyoka]

Originally Posted by enquirewithin

Dissociatives probably give the most intense and and massive visuals. Dr John Lilly, after taking LSD a few hundred times, discovered ketamine and said that it was a 'super hallucinogen."

He also became totally hooked on the stuff to the point he was doseing himself hourly and couldn't even get on a cross country flight without having problems. Ketamine is incredible but only try it if you are SURE you won't have steady access to it. I know a guy who could kick just about anything, meth, coke, heroine. I mean just set it down and cope. Ketamine got him good, though. This was when it was legal and the only way he could get off the stuff was by dumping about 20 grams into the toilet. For him, destroying drugs was sacriledge.

Granted, everyone is different but I felt an intense draw for more the first time I tried it. Addiction is such a drama trip to the point of being a fucking boreing cliche but it can happen to anyone.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Wise warning and good assessment of addiction phenomena. Thanks for the contribution.

[Heyoka]

Originally Posted by Salvinorin A

Yeah, swim thinks dissociatives are indeed the most powerful.

Salvinorin A can be a whopper and swim's choice if wanting power w/o damaging one's brain.

Otherwise, PCP gets first place. The hallucinations caused by that monster swim thinks surpasses anything else.

Sal-A

I seem to remember hearing about Rob Montgomery and Terrence Mckenna trying pure salvinorin-a (my memory is fuzzy here so don't crucify me if I'm off a bit) and it apparently scared the living shit out of em to the point they said never again.

[enquirewithin]

Originally Posted by Heyoka

He also became totally hooked on the stuff to the point he was doseing himself hourly and couldn't even get on a cross country flight without having problems. Ketamine is incredible but only try it if you are SURE you won't have steady access to it. I know a guy who could kick just about anything, meth, coke, heroine. I mean just set it down and cope. Ketamine got him good, though. This was when it was legal and the only way he could get off the stuff was by dumping about 20 grams into the toilet. For him, destroying drugs was sacriledge.

Granted, everyone is different but I felt an intense draw for more the first time I tried it. Addiction is such a drama trip to the point of being a fucking boreing cliche but it can happen to anyone.

Lilly was an early addict ('repetition trap,' he called it). He took it most of the time for a year, before having a serious accident, and was still taking it in his early eighties. My budgerigar loves it-- it's more hedonistic than cocaine or heroin (what do they do?) and it reveals metaphysical secrets, but he couldn't take it everyday. Partly because he has a job, partly it really has a hangover. And sometimes it gives nightmares!

:

Originally Posted by Salvinorum A

Otherwise, PCP gets first place. The hallucinations caused by that monster swim thinks surpasses anything else.

More than ketamine?

[Salvinorin A]

Originally Posted by enquirewithin

More than ketamine?

Oh yes definitely, at least in swim's opinion. Not that dirty stuff though, but some really pure PCP, swim thinks it digs the K-hole at least 1000 feet deeper.

This is also a high doses of PCP, not just for the buzzy dissociative feeling. But ketamine is definitely a powerhouse of its own.

But now that swim ponders more about it, he changes his vote back to Salvinorin A, because swiy would need so little of it (compared to other dissociatives) to get for example a "level 6" trip which is supposed to be amnesic. It's kind of a toss up, because if swiy takes too much sal-A, swiy would get no trip at all.

Sal-A