salvia for swim's 1st trip?

[trips]

Swim wants to try a halluenaginic for the 1st time
based on all the research he did he learned that swim shouldnt do lsd for their 1st hallucenaginic
should swim try salvia or shrooms?
swim has only had mild trips from pot smokin, gettin blacked out on extasy, and robotripping...
basically swim wants to know what is the best 1st timer halluceniginic to chill and listen to music, trip out, see shit, and think really deep about stuff without feeling depressed or having a comedown that last all the next day

[Whit]

Originally Posted by trips

Swim wants to try a halluenaginic for the 1st time
based on all the research he did he learned that swim shouldnt do lsd for their 1st hallucenaginic
should swim try salvia or shrooms?
swim has only had mild trips from pot smokin, gettin blacked out on extasy, and robotripping...
basically swim wants to know what is the best 1st timer halluceniginic to chill and listen to music, trip out, see shit, and think really deep about stuff without feeling depressed or having a comedown that last all the next day

You have to chose which drug you do for yourself.

Salvia will definately give you a trip an make you "see shit" but it's not really a drug that gives your much music appreciation in my opinion.

You won't get depressed off salvia and the comedown is short.

DO some research on each hallucenigenic and their affects and pick the one that suits what your trying to get.

SWIM's first hallencenigenic if you want to know.

[Nagognog2]

Salvia is a completely different "trip" than the classic psychedelics - LSD-25, Psilocybin, the DOx series. Read more material before considering any ventures.

[jux]

i think salvia is a horrible choice for a first psychadelic...too dysphoric

[Salvinorin A]

Definitely, SWIY would probably never do a psychadelic (if salvia can even be called that) ever again. If SWIY wants to hallucinate, SWIY should stick with mild hallucinogens such as LSD or Mushrooms. Why does SWIY not think LSD is appropriate if SWIY thinks Shrooms are okay? SWIM thinks they are pretty close in effects.

Salvia is not a good drug for kicking it back and tripping. Salvia comes on fast, everything happens fast; the trip is usually confusing and intense, a terrible first psychadelic. When SWIY is ready to handle psychadelics of such nature (like learning that the trip WILL end and not having that kind of paranoia) then one should try a strong dose of salvia.

Peace.
Sal-A

[JDreaming]

Between salvia and shrooms, PLEASE make shrooms the first hallucinogen SWIY trips off of. SWIM did shrooms as his first hallucinogen and was 100% satisfied, it made him want to explore psychedelics further. SWIM has done salvia since then and, while he doesn't regret having gone for that journey, it's definately not a good first testing ground. Shrooms will give SWIY a beautiful, euphoric, non-overwhelming trip experience. Eat 2.5 or 3 grams SWIY's first time and I can practically guarantee a pleasant journey.

[Bajeda]

Originally Posted by JDreaming

Shrooms will give SWIY a beautiful, euphoric, non-overwhelming trip experience. Eat 2.5 or 3 grams SWIY's first time and I can practically guarantee a pleasant journey.

I think you are going a bit far there.

2.5 - 3 grams may be a bit much for the novice tripper to handle, especially if they are prone to anxiety, have some sort of turmoil or distress in their life (even if its subconscious), or simply aren't used to hallucinogens or even drugs in general.

Numerous other factors abound that could make for a very different experience than what you hinted at being one of only possible outcomes. You have to know your substance, know yourself, know your setting, etc. etc. When you start getting up to several grams of shrooms its much harder to just pop some in your mouth and have a good time.

[JDreaming]

While I respect your opinion, Bajeda, and your need to treat psilocybin like the profoundly affecting drug that it is, SWIM took 3.5 grams his first time, having never taken a hallucinogenic drug before in his life, and found it very enjoyable... he even felt like he could have handled a slightly higher dose and still would have felt euphoric. While Trips is welcome to start from a micro-dose, i.e. 1 gram the first time to be extra-careful if he deems it necessary, SWIM's accumulated experiences with different people and different doses of Psilocybin tell him 3 grams or less is unlikely to result in feelings of panic or being overwhelmed, even for a first-time user... or perhaps only 2 grams to start if SWIY has a low body weight or a propensity for panic. You're certainly welcome to disagree.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Every individual reacts differently to every chemical. Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your...

[JDreaming]

There's a difference, Bajeda, between guarantee and

Originally Posted by JDreaming

practically guarantee

...I know with drugs nothing is ever guaranteed for sure; the best thing I can say for what I think is a mostly positive substance is that someone who tries it will, most likely, have a good time.

[Alfa]

Originally Posted by JDreaming

Shrooms will give SWIY a beautiful, euphoric, non-overwhelming trip experience. Eat 2.5 or 3 grams SWIY's first time and I can practically guarantee a pleasant journey.

Maybe eating 2.5 or 3 grams of plants would be a guarantee for a pleasant journey? Or Maybe 2.5 or 3 grams of drugs?
Please define what kind of mushrooms you are referring to. 2.5 to 3 grams of stronger psilocybes is a very bizarre dose. And then there is non-psilocybe mushrooms. Please be clear about what you are trying to say, so others can understand you.

[JDreaming]

Originally Posted by Alfa

Maybe eating 2.5 or 3 grams of plants would be a guarantee for a pleasant journey? Or Maybe 2.5 or 3 grams of drugs?
Please define what kind of mushrooms you are referring to. 2.5 to 3 grams of stronger psilocybes is a very bizarre dose. And then there is non-psilocybe mushrooms. Please be clear about what you are trying to say, so others can understand you.

I was talking about 2.5 to 3 grams of standard, dried psilocybin cubensis.... but you know what? SWIY ultimately needs to set SWIY's own dosage based on body weight, personal knowledge and past experience... so nevermind.

[Bajeda]

Everyone reacts to psychoactives differently, even when in the same setting and with similar mindsets. To tell someone else you don't know over the internet they will have an amazing time guarenteed is just irresponsible. I know people who took around three grams their first time and had a horrible trip complete with experiences of ego loss and death. It was insanely frightening and turned them off psychedelics for good it would seem.

Feel free to tell people that you did well with such a substance with such a dose, and that your experiences tell you there is great potential for a glowing psychedelic experience by taking a certain dose of a substance, but don't go around telling people you know for certain what a particular dose of something will do to them.


BajEdit: I edited this post and previous one as I wasn't in the best mood while writing them. For that I apologize. However, I still believe that you should make all the risks clear when advising a novel course of action to someone you don't know anything about.

[ams914]

you should definitely do salvia instead of other stuff because it doesn't harm your body like the other stuff. thats why its legal. its not addictive and it doesn't fuck you up.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Do some research on the effects of legal high's. Just cos there legal doesn't mean there not harmfull!

[jux]

Originally Posted by ams914

you should definitely do salvia instead of other stuff because it doesn't harm your body like the other stuff. thats why its legal. its not addictive and it doesn't fuck you up.

are you implying that shrooms are more harmful and addictive than salvia? what exactly is your basis for this?

its not legal because it is any safer (and fyi it is illegal in several countries and several states in the us) it's legality has more to do with the fact that (up until recently) it wasn't a very widespread drug and therefore hadn't caught the attention of lawmakers. now that its use isn't so underground, laws criminalizing it are becoming more and more common. i doubt it will be legal at all in another couple of years...the main factors contributing to this are people being irresponsible with its use, the people who are posting the youtube videos (attracting WAY more attention than neccessary and shining a bad light on salvia), and media sensationalism (can you say "brett's law"?).

salvia can "fuck you up" (as you put it) there are plenty of people who havent been able to handle what salvia shows them and had a difficult time (mentally) afterwords....salvia isnt as benign as you'd have people believe. thats not to say salvia is bad, in fact, in the right hands it can be a wonderful tool...but its a plant that deserves respect.

[JDreaming]

Originally Posted by ams914

you should definitely do salvia instead of other stuff because it doesn't harm your body like the other stuff. thats why its legal. its not addictive and it doesn't fuck you up.

Honestly I think it's legality has as much to do with that it's not hugely popular and a lot of kids who try it don't like it, as it does with it's lack of physical damage risks. While salvia doesn't harm the body much, you should probably view it with more caution... there are psychological risks, and even people who don't tend not to "freak out" from hallucinogenics may find a salvia experience frightening, confusing or dysphoric. I think it's a fairly risky candidate for a first-time hallucinogen.

[ams914]

**commercial website** explains that he only harm found from salvia comes from the combustion. its no worse than alcohol if even that.

[jux]

apperently you missed the warnings page on that site:

"However, it is not advised to use salvia too often as it may become a habit hard to break....

The major health risk when using salvia is that a person might lose awareness and cause physical injury to himself or others."

again, im not saying salvia is bad...in fact, SWIM has a plant of his own that gets occasional use (with a little 15x of course ). but to imply that nothing can go wrong when you smoke salvia and saying there are no dangers whatsoever is way off base.

on top of that, we dont know the long term effects....sure the mazatecs used it for a very long time with no known issues, but they weren't smoking powerful extracts on a regular basis either....and there is a big difference between quidding (like the mazatecs did) and smoking a 20x extract. these high power extracts are relatively new, so how can we know the effects of smoking them 20 or 30 years down the road?

and you still haven't explained your comment that shrooms are more dangerous and addictive.

[trips]

thanks for all the comments
but just because someone tells me to doesnt mean im going to do it
im just trying to get some info on what to expect if swim does decicde to do it
Its not legal in my state anyway (not that it makes any difference)
swim has had a bad outer body experience and was able to convince himself that noting bad was happening and it was just the drugs
so swim isnt really worried about freakin out
but he's not gonna abuse it or over do it

swim has been smokin pot for 6+ years now and recently quit because it does nothing for him anymore
and wants to get into hallucenaginics (and has for years now)
but finally decided to do it
so swim is just getting info and taking precausions before hand

peace

[Salvinorin A]

Originally Posted by jux

apperently you missed the warnings page on that site:

"However, it is not advised to use salvia too often as it may become a habit hard to break....

The major health risk when using salvia is that a person might lose awareness and cause physical injury to himself or others."

again, im not saying salvia is bad...in fact, SWIM has a plant of his own that gets occasional use (with a little 15x of course ). but to imply that nothing can go wrong when you smoke salvia and saying there are no dangers whatsoever is way off base.

on top of that, we dont know the long term effects....sure the mazatecs used it for a very long time with no known issues, but they weren't smoking powerful extracts on a regular basis either....and there is a big difference between quidding (like the mazatecs did) and smoking a 20x extract. these high power extracts are relatively new, so how can we know the effects of smoking them 20 or 30 years down the road?

and you still haven't explained your comment that shrooms are more dangerous and addictive.

SWIM would say shrooms are more addictive because of the fact that it lasts longer, and has cases of euphoria in a lot of users. Salvia tends to be harder to form a habit, not only is the experience very quick, intense, and confusing, however the come down is said to be very "anti addictive". Through personal experience, and the many experiences SWIM has witness, almost all first timers said on their come down that they would never do it again. However this does not make salvia completely anti addictive because after almost every experience SWIM has witnessed, the user wanted to try it again because it was "insane" or "cool." So salvia can be addictive just like any other drug, however because shrooms can promote a sense of well-being (the sense of well-being in shrooms is much greater in statisitcs than that of salvia), the user remembers that and the cool trip and is tempted to do it again. Salvia's only basis (this is the extreme experiences btw since we're talking about hallucinating, not the mild effects) for rellapse is what SWIY remembers of the trip visualy (or spiritually, and in physically for some people).

Every drug is addictive, however SWIM would say Salvia (though SWIM is not sure if it was proven yet) is a healthier choice as a drug (if ingested with as little carcinogens as possible).

HOWEVER!!! (back on topic) SWIM would once again advocate shrooms as a hallucinogenic experience. Mild hallucinagens tend to be excellent for first timers.

Peace.
Sal-A

[jux]

Originally Posted by Salvinorin A

SWIM would say shrooms are more addictive because of the fact that it lasts longer, and has cases of euphoria in a lot of users.

i dont think that duration of the experiance is an effective measure of addictiveness (coke and crack last a relatively short time, and a lot of people have problems both).

mushrooms have been shown to not be physically or psychologically addictive and the health risks are very low just like salvia. (http://erowid.org/plants/mushrooms/mushrooms_health1.pdf) in my opinion, with substances like these, addiction potential comes down to ones personality rather than the substances themselves. i dont think of either one as being "safer" than the other, both have inherent risks involved with use.

[Salvinorin A]

Hmm.....SWIM agrees.

SWIM pretty much just referred to the duration because he thought that maybe if it lasted longer, it would be more memorable. However, it really does depend on the person....so SWIM will agree on that.

However, the anti-addictive effects noted by many users is what convinces SWIM into favoring salvia as the lesser addictive substance. If it wasn't for that, it would be like almost any other "non-heavy-withdrawal" drug (SWIM once heard a drug officer say: "you are addicted to a substance if you choose constantly have 9-15 nanograms of it in your bloodstream" not sure if that's true, or if those are the right numbers).

We should probably be having this conversation in the "Health Risk Comparisons (Salvia)" thread.