Is Meth really that bad?

[tanz]

Actually that is my argument. When one starts to sell out his/her personal values in exchange for single minded hedonistic pursuit of pleasure it is time to quit. There is a line there and I believe we know it on some level when we cross it. Swim says that when this crossroads is presented many choose to either close their eyes and live in denial, blame the drug and become the victim diving headlong into the abyss smiling all the way down or take responsibility and at least attempt to clean up. I trully believe that it matters weather or not one blames the drugs or takes ownershp of ones actions. We can not fix what we do not acknowledge.

[methMADMAN]

That's exactly what the 12 step program tells one to do. In step 4 we trace the wrongs we have committed and in step 5 confess them to our sponsers, and ins teps 8 and 9 we make amends for them. In fact the 12 step program is the only one I know of that actually suggests the one owns one's actions.

[tanz]

Cool, I go to meetings once in a great while. I like the community of others that have been there. The problem is that I drink every once in a while. This doesn't sit well with many so I do not really fit in so well. For sure I don't want to mislead someone into a relapse with alcohol. So Aug 25th I will celebrate my 3 years off speed but since alcohol is a drug (period lol) I am not considered clean. Fine with me though, life is still 1000 times better not tweaking. I'll tell you what though that first 18 months were a bitch! Side note I actually got my drivers liscense back a couple of months ago (a milestone in a speed freaks recovery.) Strange how tweakers all seem to have suspended liscenses huh.

[dogzz]

ok, granted by the true definition of inanimate, drugs are. So I admit to giving meth life it does not possess. The topic is "Is meth really that bad" and as much as swim hates to say it ....to someone that is able to control it ...it is not that bad.....Which is where swim took great offense to switanz's statements. Swim has the opinion if switanz was able to quit after realizing he couldnt handle it ...then switanz was less an addict and more someone who enjoyed meth untill it was no longer fun. swim wants to address the comparison of mental problems vs addiction. Is it not a fact that addicts are genetically predispositioned? Many scientific studies have shown that an addicts brain is "wired" differently than a normal persons ( ya, define normal?) Addiction is labeled a disease is it not? So swim is suggesting that as long as an addict does not feed into his "predispositioned" problem with how his brain works....the addict is fine and has control of what he does. But what about when the disease is triggered? Swim used and abused almost every substance out there...Swim was able to recognize the problem with each and every one....took control of it and stopped...meth was a different story. In true addiction the addict can NOT, not use....It is great switanz was able to quit....swim respectfully submits to tanz, that he thinks he understands addiction....but has never experienced true addiction. ...The question of is it bad? Swim's 53 yrs old.....done meth for 35 of those years....it is so much more than simply saying "take responsiblity" Yes an addict has a personal choice....untill that addict uses what sets off his illness.....then there is no choice... Fine, tanz wants to make it sound like it is as easy as choosing to stop... in a way tanz is right....Swim made his choice to quit ....a thousand times...was not succesfull untill swim moved 2500 miles away from everything meth....so ya...swim chose to stop.....swim's seen a lot of people fall into meths hold.....when the topic is, is it bad......to make it seem any less than what it is , to swim is wrong....The biggest reason so many end up addicted to meth is the thought "I can control it" lick your own balls

[cyndi]

Originally Posted by dogzz

ok, granted by the true definition of inanimate, drugs are. So I admit to giving meth life it does not possess. The topic is "Is meth really that bad" and as much as swim hates to say it ....to someone that is able to control it ...it is not that bad.....Which is where swim took great offense to switanz's statements. Swim has the opinion if switanz was able to quit after realizing he couldnt handle it ...then switanz was less an addict and more someone who enjoyed meth untill it was no longer fun. swim wants to address the comparison of mental problems vs addiction. Is it not a fact that addicts are genetically predispositioned? Many scientific studies have shown that an addicts brain is "wired" differently than a normal persons ( ya, define normal?) Addiction is labeled a disease is it not? So swim is suggesting that as long as an addict does not feed into his "predispositioned" problem with how his brain works....the addict is fine and has control of what he does. But what about when the disease is triggered? Swim used and abused almost every substance out there...Swim was able to recognize the problem with each and every one....took control of it and stopped...meth was a different story. In true addiction the addict can NOT, not use....It is great switanz was able to quit....swim respectfully submits to tanz, that he thinks he understands addiction....but has never experienced true addiction. ...The question of is it bad? Swim's 53 yrs old.....done meth for 35 of those years....it is so much more than simply saying "take responsiblity" Yes an addict has a personal choice....untill that addict uses what sets off his illness.....then there is no choice... Fine, tanz wants to make it sound like it is as easy as choosing to stop... in a way tanz is right....Swim made his choice to quit ....a thousand times...was not succesfull untill swim moved 2500 miles away from everything meth....so ya...swim chose to stop.....swim's seen a lot of people fall into meths hold.....when the topic is, is it bad......to make it seem any less than what it is , to swim is wrong....The biggest reason so many end up addicted to meth is the thought "I can control it" lick your own balls

Good grief that sounds like the story of swim too. Swim said over and over a million times at least ok no more this is it. Only to fall back. Yeah she also had to move to get out of the tweaker circles. Yep she was a big part of it at one point in her life. She is 44 and has fought it for 20 years. That is a long time. Nearly half her life. Very depressing thought. She knows some can take it or leave it, but it just gets a hold of one that is hard to explain. She has tried every drug out there and there was none that she couldn't handle except meth. Coke was no problem, yeah she did it for a while, it got old after a year. Then came meth.....she didn't realize she had a problem till things spiraled out of control to the point that she could see it. It is possible to kick it long term, but it can come back and bite you in the butt as the addiction makes you think oh it has been a long time, I can handle this. Guess what, you can't. Or in swim's case she found herself fighting that same hellish feeling. Still am. She has abstained for a while but am no where to where she has a great quality of life. One doesn't get it unless they have been there. That is what she is reading. Everyone she guesses is entitled to their opinion, hers is life threatening if she continues that path. She can't handle it responsibily, she wasn't aware anyone really could.

[tanz]

lol point taken

[asr10]

hi everydude,

first of, here in spain (basque country), speed is almost a tradition you know? everybody takes it, and never-never seen that american shit of "before/after" in the real life.. you should come San Fermines (bull thing) and see it wit your own eyes.. every dude take that shit..

im 25 years software developer and ive been taking speed sporadicly for about 10 years at nights wit my friends and that stuff.. and i think taking speed with control (im assuming you have almost 2 inches of brain) doesnt HAVE to become a serious problem in your life.

but you know, this is like many other things in the life: is NOT the same to USE than to ABUSE. i mean, if you do any shit everyday, becomes harmful. because, what the hell will happen to you if you only eat meat everyday? fucked up.. the same with drugs (ill exclude any intravenous drug of this statement)..

ALSO i wanna ask you all. ive been reading and what means "SWIM". spanish you know.. my english is like 'limited'..

peace out

[methMADMAN]

You are talking about Amphetimine, Methamphetamine is an entirely different monster.

[Katabatic]

Prescription meth (Desoxyn) is given to children, and swim read how people say it has less side effects than Adderall for ADD.

Swim not use meth, but it appears that the dose and route of administration is what makes the difference, like everything, and the purpose for its use.

[izzy31]

Although meth may be one the most addictive substances on the planet, it rarely actually kills people - overdose may result in a hospital visit with an extremely high temperature and is unlikely to actually kill a user alone. You're more likely to die in a car crash on the way to meet your meth dealer than you are from the actual drug.

[cyndi]

Originally Posted by izzy31

Although meth may be one the most addictive substances on the planet, it rarely actually kills people - overdose may result in a hospital visit with an extremely high temperature and is unlikely to actually kill a user alone. You're more likely to die in a car crash on the way to meet your meth dealer than you are from the actual drug.

A lot of people swim knows didn't actually die of meth od, it was suicide as a result of meth addiction/depression in most cases. Yeah actually one could get brain damage or die from overheating due to too much amphetimine as many won't go to er till it is too late.

[slpystr]

woooooww


and as for 'FROMTHESTARS' YOU ARE ONE DUMB KID.

this drug will eat you alive. just reading your post

"SWIM won't become a long-term user. In a year when he is 18, he will probably switch to MDMA/X and kill the meth addiction anyways."

hahahahahahahhhhhhahahaaaaaaahahaha. Fuckin good luck with that one. you must be ignorant if you honestly think you can BEAT an addiction with another drug, CMon! Did you even know that 'E or X' or mdma is usually half methamphetamines. Cmon, not too mention the wholes in your brain. shit all the times ive done E, ive just wanted something, anything the next morning, speed crystal, etc. dont be a retard, Meth is MDMA hence MDMA (3,4-methylenedioxy-N-methylamphetamine). duh. use the internet wikipedias great,,



some peeps arent too smart obviously. you might know who you are, but the sad thing is you prolly dont either. oh well, some peeps are lost souls. i myself was able to stay off the beaten path and keep my hard drug use to a minimum, for awhile. it still doesnt take away any cravings you may have tomorrow though. that shit stays with you for life, no matter who you are. it is also bigger than any of us and has prolly controlled everyone at some point. some people dont turn back, some try and pull forward, some go down, and others get up. whatever, just dont start.

Reputation Comments on this post:

very honest and definetly took a moment to explain the dangers of trading one addiction for another

[runfrom MURDER]

Originally Posted by slpystr

woooooww


and as for 'FROMTHESTARS' YOU ARE ONE DUMB KID.

this drug will eat you alive. just reading your post

"SWIM won't become a long-term user. In a year when he is 18, he will probably switch to MDMA/X and kill the meth addiction anyways."

hahahahahahahhhhhhahahaaaaaaahahaha. Fuckin good luck with that one. you must be ignorant if you honestly think you can BEAT an addiction with another drug, CMon! Did you even know that 'E or X' or mdma is usually half methamphetamines. Cmon, not too mention the wholes in your brain. shit all the times ive done E, ive just wanted something, anything the next morning, speed crystal, etc. dont be a retard, Meth is MDMA hence MDMA (3,4-methylenedioxy-N-methylamphetamine). duh. use the internet wikipedias great,,



some peeps arent too smart obviously. you might know who you are, but the sad thing is you prolly dont either. oh well, some peeps are lost souls. i myself was able to stay off the beaten path and keep my hard drug use to a minimum, for awhile. it still doesnt take away any cravings you may have tomorrow though. that shit stays with you for life, no matter who you are. it is also bigger than any of us and has prolly controlled everyone at some point. some people dont turn back, some try and pull forward, some go down, and others get up. whatever, just dont start.

SWIM quit [cold turkey] cocaine and roxies/oxycottons once he moved back about a month 1/2 ago, for crystal meth.

yes, you can switch addictions. swim did it a few times before. and weed is usually used in trying to quit a stronger drug, and then E would be for the nights/days that i had time for real fun.

swim don't do weed. swim hates the high it gives because it's not fun nor happy at all, here atleast. why do you think swim ended up doing meth? because swim needed something stronger!
_____

swim sorta lost a tad control the past few days. spent atleast 200$ and ran completely out of money. so swim is a bit sad about that, but is now trying to fix his control again. and it started with last night being my last session until atleast tuesday (2 days atleast). his dealer knows not to call until swim calls, he's quite helpful in my breaks/quitting situations.

swim knows when it goes out of control, and turns more into 'abusing' rather than his current 'using'. don't worry.

swim only has an extremely hard time surviving when the cravings strike. if he's at home when the cravings start, he usually just goes to sleep. it's painful and miserable.

[slpystr]

Oh ShitO!!!!

My baad SWIM didnt mean to rip 'Fromthestars' a new one, that post was intended especailly for 'Runfrommurder'. Hes the dumbass not fromthestars.

'runfrommurder' dont be a tweak, just smoke weed

[chemlove]

SWIM told me that Meth is brutal, His exact quote was "man its a wonderful high you'll have fun and talk talk talk, you'll enjoy your company and have a good time, until you run out then it's really tough and painful". I have never experienced this drug, nor do i think i would, Just reading that the comedown is worse then coke a cola (something SWIM foolishly did when young and dumb) is enough to scare me away

[tanz]

Of course everthing is subjective but to say that the comedown from meth is worse that coke is way way way not true at least for swim. Swim personally enjoys the comedown from meth and used to do all his busy work then. On the contrary coke comedown made swim want to die when he came down. Also I want to say something to the genius who thinks that MDMA is part methamphetamine. You seem to pretend like you know what you are talking about talking down to others saying "duh" to everyone. Take a chemistry course smart guy. Mythylamphetamine is not methamphetamine. Please stop spreading misinformation.

[tanz]

With all due respect I think the AMA is more qualified then myself to determine what is and what is not a disease. I think maybe this is a misconception of what a disease is.
A disease is an abnormal condition of an organism that impairs bodily functions. In human beings, "disease" is often used more broadly to refer to any condition that causes discomfort, dysfunction, distress, social problems, and/or death to the person afflicted, or similar problems for those in contact with the person. In this broader sense, it sometimes includes injuries, disabilities, disorders, syndromes, infections, isolated symptoms, deviant behaviors, and atypical variations of structure and function, while in other contexts and for other purposes these may be considered distinguishable categories.
I think many believe a virus is the same as a disease.
I agree with you that only through personal responsibility can one overcome the problem and that sometimes people in the program try to shirk their personal responsibility (currently a major cultural problem in my view) By blaming the drug itself. The fact is that there is no devil and inanimate objects can not be held responsible for ones behavior. Once one accepts responsibilty for past choices and regains controll of ones life by making responsible future choics can one recover. I guarantee the steps help people doe just that. I don't remember which ones do what but I know they adress the problem and give a rational solution. Even if you are an athiest (which I happen to be) You can still believe in a power greater than yourself. For gods sake the damn ocean is a billion times greater than myself. Anyway I'm rambling now. Later

[tanz]

Does it really matter? No one is saying na/aa is the only way only saying it is a possible way if one is looking.

[Police Officer]

In one word: YES

You will turn into someone you would never want to be.

[kreation]

to methMADMAN,

My mother was in AA and NA for quite some time, she thought it was great and so did i untill i got talking to her, theres alot of religion intwined within AA and NA so far as i can tell from talking to her, and she very much did have the attitude of, im sick and it was beyond my control in the first place, an attitude that she didn't have before she joined these support groups.

in hind sight i think hate is a bit of a strong word for how i feel towards AA and NA its just that she died believing that she was simply destined to go down the route of drug abuse, now i also realize that these ideas could of been helped along by someone in the group and not the group itself or maybe from outside the group completely.

but it certainly seemed as though these ideas were routed in her meetings with both groups and she pretty much gave up trying to beat the various addictions after a few months in both placing it all more down to fate and often saying that if she couldn't stand the cravings then something (ie a higher power) was saying she should just do what she craved.

[manda]

You guys, I hit a button twice on accident- WAS NOT trying to double post. Sorry! I am really working on not double-posting.

[manda]

I think it has a lot to do with how often you use it and what you do when you use it.
(I.E. play on computer vs. robbing, raping, pillaging)

But for some, it can get real bad before they know it, and then they walk around tweaking all the time not seeing how bad their life has gotten....been there.

[hoodabudda]

Originally Posted by manda

I think it has a lot to do with how often you use it and what you do when you use it.
(I.E. play on computer vs. robbing, raping, pillaging)

But for some, it can get real bad before they know it, and then they walk around tweaking all the time not seeing how bad their life has gotten....been there.

yeah but before you start you dont know for a fact that you will be able to control it. from what iv seen even with adderall and dexidrine(dex/amphetamine salts) most people can't. there are the select few who can but with a steady hook up the chances of not picking up the phone when one is crashing are low.

[Codehead]

I don't get crashes with normal d-amphetamine (street speed in Europe/Finland) almost at all, maybe because I "tweak" only one day maximum... Haven't tried meth thought.

I liked really much the few times I tried it. At the start I felt some crawling after the day I tried first time, and then few days later took second time. Ok didn't felt any kind of crash, maybe because I took Alprazolam , codeine and alcohol after the main effects of amphetamine were gone. Ok after this I have't felt any crawling. I even met with my "dealer" few days after and bought only some weed, even I were able to buy lot quantities of speed.

[dr ACE]

its like the old saying 'guns dont kill people, people kill people'.swim does'nt think that PURE meth is really anymore dangerous than other schedule 1/class A drugs. its all about the attitude the user of meth has towards the drug, and his use of it.

if you treat it with respect and dont abuse it,, then it wont abuse you.and your probably not as likely to become another meth addict