Why Cannabis smokers need to be locked up

[Rio Fantastic]

After I wrote a small item here last week about the drug habits of the Cabinet I had a correspondence with a reader who thought I had got it all wrong.
He couldn't understand why I, as a drinker, was so cross about people smoking dope when thousands of people die each year from alcohol-related problems, and thousands of others beat their wives and children while drunk. I tried to explain the difference but failed.
Perhaps a story we published yesterday, reporting that a reputable scientific survey showed how people were twice as likely to develop psychosis if they smoked cannabis than if they didn't, might help convince a few more sceptics.
As part of the mood-music that the Brown terror is piping out to soothe the mass of conservative Britain, the Government has said it is reviewing the downgrading of cannabis from a class B to a class C drug.
Studies such as this one, by doctors in Copenhagen, only make it more likely that it will be reclassified.
The point of that, though, is not simply so that people might be warned that cannabis is actually rather bad for them: it is that the range of penalties available to the courts when someone is found to possess cannabis or to traffic in it becomes that much more stringent.
Stringent, that is, if the penalties are enforced. How many people did you ever hear of going to prison for possession when cannabis was a class B drug, as was the case until the Labour government stupidly downgraded it three years ago? It was even quite hard to get sent down for any length of time for pushing the stuff.
Since the 1960s, successive governments simply haven't wanted to enforce the law against users and pushers of "soft" drugs. And it is because they haven't that this problem, once confined to big cities, has now put out its repulsive tentacles to almost every town in the land.
Those who make the glib point that alcohol is worse than cannabis, and that pot should therefore have the same legal status as booze, do not just ignore this new medical evidence.
They also ignore the fact that people do not get bopped on the head in the street and robbed because a mugger desperately needs money to buy his fix of dry sherry: but they do get bopped because someone wants to get the cash to buy some drugs.
They ignore, too, the link between using cannabis and going on to use something harder. Many of us have drunk alcohol for years without feeling the slightest urge to use illegal drugs as a result.
The spread of cannabis has led to the spread of heroin and crack cocaine. Around Britain whole housing estates are economically immobilised because of the prevalence of drugs. I was told that on the sink estates in the suburbs of Edinburgh it is far cheaper to get out of your mind on heroin than it is on whisky.
In his thoughtful and intelligent policy proposals a fortnight ago, Iain Duncan Smith highlighted the devastation caused by drugs and made the case for rehabilitating those who were addicted to them.
There does of course need to be a strong element of that: but the Government, for all its rhetoric, shows no sign of pursuing policies that might stop drug use in the first place.
I have mentioned here before that the Chinese way, of taking out convicted drug dealers and shooting them, has something to commend it. Sadly, that won't happen: instead we shall have drugs gangs going around shooting each other, as happens now in our cities all the time.

But if we are serious about fighting drugs we do need to lock up pushers and throw the key away; and lock up users too, even if it means future cabinet ministers going to jail. Otherwise this poison will never be countered - and it won't matter a jot what class of iniquity cannabis falls into.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/m...801.xml&page=3

[starway]

alcohol is worse than cannabis fullstop. if cannabis is illegal then so should alcohol and so should cig3erettes!
for gods sake why cant we all do what we want as long as it aint hurting anyone else!

Reputation Comments on this post:

Very true. Shame they like control. huh.

[Rio Fantastic]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/m...801.xml&page=3

[LexaproHo]

Swim knows both alcoholics and stoners and in swims opinion, the alcoholics are so much more violent, aggressive, depressed and sick than the stoners that swim knows.

Top 20 dangerous drug list...Alcohol sits at number 5
Top 20 dangerous drug list...Marijuana sits at number 11

Source: http://faculty.washington.edu/chudler/wdrug.html

[starway]

lexa that is a good find uve got there. proves that if cannabis is less toxic than tobacco and alcohol then why is it illegal.
because the government wont be able to tax it properly because u can grow ure own.
and thats just one reason why it isnt legal.
others being it may draw people away from alcohol and tobacco.

[Nagognog2]

I suggest a good read about the history of prohibition and the violence that this now defeated law engendered. Perhaps through education, someone around here would start thinking from the 21st century. Rather than the 1920's.

Excuse me while I go polish mt "Chicago Typewrtiter."

[LexaproHo]

Sarcasm, along with prohibition never gets anyone anywhere.

Swim is neither for, nor against alcohol but the fact is, is that dangers of alcohol are very real, along with every other substance which have their own profiles of pro's and con's. Swim firmly believes in the virtues of harm reduction/minimisation and most importantly, proper education. He has had enough of the debate between alcohol and marijuana as it'll probably never be resolved in a way that results in a win for all.

[Nature Boy]

His key points seem to revolve around street muggings and the long debunked gateway drug theory. How weak was that? I was actually expecting a little more. When was the last time anyone heard of someone being mugged so another could spend the money on a bit of pot? This myth is exaggerated enough as it is when it comes to harder drugs, it does not apply to pot at all. And the gateway drug theory? Illegal status is the gateway, not the drug itself. Alcohol proves this.

[Kodi]

I implore the OP, research both sides of the argument completely before spewing this stuff.

Alcohol, cigarettes, and most RX drugs, are far more harmful, addictive, and potential gateway drugs than pot is.

Alcohol was swims gateway drug, alcohol is illegal in the states under 21, which most kids ignore that anyways. Therefore, it makes sense that teenagers still realize that they can get away with illicit things, then move on to smoking pot etc etc. Its just ignored that alcohol comes first since it is "legal".

[whirlybird]

SWIM is guessing the creator of this thread has never smoked pot. We have all been hearing the same arguments againt weed for what seems like forever. However, nearly all of these arguments have been disproven or cannot be proven. Like Kodi, alcohol was SWIMs gateway drug. SWIM has a lil theory that whatever mind altering substance somebody tries first is the "gateway drug".

Personally, I am unaware of anybody that has wrecked their car while stoned, and SWIM knows PLENTY of people that drive blasted on daily basis (not condoning it, because marijuana is a drug and does affect you, but much less than any other drug in SWIMs opinion). Those same people wouldn't even think about driving around after a few shots, and the ones that have, have wrecked. Rio reminds SWIM of a relative that was against the "evil gateway drug". SWIM linked her to a few websites, and after a little research she completely changed her mind. SWIM would like to suggest to Rio that you do a little research before taking such a stand against something you must not know much about. It is believed that people have been smoking pot for thousands of years, as opposed to hundreds for alcohol. However, the ratio of deaths by alcohol to deaths by pot are:

(# of people that died from alcohol) : ZERO

"They also ignore the fact that people do not get bopped on the head in the street and robbed because a mugger desperately needs money to buy his fix of dry sherry: but they do get bopped because someone wants to get the cash to buy some drugs."

^--Perhaps for drugs, but SWIM is going to go on a whim and guess that people that steal for weed money steal for other reasons as well, and is most likely not because they're addicted to pot and desperatly need it, but because they're the kind of person that steals and happens to smoke weed, because everybody from cops and teachers to teens and thugs smoke weed. Everybody SWIM knows that has EVER drank alcohol has got drunk and done something stupid or dangerous or whatnot, not the case with marijuana. Marijuana is natural, alcohol is man-made. It is impossible to OD from marijuana, not the case with alcohol. SWIM has drank too much and stayed up all night puking more than once, and only drinks on weekends. SWIM has been smoking everyday for about 2 years, and has only puked from smoking a few times, only from taking bigger hits than SWIM could handle. It is common to puke from feeling drunk, but uncommon to puke just from being high. This post could easily be made pages long, but the information is already out there and doesn't really need to be repeated. There is a lot of honest information in these forums Rio, and SWIM believes that if you spend just 15 minutes doing a little research on non gov't websites, you will find that it really is ridiculous that alcohol remains legal while marijuana has been illegal for nearly a century.

SWIM would also like to say he is not denying the inevitable health risks of smoking weed (or anything for that matter), but alcohol is much worse. SWIM knows of people that have been smoking weed daily for over 20 years, and most of these people are friendly, intelligent, law abiding citizens. However, SWIM is unaware of anybody that's made it past 5 years of drinking daily.

Ok, SWIMs done. Go do a little research. D

Reputation Comments on this post:

nice post- really touches on the points that weren't hit yet and presents a good argument :) the manmade/natural argumen...

[dbjay417]

no one robs anyone for pot money. You dont need a fix of pot. its not crack or heroin. A habitual marijuana user that cant afford marijuana demonstrates the same withdrawl symptoms nicotine addicts do. Mild mood swings and depression. There are no bugs, itching, aches, or sweats.

People with no first hand knowledge of drugs shouldn't talk about drugs. if you smoke pot all day every day and one day have no pot, you don't go sticking up people or snatching purses, you just sit around saying "damn I wanna smoke." and wondering if your dealer will accept a roll of quarters for a dime bag.

Alcohol was SWIMs gateway too. SWIM quit smoking pot at 17, but one night when SWIM was 22 and very drunk, SWIM started his affair with cocaine and briefly with opiates.

I'd also like to point out that locking up all stoners would mean locking up like 15% of the population. Including teens, women, and elderly people.

[Rio Fantastic]

No, wait!

This is not my viewpoint! This is more useless propaganda I disagree with!

Now I have MORE negative rep for this

[daisyrocket]

You people obviously don't know that the Telegraph is like the Bible and is truth in it's purest form. Oh wait. The bible is bullshit (lack of capitalization to symbolize my lack of respect.) Put 2 and 2 together and you get 4. Also meaning the telegraph seems to be bullshit.

Reputation Comments on this post:

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[sl1p609]

Alcohol can be give worse effects than marijuana most of the time, But if the user is only drinking to relive stress and not vulgarly driving behind the wheel it's not so bad. I stay away from alcohol because its too dirty of a drug. It causes major hangovers and puking that doesn't feel so good. Marijuana user can be really stinky and not know that they smell like a dried up dorito chip. Both users can be worthless. I must say though that you never see a marijuana user get really angry or belligerent off thc or while on thc. How many abusive situations do you see where a stoner is beating a kid over the head with a bong.

Well that my two bowls for this topic

[dr ACE]

from swims personal experiences with both drugs, alcohol has triggered far more 'psychotic reactions' in prone individuals than cannabis,maybe it takes longer for people to go mad from dope.swims don't recall anyone every becoming violent from smoking the herb.

its the youngster who smoke cannabis are the ones who are at risk from triggering mental problems,even then its controversial to say that its cannabis is the main factor in triggering any mental illnesses.

being a marijuana smoker is not as damaging to your health and your dignity as being a washed up drunk is lol,

hell there are many religions that believe cannabis is a sacred medical herb a gift from God, and how many religions or any organization tries to promote alcohol as being beneficial??(apart from 'the man')

[FuBai]

all the article does is expose a basic lack of understanding about cannabis and drug abuse in general. It is highly simplistic and inaccurate which, to be fair, is pretty much what telegraph readers want. I've gone through the arguments so many times with so many people that I am bored of it. All I want to say is that after 80 years of prohibition worldwide, ranging from China's execution of dealers to Portugals decriminalisation for possesion, has it ever worked? The drugs trade has grown and grown until now whole countries are dependant upon it. As a social experiment it was a failure and something we should now be abandoning.

[whirlybird]

lol RIO, i didn't notice the link in your other post. I hate posting without being able to edit. Naturally, if I was able to edit my posts they would all be flawless. LOL. Don't worry, I wouldn't give you neg. rep simply because it is an opinion.... even though it is based on ignorance. Not to mention not even yours! Oops..... assume "Rio" means "telegraph" for my previous post....

[Snootch]

the reason why weed is a gateway drug is because it's illegal. the connotations that come along with that classification would make people think "well, this is illegal and it's not so bad, maybe ecstasy (or whatever) isn't", so they take something harder.
recreational drug leglisation, or even proper education on drugs, would show kids from a young age the drugs that aren't bad for you, and the drugs which are and subsequently give the whole drug using community a bad name - ie, heroin, crack, meth.

Reputation Comments on this post:

very good point you made there.becasue drugs are illegal that is the biggest problem with drugs

[FuBai]

I think this thread has probably had enough of the one line hate mail responses. We all know he is incorrect but, what do you expect? He writes for the Telegraph and one liners expressing simplistic comments that are not backed up are not going to change his mind. If you want to do that write to him - there is a lot of talk but not much action on these forums. If you want to change something then it takes hard work and a lot of effort, not criticisms hosted on a forum that few main-stream people even know exists, let alone take notice of.