Phens and antioxidants: harm reduction

[Neo1]

This is for anyone out there who likes phenethylamines and would like
to take them in the safest way possible, offsetting any damage.

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Phenethylamines, Free Radicals, and Antioxidants

Brian Leibovitz, Ph.D.
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This information is for those who experiment with phenethylamines as well
as those with patients who use these compounds. Phenethylamines are a
class of compounds chemically, and functionally, related to adrenaline --
the fight or flight neurotransmitter made from the amino acid tyrosine.
Phenethylamines all contain a benzene (C6H6) ring linked to an ethylamine
(-CH2-CH2-NH2) group, and include: amphetamine (a stimulant), ephedrine (a
naturally-occurring decongestant), and methylenedioxymethamphetamine
(MDMA, a psychotherapeutic agent that facilitates communication).




Studies in the last few years have established that phenethylamines can
undergo redox cycling, a ping pong-like process that liberates copious
quantities of oxygen free radicals. Free radicals are substances with
extra, unpaired electrons, whose characteristic is reactivity, and whose
hallmark is cell biochemical and cellular damage. Indeed, oxygen radicals
are linked to a wide variety of diseases and conditions, including: heart
disease, stroke, cancer, emphysema, and neurologic disorders. While our
body has mechanisms to protect against the steady-state levels of
radicals, excessive amounts overwhelm the protective systems and damage
ensues.2 Incidentally, free radicals are not always the bad guys; our
white blood cells produce, and use, free radicals as the primary means of
killing bacteria, viruses, and other microbial invaders.




Phenethylamines are stored in highest concentrations in the brain and
nervous system. Not surprisingly, these tissues are at the greatest risk
for being harmed by free radicals (and associated oxidants) formed during
the redox cycling of phenethylamines. Moderate intakes appear to be
handled well. Excessive quantities of phenethylamines, however, may cause
oxidative damage as the protective mechanisms just can t handle the load.
It is the overproduction of radicals that causes, in large part, the
fatigue and mental dysfunction associated with sustained amphetamine
abuse.




The key, as always, is protection, and knowing the mechanism of action can
only yield one conclusion: those who take phenethylamines should also take
antioxidant supplements. All phenethylamines are prooxidants by nature,
and can redox cycle. This means that there will be a dose-dependent
increase in free radical production, so even at a low dose there will be
free radical generation to some extent. Therefore, if one takes
phenethylamines, it would be prudent to take supplemental antioxidants as
well. This includes both the water-soluble (e.g., vitamin C and
glutathione) as well as fat-soluble (e.g., vitamin E) antioxidants. Other
important antioxidants include: selenium (the coordinating mineral for the
enzyme glutathione peroxidase) and beta-carotene (a quencher of singlet
oxygen - - a non-radical form of activated oxygen). Bioflavonoids are also
indicated, not only for their direct antioxidant effects, but because they
are good metal- chelating agents (and so prevent iron from catalyzing
reactions that generate free radicals). Studies in both animals and (to a
lesser extent) humans document the protective effects of antioxidants
against the radical-mediated, untoward side-effects of
phenethylamines.




I suggest that the combination of vitamins, minerals, and non-vitamin
nutrients listed in Table 1 would be valuable for the prevention and/or
treatment of the adverse effects that may result from phenethylamine
overdose or overuse. There is nothing magic about the doses listed; it is
my best estimate based on present knowledge in nutrition. Note that
N-acetyl cysteine (NAC) is recommended instead of glutathione as it is
more effective in raising tissue glutathione levels; in addition, it is
less expensive than preformed glutathione. L-Carnitine and CoQ10 have also
been included, as both are known to increase cellular energy (adenosine
triphosphate, or ATP) generation, thereby enhancing cellular integrity.




The bottom line is that, by using an appropriate combination of
antioxidants and other nutritional supplements, one can ameliorate the
prooxidant, and potentially harmful, side-effects of high-dose
phenethylamines.

Dr. Leibovitz's advice is good advice, but there has been
considerable progress made in the field of nutritional
biochemistry and there are better antioxidants around that those
suggested above.




Here's a quick list I made up, and you can pick and choose or do further research:




Acetyl-l-carnitine + alpha-lipoic acid combo

N-acetyl-cysteine

Astaxanthin (or zeaxanthin)

Vitamins A, C (preferably esterfied) and E

Selenium

Proanthocyanadins (white pine bark and grape seed extract or sangre de drago</span>, a rainforest tree-bark sap)

Curcuminoids (tumeric extract)

Epigallocatechin gallate (green tea extract)

Ellagic acid

Carnosic acid (rosemary extract)

Carotenoid complex

Bioflavonoid complex

Coenzyme Q10

Resveratrol




Hope that's helpful!

Stay safe,

Neo

Reputation Comments on this post:

Cool, thanks for sharing.

[cyalume]

good job Neo.. harm reduction is especially important with RC's since alot of there long term effects havent been very well documented. Harm Reduction projects have helped reduce harmful effects of many club drugs i'm glad to see that maybe that will also happen with many of the more common RC's

[donkey rhubarb]

Is there any reason to search out the individual antioxs instead of taking a multivitamin that would give you A, C, E, and Selenium?

Also things like CoQ10 and NAC would it be nessacary to take those everyday or possibly just for a few days after RC usage?

[Rush]

and what about tryptamines? they make free radicals like PEAs?

[sterling77]

acetyl-l-cartinine is a pro-oxidant.

[Dogears]

Virtually all recreational drugs are known to cause oxidative stress. As long as you are useing drugs moderately this should not be a problem. Antioxidants shoulf be taken as a normal part of maitaining good health. If you are useing drugs to excess then taking anti-oxidants will not in the long run help you. The oxidative effects will over power the effects of the vitamins.

[Rush]

i agree with you but..read this:

During cerebral ischaemia, energetic failure of injured cells together with excessive release of glutamate the most common excitatory amino acid in the brain, lead to excitotoxicity and immediate or delayed neuronal death. There is strong experimental evidence to support the neuroprotective role played by anaesthetic agents. Hence, barbiturates, volatile anesthetics or ketamine exhibit significant protective effects against ischaemic injury in numerous experimental models of ischaemia in vitro or in vivo. The neurobiological substrate of this action is probably a reduction of the activity of glutamate receptors (N-methyl-D-aspartate and kainate), and/or downstream biochemical events. Reduction of cerebral metabolism by these agents seems not to be their primary neuroprotective mechanism. However, no data are available at the present time to support any clinical benefit of these actions in neurosurgical patients, head trauma in contrast to mild hypothermia or cerebrovascular disease. Future research should develop models as close as possible to the clinical situation to examine further pathophysiological hypotheses and clinical implications.

where ischaemia is a reducted flow of blood that leads to damage (cell death)

however talking about free radicals from drugs, there are sure drugs that relase oxidants more than others

in my opinion, tryptamines are safer than PEAs


BTW i would like to say something about harm reduction:

what do you think of this combo?:

Selenium 30mics
Vitamin C 60mg
Vitamin E 10mg
N-Acetylcsteine 600mg
Melatonin 3mg(before sleep)
Ginseng 40mg(extract)
Zinc 5mg
5-htp 100mg
Copper 0.5mg
Iron 5mg
L-Tryptophan 300mg
Magnesium 45mg
Niacin 36mg
other vitamins 100%RDA

i was thinking about adding to the list:
EPA & DHA (omega-3 fats)
Silimarine (hepato-protective)
Gingko biloba extract
L-Gltathione(+NAC=Glutathione peroxidase, one of the strongest antioxidants)
L-Phenylalanine(tyrosine precursor, dopamine and adrenaline precursor)
Alpha-Lipolic-Acid


oh, and i heard that selenium and vitamin C can be also pro-oxidant!
how can this be?it could be avoided?

Reputation Comments on this post:

Interesting, thanks for sharing.

[Rush]

talking about harm reduction, which substances can improve memory?

[El Calico Loco]

DMAE did wonders for Swim's memory. After taking a moderate daily dose for a couple of weeks, he began to remember minor events from his childhood (like playing soccer in PE) in the middle of the day for no reason at all. Things he hadn't thought about in years.

Both DMAE and Piracetam seem to be good for memory and cognition. One should take a choline supplement with these, lest one's brain work too well and use up all it's fuel.

DMAE is contraindicated for those with high blood pressure. It can make one irritable if too much is taken. Piracetam, by contrast, seems completely nontoxic.


ECL