Opinions - Why is datura legal but cannabis not?

[Orchid_Suspiria]

Why is something that is basically harmless illegal to use,grow,have,or sell while something that can have such dangerous effects not?This just doesn't make sense to swim.No probably not alot of people use datura but not alot of people use pcp and its illegal.

[TMM]

Why were (until the change in legislation in 2005) fresh mushrooms legal but dry ones illegal in the UK? Why is AMT still legal in the UK whilst all other RCs are not?

Because drug laws make no sense!

[BackToBasics]

Probably because the government has nothing to worry about with Datura due to the fact that not many people would be crazy enough to take it. PCP is a bit different Budgie thinks, because it is used recreationally, whereas Datura isn't (well not for 95% of people anyway!)

[Orchid_Suspiria]

Swim wonders if pcp is really used that much now?Swim has never came across it.Swim also is sure that trying pcp is almost as crazy as trying datura.

[jesusfreak666er]

datura is legal because no one (well most) do not take datura at all and if at all not habitually... the goverment isnt threatened by datura... its a poision with little recreational value in swims. why ban a deleriant ? why arent fly agarics illegal... simple the government dont feel threatened, the middle class has no interest in either, and for that matter neither do most ppl...

[Bajeda]

Originally Posted by Orchid_Suspiria

Swim wonders if pcp is really used that much now?Swim has never came across it.Swim also is sure that trying pcp is almost as crazy as trying datura.

Not quite. The dangers of PCP are overhyped in the media, as with everything, even if there are real risks to using it. Its not the devil drug, as some nightshades seem to be.

Check the archive for some studies on PCP use.

[Twiglet]

Datura polices itself

[Orchid_Suspiria]

Swim has never had an experience with PCP and has never seen any.He was pretty sure the reports of it causing so much horrible violence and people on it having to be shot multiple times to stop them.However it just didn't sound like the safest drug to swim either.Still swim probably would try it if he ever came across it.He has read reports on erowid and maybe here of some enjoyable experiences with it.

Datura on the other hand sounds terrifying in every way and swim didn't see too many positive reports on it on erowid.Swim thinks he saw maybe four positive experiences or maybe not even that many.It seems for a large part the people that do it are young people in their teenage year s that find it growing in places all around them and hear that "It messes you up and gives you an awesome trip."and won't bother to actually research it or any drug they may take and wind up having some very bad and dangerous experiences because of it.

[jcdjinn]

I've never heard of anyone trying datura twice. Making datura illegal would be like making poison ivy illegal, it's just not gonna happen and wouldn't be realistic.

[cosmicruler]

In SWIM part of the world Datura is classed as a noxious(spell?) weed...and grows wild on the side of roads and at the back of peoples property etc, so i think it would be very hard to govern in this instance!!??

why are things like san pedro cacti legal when peyotes are ILLEGAL etc etc????

[podge]

Originally Posted by cosmicruler

why are things like san pedro cacti legal when peyotes are ILLEGAL etc etc????

Unfortunatley peyote is endangered in some parts of the world so people use other mescaline cacti to help give the species a chance. Strange though.....over here Peyote, San Pedro and Peruvian torch are all legal. But they charge a lot for peyote so it doesnt get much business. Plus most people over here ( including drug users ) havent even heard of mescaline so the market is very small.

Unlike shrooms - before they were banned some of the most unlikely people were taking them !!!

[cosmicruler]

cheers for answering my question podge!!!i suppose that makes sense, although if the peyote are being grown for the sole purpose of sale then that shouldnt effect whether they are endangered etc .....in N.Z you can grow all cacti except peyote(which is classed as a C class drug) even though all of them contain mescalin ...

[Shampoo]

Originally Posted by cosmicruler

cheers for answering my question podge!!!i suppose that makes sense, although if the peyote are being grown for the sole purpose of sale then that shouldnt effect whether they are endangered etc .....in N.Z you can grow all cacti except peyote(which is classed as a C class drug) even though all of them contain mescalin ...

Breeding of any endangered species without a license, animal or plant, is illegal. Peyote also takes an incredibly long time to mature compared to San Pedro (15+yrs per dose v. 1-2yrs per dose). Though this is not a reason for the illegality, it is an explanation for the lack of potential commercial production market. San Pedro and Peruvian Torch cacti are commonly employed in landscaping due to their attractive style, lack of 'neediness', and growth rate, whereas growing Peyote would be hard to play off as more than a desk-ornament or mini mescaline farm.

Originally Posted by jcdjinn

I've never heard of anyone trying datura twice. Making datura illegal would be like making poison ivy illegal, it's just not gonna happen and wouldn't be realistic.

That was a common attitude towards salvia. "Those who have a real 'abuse' potential for psychedelics, would most likely be turned off by the sky-rocketing visceral overload of a salvia experience". However, salvia possession is now a felony.

[Ryu]

They cant outlaw everything, plus i doubt we'll see any datura epidemics in the near future

[I<3Salvia]

Because not that many people know about it, hardly anyone knows how to take it safely, and that produces a lot of fear. It grows everywhere, the first day swim heard about it he realized, "HOLY SHIT THIS GROWS NEXT DOOR". Which shows how much people know about it in general. If a fad hit and everyone started doing it, you'd bet your ass it'd be illegal. The government hates hallucinogens, peoples whos minds have been opened are a lot harder to brainwash and control suprisingly...

[stinky_plant]

Originally Posted by Twiglet

Datura polices itself

True that.

It's not so much the "high" that makes pot illegal. It's all the other stuff it can be used for that threatens big money. Cannabis has a higher yield for paper than does lumber. It's high could also threaten big pharmecutical companies. It can also make oil to power various things, putting big oil out of business.

Reputation Comments on this post:

interesting points.. i think the high has something to do with it, but this is a fscinating aspect that can't be ignored...

[belladonna]

Originally Posted by Orchid_Suspiria

Why is something that is basically harmless illegal to use,grow,have,or sell while something that can have such dangerous effects not?This just doesn't make sense to swim.No probably not alot of people use datura but not alot of people use pcp and its illegal.

Because Datura is so hardcore, (with its trip length, legends and the divine madness) that not many people are likely to go near it they don't really have much to worry about there..
The horror stories of experiences that people circulate do it for them...

however, cannabis is so easily used by everyone & anyone...

[twindaddy]

swim has never heard of datura?? what is it? is it similar to salvia? swim tried salvia once and all fell apart confused and delerious with the urge to escape but swim was not being held to have to escape wierd stuff, years ago something called crazy eddie was around formaldyhide on mint leaves was the word or rumor swim smoked some of this and thinks it is probably close to pcp

[stinky_plant]

datura is some crazy shit. SWIM hears that smoking it is like smoking a kind of strong cigarette. That's probably the only way SWIY would want to go about having this plant. Making a tea out of this is pretty much akin to playing with fire in an armory. Indians would use it for coming of age ceremonies, where the memories of childhood are wiped out to prepare the child for adulthood. In Fear and Loathing, the fat Samoan talks about eating jimpson weed, going blind for three days and being lugged around in a wheel barrow filled to the brim in his own diarrhea.

Unlike LSD, mushrooms, or mescaline/mescaline cacti, datura gives you 'real' hallucinations, 'real' in the sense that you forget that you've had datura and you can go minutes smoking an imaginary cigarette and passing it to your dead grandma who you really think is smoking with you. Acid, shrooms, and mescaline just get you really high and you get funky visuals.

[belladonna]

Datura is one of the most potent hallucinogens on the planet...
One of the most dangerous too, it has a long history of madness associated with it, hence its nick name, the divine madness.

There are two species that come under this category really, brugmansia, and datura, and hundreds of different variations of them.. they have huge beautiful leaves, that lift up at night, and massive 10-20cm long flowers in the shape of a trumpet.. sometimes these trumpets can have a second or even third trumpet inside the big one..
Generally, Datura flowers point up, and brugmansia flowers point downwards..

They are both as potent as the other, although a friend who has a lot of experience with these plants tells me that the datura (innoxia) is pretty much more overcoming completely.

Incidentally, you will never get a purple brugmansia flower or a pink datura flower! people have been trying for years to try and cross breed them (datura fanatics, they have societies and everything, only for the prettyness, not the entheogenical magick)

They can get huge, grow in most places with sun, if they are outside, they will die back in winter, generally, and resprout in the summer (dependent on where you live..)

The flowers of this plant are actually amazing! They open at night, and they last up to four or five days.. They have the most sweet seductive scent ever.
I have even heard of someone catching a sniff of one of these, becoming entranced by it and eating some, then spending 2 weeks tripping, not remembering at all afterwards..

Extreme caution is advised here, eating them is dangerous..
I once met someone who held 100 Datura Stramonium seeds in their mouth for an hour-ish, and never felt 'normal' for a year or so...
other stories include people taking them in ceremony somewhere in asia, and waking up months later in a cell, not knowing anything about what they had been doing for the last few months..

it was used in 'the olden' days, when it was difficult to get a divorce, by men who wanted to get rid of their wives.. they would feed them a little amount every day until they went 'mad'.. then they could get rid of them legally and didn't have to look after them.. etc...

An interesting way to get a 'feel' of Datura may be to get a few fresh leaves, or even better, flowers, and leave them in some fresh spring water over night under a full moon, and then all day in the hot sun, and then drain the water and use it in little drops to aid meditation etc.. then you will get to know it, without losing your sanity

so yes, datura's are beautiful goddess, but not to be taken lightly.. as it were...

[Orchid_Suspiria]

Datura is a beautiful plant no doubt but swim thinks he is just going to take in their visual beauty and not attempt to use them in any other fashion.This is one substance that scares swim.

[Thirdedge]

Money - Datura will not attract repeat customers. No money to be made selling it. It can not be used to makes clothing, fuel, food etc as can Hemp.

War - The war on drugs is a war run by the US. Their biggest fear is someone outside the US supplying their citizens and troopers with a substance addictive and desirable enough that they may follow them instead.

Poison - Datura is likely to kill the user. One less drug user (threat) for the state to have to feed. Teenage experimenters may get such a shock they never touch drugs again and instead become good Christians.

Abuse potential - Nil.

Euphoria - Nil. Datura does not hit the reward receptors. The US fear drugs that give the user a pat on the back without them having to earn it with a lifetime of hard work.

Uneducated and / or corrupt Morons - The idiots writing drug policy know very little about drugs. Current drug laws are inconsistent and of no real value to the human race anyway.

[Greenport]

Because they're poisons, not drugs. It is the american right for people to ingest poisons and potentially kill themselves - but if their aim is to escape reality only mentally, then their asses are in jail.

's the same reason tobacco is legal (alcohol is because of the non-prohibition activists, yay way to go guys now do something revolutionary like that for pot, will ya! )

We supposedly ban substances known to give us cancer, yet cigarettes contain 599 known carcinogens and is sold to anybody who can prove they're 18 years of age. That's population control at its peak. I choose not to be a part of it

[mad 'ed]

datura aint illegal because datura aint fun.
marijuana is illegal because marijuana is fun.
marijuana is illegal solely for the benifit of oil companys, the cotton industry and paint giants such as du pont. why? because they put cash into the government to keep it that way and if america says so everyone else follows like sheep

Reputation Comments on this post:

By all means relate your views, but unless you explain why you belief what you do it can't be understood on any meaningf...

[cosmicruler]

with the huge rises in petrol and oil at the pump worldwide at the moment maybe those companys should start handing out some free weed while you fill up at the pump.mite stop some of the rage being directed towards the oil companys etc.

but yea i agree that most of the worlds problems now are a direct result of America and George W Bush incl marijuana being illegal.