Drug info - green Kava-kava pills?

[forumdude]

swim did order a bunch of kava pills 500 mg witch should contain oonly kava root, i also says no artificial collors

swim heard the green parts of the plant could couse liverdamage

my question is then are the roots also collored yellow brownish green, or should i be worried?

they came in nice packages of 30 pills out the usa, doesnnt look like a cheap rip off or something, anybody knows these pills?

[enquirewithin]

Kava doesn't really cause liver damage-- that idea was discredited a while ago. Brownish-green sounds about the right color.

Most of the pills or capsules don't seem to be very strong. They are probably effective for relieving anxiety but may not get one high. It's better to go for ground kava root. It doesn't taste great but it works well.

[Bajeda]

""According to the sales figures of the German Institute of Medicinal Statistics, approximately 250 million daily doses of kava were sold during the last 10 years in German speaking countries. Correlated to this estimation, the probability of ethanolic kava extracts being responsible for hepatic adverse effects was calculated to 0.008 cases in one million of daily doses."


That said, the review by Dr. Malani in Fiji of the risks suggested that the preparation was most likely at fault with the cases of heptatoxicity, and it was probably not an issue of dose, as the doses consumed in Europe through extracts were much smaller than those ingested in the Pacific region.



So with regards to the preparation in question:

"Prof. Tang began research on kava in July 1999. He focused on questions of toxicity after the kava market crashed. A Fijian trader told him that in 2000 and 2001, a period during which the supply of kava roots was insufficient to meet demand, European pharmaceutical companies had purchased kava stem peelings (bark), considered a waste product by traditional kava users. This practice may have been widespread. By 1998, the first year in which reports proposed a link between kava and liver toxicity in German and Swiss supplement consumers, dried bark constituted 82% of U.S. kava imports. This bark probably included stem peelings in addition to stump tissues.

Stem peelings are rich in kavalactones, but contain other compounds as well. Twenty years before issues of kava toxicity emerged, kava stems and leaves were reported to contain the alkaloid pipermethystine. While investigating the chemicals present in leaves and peelings from the aboveground stem, Tang and Dragull discovered a problem with the analytical method commonly used on kava. The high-performance liquid chromatography (HPLC) assay for kavalactone concentration was unable to distinguish between pipermethystine and a kavalactone, yangonin. This analytical insensitivity didn't affect results when roots were assayed, since roots contain no pipermethystine. However, if stem peelings were extracted and concentrated to generate kava capsules, pharmaceutical companies relying on HPLC could confuse the contaminant pipermethystine for the desirable product yangonin.


Liver cell studies conducted by Prof. Pratibha Nerurkar (MBBE) suggest that alkaloid contamination may play a key role in the liver toxicity associated with kava. Pipermethystine has a strong negative effect on liver cell cultures. Kavalactones, on the other hand, have not been found to damage cultured liver cells. Profs. Tang and Nerurkar plan to investigate these toxicity issues further using rats as an animal model.

Prof. Tang and Mr. Dragull determined that gas chromatography is able to distinguish yangonin from pipermethystine, and confirmed the presence of pipermethystine in stem peelings. In addition, they and Mr. Yoshida purified and characterized two previously unknown kava alkaloids. Awaine, named after the Hawaiian word for kava, was found in varying concentrations in the unopened leaves of all eleven cultivars tested. An epoxy alkaloid similar to pipermethystine was present in stem peelings and leaves of the Isa cultivar. The ability of pipermethystine to form a relatively stable epoxide may be associated with its apparent toxicity to liver cells.

The UH researchers did not detect the three alkaloids in commercial kava root powders, and Prof. Tang believes that traditional kava beverage is not harmful. However, he recommends that consumers avoid kava products that may contain aerial tissues, including capsules, tablets, and kava leaf tea. He hopes that these research findings, if confirmed, will help resuscitate the industry by leading to the repeal of national bans on products made from kava roots and stumps."



To cast even further doubt upon the liver toxicity debate, out of the 78 cases of heptatoxicity linked to Kava ingestion present in published scientific literature, 23 were linked to concomitant ingestion of other compounds with potential hepatotoxicity. So with the vast amount of Kava and Kavalactone extracts being consumed in that time, that makes for an even more miniscule ratio of heptatoxic occurences to doses ingested.


So as for the pills swiy has, I am not sure whether they contain bark/stem/leaf products or not. Even if they do, the chance of liver damage is still very low. The only advice I can really give on this matter is for swiy to just get dry or fresh powdered root bark/juice the next time he acquires Kava, rather than the extracts that aren't nearly as strong.

[forumdude]

oke thanks, swim sees... but swim doesnt think these pills are extract they contain 500 mg whole root powder ,for optimum performance, it says, and some other binding agents are named on the package and the tablet weight 0,8 gram

so how many tablets do you think swim has to dissolve in water/milk to make a delicious, horrible tasting thea to get me high?

thanks

[enquirewithin]

Does it say what the kavalactone content is?

[Nagognog2]

Just weight-wise, one might squeak by using 60 capsules of the powder from the capsules in a traditional brew. MIGHT. SWIM is advised to get real, powdered bulk Kava~Kava root instead of getting ripped-off by the capsules in jars of 3rd-rate junk for 10x the price.

[forumdude]

so you need about 30 grams of root for a dose? ,,,if there are realy 500 mg of root in the tabblets they where not in capsules, tabblets in push threu strips and by 30 in an cardboard package

if no kavalactones where killed in the proces of making, and they contain 500 mg root(could be becouse swim weighted 1 and it was 800 mg) swim needs 60 of them?

swim tried some maybe max 10 on a day and id diddnt got him noticible high, but he is also a daily cannabis and alcohol enjoyer so it could be to little to notice?

swim doesn't says he diddnt feel a thing but its confusing to recognize while on combis, as some swiy's would know

so if i want to make a drink tomorrow i should use 60 tabblets???

thanks for the info

Originally Posted by enquirewithin

Does it say what the kavalactone content is?

no swim thinks the same as 500mg root as i believe the package

[enquirewithin]

Originally Posted by amnesia

no swim thinks the same as 500mg root as i believe the package

Some say things like 25-30% kavalactones which would meant that you would, in theory not need may of them. 30 at a time might be too may. Maybe try half a dozen and see?

As SWINag says, next time try fresh kava root powder.

[Bajeda]

With powdered root you shouldn't need thirty grams, but then again the root powder you can order thats grown in the South Pacific is probably of a better quality than that stuff in the pills. Can't say for sure though.

Alcohol is potentiated by Kava, though its not the best combination really, both subjectively and health-wise. Kava and cannabis is synergistic and swiy should notice some differences in the high when the two are combined (from the weed high that is) if there is enough Kava in there.

[forumdude]

hello it been a while
i just got some kava root powder
it is yellow whole different than the pills, i think they realy do contain plant material
havent tried them jet
i spilled a bunch and putted some stuff i spilled in my mouth and washed it away with bear

puking was the result

ill trie it in some time with a normal preperation in the near future

[enquirewithin]

The taste can be vile!