Combinations - Create actual hallucinations?

[khrma]

SWIM is getting interested in making a cocktail of pyschoatives that could possibly produce vivid hallucinations. SWIM has access to two trip-sitters who one of which, SWIM's baby doll is there for any emotional needs and another experianced "tripper" for pyschological ones. So in thinking that SWIM could produce a safe enviroment, could SWIM ingest the following and hope to achieve some sort of safe (at least mostly safe) and very productive (as far as vivid hallucinations of non-real things vs distortions) trip?

[1 tab] LSD (white on white, two drops per dose, strong. est. 200-300ug)
Pyschadelic/Hallucinagin for proper distortions and general illusionary mind-state

[600mg] Dimenhydrinate (50mg x12 Dramamine(R))
Delerient to attempt to induce those ever elusive genuine hallucinations (NOT distortions)

[300mg] Dextromorphan HBr (15mg x20 generic Tussin DM gel caplets)
Dissociative to induce the dream-like state and more likely to be able to "trick" SWIM's mind into seeing imagined objects

[500mg *and as needed*] Caffiene (500mg x? generic caffiene pills)
Stimulant to offset sleepyness of the delierent and possibly the cannabis

[4g] Cannabis (smoked through either bong, bowl, or bubbler)
Intensify all pyschoactives and reduce any nausea

What do the public have to say? I am all ears to all suggestions and comments, but I ask for them to be as useful as possible, please.

[Nacumen]

Originally Posted by khrma

SWIM is getting interested in making a cocktail of pyschoatives that could possibly produce vivid hallucinations. SWIM has access to two trip-sitters who one of which, SWIM's baby doll is there for any emotional needs and another experianced "tripper" for pyschological ones. So in thinking that SWIM could produce a safe enviroment, could SWIM ingest the following and hope to achieve some sort of safe (at least mostly safe) and very productive (as far as vivid hallucinations of non-real things vs distortions) trip?

[1 tab] LSD (white on white, two drops per dose, strong. est. 200-300ug)
Pyschadelic/Hallucinagin for proper distortions and general illusionary mind-state

[600mg] Dimenhydrinate (50mg x12 Dramamine(R))
Delerient to attempt to induce those ever elusive genuine hallucinations (NOT distortions)

[300mg] Dextromorphan HBr (15mg x20 generic Tussin DM gel caplets)
Dissociative to induce the dream-like state and more likely to be able to "trick" SWIM's mind into seeing imagined objects

[500mg *and as needed*] Caffiene (500mg x? generic caffiene pills)
Stimulant to offset sleepyness of the delierent and possibly the cannabis

[4g] Cannabis (smoked through either bong, bowl, or bubbler)
Intensify all pyschoactives and reduce any nausea

What do the public have to say? I am all ears to all suggestions and comments, but I ask for them to be as useful as possible, please.

SWIY, if you took that much, I'd guess that you'd be actually taking twice - maybe much more - the amount that you actually ingest, effects wise - your body wouldn't be able to keep up with purifying itself with all those compounds swimming through it!

DXM and Dimenhydrinate are particularly toxic compounds. I can't imagine that combining the two would be safe at all.

Taking that much caffeine is way, way too much caffeine to be taking concurrently with so many other psychoactives. That's 5 cups of coffee on its own. Because SWIY's body will be working overtime to cope with the other drugs, it would not be surprising at all if SWIY began having heart problems and hypertension. Never forget that coffee is a potentially lethal stimulant. I'm not saying SWIY would probably die, but I am saying that it could ruin your trip - unless you're looking for a nightmare that could give you PTSD, but maybe I'm being overcautious (SWIM has had a very bad experience on stimulants). If you need something to keep you awake, the LSD on its own should be enough.

At the very most, SWIM would recommend LSD, DXM and cannabis, though he doesn't know how safely these would combine. And he'd take a third of the dose that SWIY had initially planned - for each. If this isn't enough, take 2/5ths or less for the next time - and make sure you take at least a month-long break before doing so.

If you took all of the above chemicals together, you would likely not remember the experience - or even consciously experience it while it was going on - mostly due to the dimenhydrinate, but also because of the DXM and to a lesser degree the 4g of cannabis.

SWIM finds that he has full-bodied spirits-from-other-worlds hallucinations most frequently - if not only when - he is alone using LSD/2C-X etc. He believes it is primarily because other people keep him grounded to reality, whereas if he is alone, his mind is absolutely free to wander. This of course is not a very safe way to do things. An alternative with a similar effect is to have a trip sitter nearby, but not think about them/speak to them. SWIM has never tried this so he doesn't know he effective this would be and/or how tempting it would be to talk to someone who's sitting right next to SWIY while he's tripping. Perhaps the trip sitter could be in an adjacent room and could come when called / hearing an unsettling noise, though this again is not the safest way to do things. If SWIY were up to it (setting up the equipment and tolerating it during the trip), SWIY could install a camera in a room which could give a live feed of what was going on inside the room so the trip sitter could watch over SWIY but not interfere. Plus, it'd be interesting to watch the video afterwards if you recorded the feed! Hell, you could do this easily with a webcam. And as a side note, an internet trip-sitter would be better than none, but the abilities of such an aide would be limited to calling EMS if something went wrong.

It was very wise of SWIY to consult others before attempting this. I think I speak for everyone when I say that we'd rather see SWIY toss some ideas around on the forum than a different DF'er posting the news story of a death/hospitalization after SWIY's overdose of the above substances.

Reputation Comments on this post:

	Smart and informative post
	Sounds like good advice and observations.

[khrma]

SWIM has dosed with LSD, DXM, and cannabis and while it was a very enlightening experiance, it did not produce what my cockroach wanted. The DPH is likely to put SWIM to sleep as it always has with all SWIM's previous doses of it, so SWIM thinks caffiene. SWIM has carelessly forgotton LSD's tendency to keep you awake, but perphaps it is because SWIM has fallen asleep on it before. SWIM is willing to set the caffiene dose down to .25g or even .125g but does not think it would be beneficial to the trip to cuti t out completely. SWIM would also like to point out that SWIM has dosed 1.5g caffiene, 2g cannabis, and .6g diphenhydrinate before and was as healthy as possible whilst on drugs, and also experianced quite entertaining distortions for several hours.

[chrisn]

I'm very interested in the effects of combining deliriants and psychedelics, there's really not that much data out there, but my dragon is too scared to try it himself :P

You may be interested in this Erowid report: http://erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=48411

As you full well know, this will probably be very mentally difficult, there was a post recently in the mushrooms forum that said that taking just 50mg of diphenhydramine in the middle of a mushroom trip made it very confusing and unpleasant. Then again, deliriants, even alone, are not pleasant for most people. I await SWIY's experience report with excitement.

[khrma]

Thank SWIY for SWIY's interest. SWIM expects to dose early next week (you know I'll be sure to try to talk SWIM out of it) so we'll see what happens.

[Lehendakari]

IMO combine drugs to achieve a desired effect is a hit and miss game. You probably never hit.... However I must say when you do hit the experience is amazing.

[Rio Fantastic]

Give my luck to SWIM, let us know how it went with him.

[KicKZ]

SWIM is the "experienced tripper" SWIY was talking about. Recently SWIY took DPH and LSD which resulted in him deciding not to take dph in this cocktail. Also SWIY took 30 blotters of LSD recently.... And now I envy him.

[hoodabudda]

Originally Posted by KicKZ

SWIM is the "experienced tripper" SWIY was talking about. Recently SWIY took DPH and LSD which resulted in him deciding not to take dph in this cocktail. Also SWIY took 30 blotters of LSD recently.... And now I envy him.

swim should also add really salty food to that list because salt increases electro conductivity and thus aid with hallucinations.

[khrma]

SWIM would like to point out that delerients should not be messed with as they have, in SWIM's oppinion, more negetive effects than positive ones. However, SWIM did find that dipenhydraminate+LSD was actually stronger (as far as hallucinations) than the 30 tabs of botter (and of coarse the blotter resulted in very wild distortions). SWIM has decided that distortions are enough for anyone to be satisfied with as the "actual hallucinations", which were achieved with DPH/LSD were actually far more frightening and confusing than interesting or exciting. The first really vivid hallucination SWIM saw with DPH/LSD was a scorpian that crawled down the side of a dresser mirror, onto the floor and was nearly on SWIM's foot before it went away. Whats more, this hallucinations are not nearly as easily shook away as can be done with other hallucinagins. Furthermore the other side-effects of diphenhydraminate (muscle twitches, lathargy, and ew hangover) made the whole experiance quite unpleasent; most especially contrasted with LSDx30. SWIM has decided to cancel the cocktail, as SWIM has already achieved at least some sort of what SWIM intended to with less drugs. SWIM would like to also note that none of the hallucinations were terribly vivid with detail or color, though it was still incredibly horrific that half-invisible (think "predator") creatures and objects were floating around me and knowing it was "fake". SWIM believes it is best to stick to dissociatives, for they are truly a example of good, clean fun.

[KicKZ]

SWIM forgot to tell SWIY that the scorpion was real. Sorry......Yes DPH/LSD caused fairly extreme muscle twitches in SWIY.

[Nagognog2]

Try hypnosis to make you believe the next thing you see & hear without question. Then watch a Bush speech on TV.

Voila! A real hallucination is born. Now go see the hypnotist to reverse the command.

[podge]

If swiy desires true hallucinations then why use a coctail of drugs ? There are drugs that can achieve this alone. A large dose of MDMA will have swiy seeing things which arent there. Salvia, DMT or Ketamine (without the aid of other drugs ) will take swiy to new dimensions entirely.

When it comes to combo's swim says mixing any two of the following will cause wild visual hallucinations : LSD, MDMA or Ket.

Swim has also heard using nitrous oxide in combination with most psychedelics will send the user into a new dimension for a few minutes, re-dosing as often as desired.

30 hits of blotter in one sitting ?....swim thinks you may need a new connection, that blotter must not be very good. Or else swiys tolerence is way too high, if so then cut back on usage for a while swim thinks.

[khrma]

SWIM's blotter was very good, SWIM just has boundary issues. SWIM actually got quite sick from all the LSD and vomited more than SWIM would have liked to. SWIM hopes you did not think that it was a mild or tame trip that SWIM experianced after ingesting that much acid...

SWIM has personal problems with MDMA and has never tried Salvia or DMT, however Ketamine does not produce the sort of hallucinations that SWIM is refering to. SWIM has also never found N2O to be that strong. Don't get SWIM wrong, dissociatives are my favorite flavor giving SWIM the most highs SWIM has ever been able to experiance, however they did not ever produce the sort of hallucinations that SWIM was seeking. Whilst they do put you in a totally different world, SWIM brought unreal creatures and objects into SWIM's world through the DPH/LSD cocktail.

[Fantasian]

I dont think thats the right combination at all if SWIY is looking for that kind of experience. SWIY should look much more on a combination of tryptamines, the delerium caused to antihistamines really isnt worth adding to the mix and SWIF found with experience that dissaccoiatives merely numb an amazing experience whether it's DXM or ket. (maybe with the exception of nitrous)

[bailey]

Don't do all that shit together; you could seriously damage yourself. If you want 'true' hallucinations, just eat some datura seeds.

[KicKZ]

Originally Posted by Nagognog2

Try hypnosis to make you believe the next thing you see & hear without question. Then watch a Bush speech on TV.

Voila! A real hallucination is born. Now go see the hypnotist to reverse the command.

With an avatar from A Clockwork Orange SWIY must realize you cannot reverse mind control. And why need hypnosis when you have deep family roots in the bible belt? (that didn't quite make sense) The blotter paper SWIY is reffering to (the 30 blotter) Was perfectly lovely intense 'cid that made SWIM have a new appreciation for life... and left SWIM with hands that don't stop trailing even when SWIM is sober.

[podge]

Originally Posted by khrma

SWIM hopes you did not think that it was a mild or tame trip that SWIM experianced after ingesting that much acid...

Realistically 30 hits would be FAR FAR FAR too much if they were potent stamps. With powerful blotters only 1 - 3 would be needed.

1000 micrograms is pretty much considered the max dose of LSD, apparently taking anymore after that does not make much of a difference. 1000 divided by 30 equals 33.3.

Roughly 33 micrograms a hit is quite weak.

Swim isnt saying swiys experience wasnt a powerful one - just needing 30 hits is crazy.

Swim tells me that LSD with a small bit of K will produce extremelly strange visuals ( not enough ket to K-hole - just enough send the LSD experience in a new direction).

Swim is talking about nitrous oxide in conjunction with other drugs, not on its own.

Perhaps Salvia is what swiy needs....especially if swiy has boundry issue's. Salvia at high dose's is way too mental for swims liking.

Good luck with your quest, and dont forget to stay safe - mixing drugs can be very dangerous if not done correctly, keep us updated.

[KicKZ]

Listen, SWIY(op)didn't need 30 hits of blotter to induce his high.... SWIY seriously wasted a sh*tload of blotter in pursuit of a good time (resulting in SWIM having anger issues towards SWIY(op)). I seriously believe 5 hits of this blotter would have induced the same experience.

[Perception Addict]

Swim has a friend of a friend who took 40 hits over the course of an evening. Swim's friend dropped 3 hits and this person tripled the dose, dropping 9. Several hours later, when swim's friend had reached a total of 5 hits, he found out that this guy had reached a count of 40 hits. The next day he didn't believe he could have remembered such a thing correctly, having been tripping so hard on 5 hits, so he asked the previous night's tripsitter who confirmed it. Swim isn't sure the tripsitter did his or her job in this situation and still can't believe how that dropper of heroic doses was able to take so much quality acid.

[khrma]

Originally Posted by podge

Realistically 30 hits would be FAR FAR FAR too much if they were potent stamps. With powerful blotters only 1 - 3 would be needed.

1000 micrograms is pretty much considered the max dose of LSD, apparently taking anymore after that does not make much of a difference. 1000 divided by 30 equals 33.3.

Roughly 33 micrograms a hit is quite weak.

Swim isnt saying swiys experience wasnt a powerful one - just needing 30 hits is crazy.

Swim tells me that LSD with a small bit of K will produce extremelly strange visuals ( not enough ket to K-hole - just enough send the LSD experience in a new direction).

Swim is talking about nitrous oxide in conjunction with other drugs, not on its own.

Perhaps Salvia is what swiy needs....especially if swiy has boundry issue's. Salvia at high dose's is way too mental for swims liking.

Good luck with your quest, and dont forget to stay safe - mixing drugs can be very dangerous if not done correctly, keep us updated.

Um, SWIM is pretty damn positive that each tab had alot more than 33ug... more like 200-250ug each. SWIM realizes that SWIM very likely went over 1000 micrograms ater 4 or 5 tabs and that the same could have been acheived with less acid; and probaly would have avoided the episodes of sicknesss SWIM endured. Still, SWIM was curious and anxious to see what would happen after taking so much blotter. SWIM still would say 5g [ketamine] > 100 tabs [lsd].

[longdistancerunner]

Swim's recipe for inducing "real hallucinations." Turn off all lights, consume >5 grams potent mushrooms, wait an hour.

[Graduisic]

take a 3rd-4th plateau dose of dxm. listen to music and meditate. swim has had his most intense hallucinations using dxm

[keats]

Originally Posted by bailey

Don't do all that shit together; you could seriously damage yourself. If you want 'true' hallucinations, just eat some datura seeds.

Not good advice. SWIM wouldn't really recommended anything being suggested in this thread, but none are as dangerous as taking datura. Atropine is an extremely dangerous and potentially lethal poison, not a recreational drug. Take a look at the datura forums here if you want more info.

[khrma]

This is pretty much over and done with. SWIM achieved his goal by combining dipenhydrinate, LSD, and cannibus. SWIM was able to visualize objects in the form of creatures and other phenomenons that were seen completely out of SWIM's control and not based on a distortion of the world around him. SWIM thinks that the first cocktail mention may indeed be dangerous but suspects that it would only produce even vivid hallucinations and is curious of anyone who tries it.

@longdistancerunner-
SWIM has done the like of this before; doesn't count because the lights were off. As I said I was able to see things, like the scorpian, in good lighting that moved and acted wildly and out of my control. It's far more intense when you get to have the lights on,

@graduisic
SWIM has also done this before and found the results to be distortions at best. SWIM loves dissociatives, but they are fun because they are just distortions. SWIM knew that seeing "real hallucinations" would not be as fun as DXM or K, but SWIM was going for an experiance, not necessarily a fun one either. Just different.

@keats
SWIM is no longer interested in delierents at this point anyway. They are a really cheap "high" (I use that term very losely) and not much fun as they are dangerous. SWIM has never tried datura, but dipenhydramine and -hydrinate both were rather unpleasent in their side-effects, let alone the possibilites you have to worry about with such vivid hallucinations.