Opinions - atropine, scopalamine, dipenhydramine, OH MY! or, Which deleriant is the best?

[thrackelsby]

So out of all the deleriants (Tropane alkaloids, scopolamine, atropine and hyosciamine, and the antihistamines like diphenhydramine, cyclizine and promethazine etc...*), is there any consensus on the relative safety/enjoyability of each.

I realize none of the drugs mentioned above are safe, or fun in the conventional way, but which ones are safer than others, less unpleasant?

I have been interested in deleriants for a while, and as a whole, I think it would be an enlightening experience to undergo. However, I am wary of permanent mental or physical health damage.

How do the experiences vary, from drug to drug, etc...

*list courtesy of psych0naut, from http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36151

[Nagognog2]

None are safe for various reasons, like self-injury. But by far the most dangerous are the tropines found in Datura sp. Physical damage and permenant insanity are often reported with this.

[Psych0naut]

Indeed the tropane alkaloids often seem to cause permanent damage, and while antihistamines are dangerous as well, the many experience reports SWIM read about them, in deleriant doses, they didn't cause long lasting effects. If SWIY persists on doing deleriants, please make shure a trip sitter is present.

[thrackelsby]

Thank a lot guys, but which exactly are the tropine alkaloids, is that atropine and scopalamine are?

[psychedelaholic]

Originally Posted by thrackelsby

Thank a lot guys, but which exactly are the tropine alkaloids, is that atropine and scopalamine are?

Yes thats right, alkaloids found in such plants as datura and belladonna. Antihistamine deliriants are far safer as has alredy been stated.

SWIM has only tried diphenhydramine and actually quite enjoyed it. He took 500mg followed by a further 150mg an hour or so later. Extremely realistic and quite funny hallucinations of his friends sitting round and talking to each other, spiders and snakes crawling over the walls and the ability to send shockwaves round the whole room with a tap of the wall. He also reports very real audio hallucinations which he could imagine could easily freak some people out but as he knew they weren't real they just made him laugh.

SWIM wants to do further experimentation with deliriants, he would like to see how dimenhydrinate and cyclizine compare although has not found any UK OTC meds containing them yet. Can promethazine be used in a similar way to diphenhydramine? What would be the dosage for it to induce similar effects as 650mg of diphen?

[chrisn]

Technically, dimenhydrinate IS diphenhydramine, with a weak stimulant similar to caffiene attached to it. The effects of the stimulant are weaker, however, than the sedation caused by diphenhydramine, so people still get quite tired. Dimenhydrinate contains roughly 29mg of diphenhydramine per 50mg pill.

So if you've tried diphenhydramine, there's really no need to get the other. Dimenhydrinate is marketed under the brand names Dramamine, Gravol, and Vertirosan, are none of these available in the UK? (And if they are, be sure to check the label, the same brand names sometimes contain different chemicals in different countries)

[psychedelaholic]

Originally Posted by chrisn

Technically, dimenhydrinate IS diphenhydramine, with a weak stimulant similar to caffiene attached to it. The effects of the stimulant are weaker, however, than the sedation caused by diphenhydramine, so people still get quite tired. Dimenhydrinate contains roughly 29mg of diphenhydramine per 50mg pill.

So if you've tried diphenhydramine, there's really no need to get the other. Dimenhydrinate is marketed under the brand names Dramamine, Gravol, and Vertirosan, are none of these available in the UK? (And if they are, be sure to check the label, the same brand names sometimes contain different chemicals in different countries)

SWIM has not seen any of those dimenhydrinate containing meds in the UK available OTC. Would dimenhydrinate not be better to trip on than diphenhydramine? SWIM is never able to stay awake the whole time through diphen trips but wouldn't this be easier for dimen? SWIM is not going to bother going out of his way to get it if he can't easily in the UK but he would like to try it if he could. He is more interested in getting his hands on some cyclizine although he believes this is unavailable in the UK also.

[chrisn]

Possibly...SWIY could also just drink a coke, but a stimulant of that level really cannot effectively combat the sedation caused by the antihistamine, it's really just willpower that keeps one up.

Also, a reason that at least in the US, diphenhydramine is a better choice, is that it can usually be found much cheaper.

[eltimmy]

>Antihistamine deliriants are far safer as has alredy been stated.

Yea, if only because dose/response can be relatively controlled by milligram.