Confusion is caused by not being aware of the Truth

[RJeez]

I was thinking that paranoia,bad feelings,confusion are caused by not accepting the truth,which we always know,somewhere inside us.In fact,the truth has to be inside us,because the only thing that we can say is 100% true is something that doesn't contradict with us.To not accept the truth is ,in fact,disagreeing with it,or disagreeing with ourselves.For instance,2+2=4,right?Is that true?You would have to say yes,but can you actually prove it?It would be closer to the truth. . . truthful in fact,to say,that I think that 2+2=4,that is true,because it doesn't contradict with me "inside".

Socrates said that to say,"I don't know",is more "correct" than hazarding a guess,because it is the truth.What I was thinking was,that when confused when having a trip,that maybe you could start by saying,"I am confused."That is the truth,and by following some sort of Socratic line of questioning,you could become conscious of yourself and whatever is causing your confusion.The Truth is the only constant that we have in the whole universe,and by becoming aware of it,paranoid thoughts like,"They're out to get me,"can be replaced by the truth,with thoughts like,"Are they out to get me?Is that true?I dont know-That is true.Am I just thinking they are out to get me?I don't know,but it is true to say that I am thinking that."By becoming aware of the truth,we have something that is not a deception,or anything to get paranoid about because it is open,has no "hidden agenda".

Reputation Comments on this post:

Thought provoking..I'll try this line of thinking next time i trip!

[ojos_de_brujo]

IMO truth is just a concept, used to facilitate thinking. The truth does not really exist.
But it makes life easier to think it does.

IMHO it is not the knowledge of truth that will teach you how to deal with paranoid thoughts. It is the realisation that you are thinking. That paranoid thoughts, depressing thoughts, are no different than any other thought you might have, no matter if you are tripping or not.

If you are confused, breaking down your thoughts to reflect what is real, is not that easy. A quest for the truth, can easily be corrupted by a simple error of thought. You might end up strengthening your paranoid delusions.

Teaching yourself to realise that a thought is just merely a thought, and does not necessarily have anything to do with reality, might be more useful and certainly easier when tripping.

[RJeez]

The only thing that is true is what I know is true,and has to be something about myself,like,"I don't know",is true when I don't know because I know it is true when I don't know.

How do you know that your principles are true?The only thing that is true is what comes from you,because it is undeniable.2+2=4,but can you prove it?To say that you think that 2+2=4 is true.There is a difference between a statement that is true,and the actual truth.I like ice cream is a true statement,but only because it is true that I like ice cream,and that doesn't need any proof.If there is an arguement,and someone conveniently forgets to omit the truth,it is like a big elephant in the room.Everyone knows it is there,because the truth is in all of us.Or rather,the spirit of truth is in all of us.The truth is part of us,because the only thing that is true is what doesn't contradict with us internally.It is though we "make" the truth,and it is a constant,and in fact,the only constant thing in the universe.

Some people might say that the only thing that doesn't change is that everything changes,and that is a constant-a true statement.But do you know that?To say that you don't know is closer to the truth,because you don't really know that for sure,and you don't know is the truth.The statement "I don't know" is a reflection of what is really in your mind,a truth.The truth and yourself are inseperable,and that is what makes the truth a constant,because to deny it is to disagree with yourself,because the truth comes from you.You can't make judgements about anything apart from yourself that can be called true,because the only judgements that can be totally relied upon are judgements of yourself,because you know yourself,so how can you say that any judgements of yourself are untrue,unless you refuse to acknowledge yourself and the truth of yourself?It is smarter to say that you don't know than to pretend that you do know because at least you know one thing,that it is the truth,and it gives you a blank sheet to "build the foundation of your knowledge" on.

This doesn't just apply when you're tripping,it is just exaggerated when tripping.Confusion is when you don't acknowledge the truth,and truth starts in yourself.If you acknowledge the truth in yourself,and of yourself,you can start to become less confused,and eventually see what's true.

[Bio-Cellular Enigma]

Originally Posted by RJeez

I was thinking that paranoia,bad feelings,confusion are caused by not accepting the truth,which we always know,somewhere inside us.

Supposing we accepted the hypothesis that there was a 'Truth with capital-T', presumably some sort of spiritual 'Truth'.

If so, what makes you think that confusion, bad feelings, paranoia, etc. would be caused by not accepting it? Is there something unreal, false, incorrect or otherwise incompatible with Truth about these particular feelings and emotional states?

Or is it perhaps something much more shallow; one finds these emotions unpleasant, so they redefine "Truth" to be something that excludes them?

If there were a Truth, it must be bent and broken into a thousand pieces by now, given all the people trying to shape it to fit their likes, dislikes, opinions, preferences and personal agendas...

[Trebor]

Perhaps you're an empiriscist.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empiricism

[Nagognog2]

A red-hot burner will burn your hand if you place your hand on it. Truth.

Duz Detergent is used by real men. Real men want clean clothes. Duz Detergent gets your clothes clean. False.

[Bio-Cellular Enigma]

Originally Posted by Nagognog2

A red-hot burner will burn your hand if you place your hand on it. Truth.

No fair declaring as "Truth" a hypothesis nobody is willing to test... that's cheating .

[Triple7]

I need to try to post in threads of other topics as well.. hmmm... =)

That something is truth is really something that doesn't 100% contradict with us. But that 2+2=4 wouldn't be truth is wrong, I think it is true and it cannot be contradicted. Lot of simple things can be shown to be true, but they may not be real. With real, I mean that they do not exists in reality as matter. Paranoia, bad feelings and confusion do not exist as matter, but they are real. There is dualism, what is true for someone may not be the truth for the other one. But let us think for the truth for oneself (and not others). But to go on, we must think of what accept means. Or maybe simplier, what does not accept mean? To not accept is to deny. To deny truth causes paranoia, bad feelings ans confusion. I think it is easy to understand that deny truth causes confusion. Since not knowing the truth is confusion. 2+2=5 is confusion. If your loved is death sick and you do not accept it, i.e. not accept that you loved will soon die.. them if you accept that your loved will die without feeling paranoia or to feel bad, is that then love?

[longdistancerunner]

Originally Posted by Triple7

That something is truth is really something that doesn't 100% contradict with us. But that 2+2=4 wouldn't be truth is wrong, I think it is true and it cannot be contradicted. Lot of simple things can be shown to be true, but they may not be real. With real, I mean that they do not exists in reality as matter. Paranoia, bad feelings and confusion do not exist as matter, but they are real. There is dualism, what is true for someone may not be the truth for the other one. But let us think for the truth for oneself (and not others). But to go on, we must think of what accept means. Or maybe simplier, what does not accept mean? To not accept is to deny. To deny truth causes paranoia, bad feelings ans confusion. I think it is easy to understand that deny truth causes confusion. Since not knowing the truth is confusion. 2+2=5 is confusion.

I'm not saying you are wrong by stating that 2+2=4, however, 2+2=5 and I am 100% sure of it. If you say that is confusion, that I am incorrect, then you, my friend, are wrong.

...10 minutes later

Stop confusing me with this mathematical nonsense of 2+2=4, I swear it is fucking with my head, I'm getting paranoid, I'm starting to shake and have bad feelings, I'm so confused, so lost in some existential dillema that my brain is minutes away from shutting down completley.

You contradicted the fuck out of yourself in that post. Prove it, right now, that your left nut exists in "REALITY" as "MATTER." And I'll prove that 2+2=5. I think the reason you are so confused is because you are struggling to accept the "truth" that you have no idea what you are talking about.

[Yukio Mishima]

Originally Posted by longdistancerunner

I'm not saying you are wrong by stating that 2+2=4, however, 2+2=5 and I am 100% sure of it. If you say that is confusion, that I am incorrect, then you, my friend, are wrong.

...10 minutes later

Stop confusing me with this mathematical nonsense of 2+2=4, I swear it is fucking with my head, I'm getting paranoid, I'm starting to shake and have bad feelings, I'm so confused, so lost in some existential dillema that my brain is minutes away from shutting down completley.

You contradicted the fuck out of yourself in that post. Prove it, right now, that your left nut exists in "REALITY" as "MATTER." And I'll prove that 2+2=5. I think the reason you are so confused is because you are struggling to accept the "truth" that you have no idea what you are talking about.

Tsk tsk, we don't 'prove' empirical hypotheses. Proof is confined to deductive realms of discourse, such as those of logic and mathematics. It is fair for me to ask proof of you without being able to prove that I am sitting front of a computer, as opposed to merely imagining that I am.

[longdistancerunner]

Originally Posted by Yukio Mishima

Tsk tsk, we don't 'prove' empirical hypotheses. Proof is confined to deductive realms of discourse, such as those of logic and mathematics. It is fair for me to ask proof of you without being able to prove that I am sitting front of a computer, as opposed to merely imagining that I am.

...I'm saying you can't prove anything at all, for logic and mathematics and such are all individual human creations and thus carry no real truth behind them...thats what I was trying to express to RJeez. If to me 2+2=5 is reality, if that is what I believe in, it is just as valid as anyone else's false certainty that 2+2=4. Mathematics, time, language and other forms of logical reasoning are merely crutches we apes use to help us describe and understand an indescribable reality. You said yourself you cannot prove that you are actually sitting in front of your computer, as opposed to imagining it, and you are 100% right...but think about it... If you can't prove your own existence...how can there be any real truth other than the entirety of your own individual mental and sensual experience? Every feeling, emotion and thought, experienced moment by moment, is all that we can really prove. "You" cannot prove that 1 second ago "you" had a headache...but "you" know that sensation is "real" in the present moment... I used the quotations to outline the problem with language so people can understand this in the right context; the use of "you" implys you exist as some actual entity, which you said yourself is questionable, and "real" implys some kind of objective reality, which is exactly what I am saying does not "exist."...So just keep in mind nothing I say actually means anything in any kind of objective sense...nor does anything anyone says Language is merely a form of expression, as is mathematics, time, and science. We get tricked into believing them as reality, when they are just human inventions created to help describe reality, which is a completley subjective experience.

[ojos_de_brujo]

Truth? Well, maybe Swim should say not believing in a concept of 100% truths, does not make her delusional about reality. She does accept it.
But Swim always has this little bit of doubt about everything, be it facts, truth, reality. It's her default mind setting.
She can't help it. Believing in absolute facts, great truths, is as impossible to Swim as believing in God. She has no magical belief in science anymore.
It's all hypothesis anyway. She accepts things to be 99,99 % true.

Maybe it's about growing up in a postmodern world, Swim doesn't know. Swim never liked postmodernism much, but she guesses in a way it has influenced her, not by reading about it, but way before. Maybe it's just some deep feeling of disappointment in the world that Swim has.

Still think the OP should be looking for correct thinking, instead of truth.
So many people claim to know the truth. Whilst believing opposite things.

[RJeez]

Being conscious of the truth and conscious of yourself go hand in hand,the same thing in fact,truth being. . . .I don't know.Hypothetical question to illustrate-If you had superman's powers,would you spend all your time saving people,making yourself rich and shagging supermodels,or you don't know what you would do?There is no correct answer,but you will know when you are telling the truth,and that is when you are you,are conscious of yourself.If I was to answer truthfully,I would say I don't know,because I cant predict the future,but I do know myself.

Simply put,the truth is when you are being truthful.

There's what you think you know is true,and what you know is true.

Ever been sarcastic?Why are you sarcastic?Because it saves you being or acting in a way you know is "right".Whatever the reason,it is the truth,and you know it is.You know it because it is the truth.

I say that we can't say that 2+2=4 is not true because unless you can prove it,do you know it is true?That is what I am talking about,what you know is true.And paradoxically,the truth is the only thing that doesn't need proof,because you already know it is true.And just because the truth can't be proved doesn't make 2+2=4 the truth,because it can't be proved,because the truth is different,it doesn't need proving because we all know it.

If I close my eyes,and wiped my memory,have I still a body?The truth is,I don't know.When I say truth,what I mean is something that you know 100%,and can't be contradicted by external "data".What is 13763*673487?Do you know?No?Right,to say that you don't know is the truth,because it is true,and can't be contradicted by external data,doesn't need proof,because you already know internally what is going on in your mind,inside you.That is "more"it doesn't have to be proved,and you only know that 2+2=4 because you were told so and it is only a memory.Have you ever actually proved that 2+2=4,or can you do so now?Your memory can fool you-it does all the time,and can't be relied on to be the truth,unless it is not a memory you are speaking of,and you are speaking the truth from the heart,eg.I love my parents or children.(I say "more" because it is either true or it isn't.In fact,I would say that there is no false,but true and . . . isn't true,conscious or unconscious.Is evil its own thing or the lack of good and darkness the lack of light?Do you see what I mean?)

Someone asked how can not accepting the truth cause confusion or a bad trip.It's because you are repressing the truth about yourself.Haven't you ever done something foolish,and when someone points it out,we protest and meake ourselves look more foolish?And then later,you realise the truth,that you were foolish,yes?The truth can be a harsh thing,and hard to accept,and if it sn't accepted it can remove us from ourselves.It's a psychological thing.We all know how it feels to be arrogant,and ignoring what we know as true,ie.I am being arrogant,and perhaps looking a fool,ignoring the truth that we should be humble and not arrogant.We all know how to act,and we know because something inside us,our "higer selves",whatever,only we like to put on an act for others.Do you know what I mean?Have you ever done it?Ignored what you know is true and put on a "mask" for others benefit?You ask,how would that cause confusion?Well,it seems obvious to me,that if you can't even be your true self,and wear a mask,then that seems a shaky foundation to build on what you think is true.Of course it's going to cause confusion.And if you are tripping and you do something for your own amusement,something that you know is wrong,eg.trying to freak someone out,then you will become detached from your true self in favour of the "masked" you,and the you might just freak yourself out,and rightly so.

Think about it,think about the meaning of the word true.Something is only true if you know it is,something that can't be contradicted by anyone else.Is Bush the president?Yes.Do you know that?Yes.Is it true that he is the president?Yes.But supposing you were ignorant of the results of an ongoing election,and you turned out to be wrong.It is true to say that you thought that you were correct.That is the only thing that is treu,what comes from inside,because it can't be contradicted by anyone.To say "I don't know what 10 times 100" is more "correct" than "10 times 100=1001" because it is true.And that is the truth,and it is always conscious,there somewhere.

Many non believers in religion say that they don't believe in religion even when they agree with something.That means,what they agree on is true,but only if is something that can't be contradicted or if they aren't contradicting themselves.Just because 2 people agree that 2+2=4 doesn't make it true,because the truth is I don't know because I can't prove it,I have doubt,and to say I haven't is a contradiction,so to say I have doubt is true.Something is only true when there is no doubt,no "might be's or no might be's",etc.Would you bet your life or your kid's life that 2+2=4?Or,would you rather place your bet on the fact that you wouldn't like to lose that bet?Why?Because you know it is true INSIDE.

[RJeez]

Ojos de brujo,thankyou for giving me the chance to explain.You may never bee 100% sure of something,but you can be 100% sure that you are not 100% of something.That is the truth.But the truth is not written in stone,because it is also true to say that are 100% sure that you are not 100% sure of something.The truth isn't 100% "right" or "wrong",it is true.That's why the truth is hard to explain,it is a slippery bastard that defies logic.Ojos be brujo,you say that you always leave a little space for doubt,or that you do not know 100%,yes?Well,in that case,would you say it is true,(not 100% correct,truth is more than 100%)to say that you leave a little space for doubt?Any other answer than yes would be contradicting yourself.

BTW,Motorhead are the best band ever.Is that true?I don't know?Do I like them?Yes.That is true.Do you get me now?Yes,no,don't know?Whatever the answer,it is true,because as long as you are not contradicting yourself(and if you are then you will know why,because it is inside you,and the truth),it is the truth.

[RJeez]

Is he trying to scare me,or am I imagining it?Whatever the answer,if it is the truth,then you will be on the way to stop being scared,because you have a starting point.Get me?

[Yukio Mishima]

Think about it,think about the meaning of the word true.Something is only true if you know it is,something that can't be contradicted by anyone else.

Something can be true without your knowing that it is. If it I say 'it's raining' and it is raining, what I've said is true, even if I had no idea that it is true. Maybe I was in a concrete room with no windows.

[RJeez]

Even if you were wrong,it doesn't matter.I mean,just because you can see that it is raining,hypothetically speaking,how do you know that it isn't a holographic projection.The only truth that you have is from yourself,and when you are conscious of that,you are conscious of yourself,and anything that you project,maybe in the form of an hallucination,and the you can "track down" any errant or wayward projections.

[fnord]

truth all depends on who you ask,

bush:"im doing a fine job as a president" to him this is a truth,but to anyone else...

[RJeez]

I agree.The only thing that is true is what I know about me.For instance,2+2=4,not because I know it is,but because I know that I believe it is,and I know that I believe because I know what I know,and that is neither right or wrong,it is indisputable,and therefore the Truth.Nobody else can dispute what goes on in my head,or rather,what goes on in me.

As long as I am conscious of myself,everything that I know about myself is the truth,and that is a good place to start from to becoming conscious of all that is projected from you,eg.hallucinations that might confuse you.They are only confuse you,because you are unconscious of yourself,meaning you are unconscious of the source of the projected hallucinations,you being the source,wether you are conscious or unconscious,they are still being projected.

[LateBloomer]

Originally Posted by RJeez

I was thinking that paranoia,bad feelings,confusion are caused by not accepting the truth,which we always know,somewhere inside us.In fact,the truth has to be inside us,because the only thing that we can say is 100% true is something that doesn't contradict with us.To not accept the truth is ,in fact,disagreeing with it,or disagreeing with ourselves.For instance,2+2=4,right?Is that true?You would have to say yes,but can you actually prove it?It would be closer to the truth. . . truthful in fact,to say,that I think that 2+2=4,that is true,because it doesn't contradict with me "inside".

Socrates said that to say,"I don't know",is more "correct" than hazarding a guess,because it is the truth.What I was thinking was,that when confused when having a trip,that maybe you could start by saying,"I am confused."That is the truth,and by following some sort of Socratic line of questioning,you could become conscious of yourself and whatever is causing your confusion.The Truth is the only constant that we have in the whole universe,and by becoming aware of it,paranoid thoughts like,"They're out to get me,"can be replaced by the truth,with thoughts like,"Are they out to get me?Is that true?I dont know-That is true.Am I just thinking they are out to get me?I don't know,but it is true to say that I am thinking that."By becoming aware of the truth,we have something that is not a deception,or anything to get paranoid about because it is open,has no "hidden agenda".

The first paragraph has the best information. As we dissolve the ego and rid ourselves of those parts of the mind that affect only the negative parts, we will be left with the truth as we know it. The mind deludes us as not to hurt us, because the truth hurts. The ego works as a kind of buffer that lets you get around the truth that would normall cause suffering, usually at the want of a desire.

In a sidebar, paranoia, especially through smoking marijuana, is just your mind linking two concepts in the mind it normally wouldn't associate with, it just happens to be one or two negative things. Its the same process where you see something that your normally wouldn't find that funny but laugh your ass off because you link two disparate things together and its hilarioius.

[Triple7]

Statement 1 (by Rjeez): paranoia,bad feelings,confusion are caused by not accepting the truth

Statement 2 (by Rjeez): because the only thing that we can say is 100% true is something that doesn't contradict with us.

2+2=4 is true and is a result from definition of numbers and addition. It cannot be contradicted, otherwise the whole fundament of mathematics would be wrong. The fundament of mathematics is true, but it doesn't exist. Cows, pigs and birds exists.. numbers don't, they are just an invention (and still true).

Statement 3 (be Triple7): To not accept is to deny

Use statement 3 on Statement 1..

Not accepting truth is confusion, that is OK. For example, if someone believes 2+2=5 or that 2+2 = my left testicle (anyone who needs a picture of it?), then that is confusion.

Paranoia and bad feeling is not caused by not accepting the truth. Why? Wanting someone to die, is that love? If someone kills a loved puppy so it won't suffer from injury, is that from love? Now I say WANT (not DO.. to achieve what one wants does not have to be reachable.. want and do are not the same things.. you want 10M$ but can you earn 10M$?). It is more love to want to be able to heal the puppy than rather want to kill it. So to kill the puppy you accept that your puppy will die without feeling paranoia or to feel bad, is that then love? This is a contradiction to paranoia or bad feeling is caused by not accepting the truth. (see statement 2).

[TMM]

Originally Posted by Triple7

2+2=4 is true and is a result from definition of numbers and addition. It cannot be contradicted, otherwise the whole fundament of mathematics would be wrong. The fundament of mathematics is true, but it doesn't exist. Cows, pigs and birds exists.. numbers don't, they are just an invention (and still true).

As above. 2+2=4 is true mathematically, but doesn't exist. Yet existential statements are tricky, as it must exist in some form otherwise this sentence itself wouldn't exist. Truth is as observation goes. Even "I think, therefore I am" is an observation, and not necessarily true. Absolute truth is truth outside of observation. Now how can that be?

Originally Posted by euthanatos93420

As Lao Tzu said, "You cannot see the moon if you're looking at the finger." Morals are a byproduct of fear and judgement. They are an attempt to control the world and people around us by selling freedom for security. Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law. Love is the Law. Love under will. What is love? Love is an action. If I attempt to define it any further than this you may be inclined to look at my finger instead of the moon.

Looking at the finger and looking at the moon are the same thing.

[LookingForHer]

It makes sense yeah.

[Euthanatos93420]

2=0

The true Tao cannot be known.

I reccomend that anyone in search of he truth read The Stone and the Flute by Hans Bemman. Read the book and acquire the Stone. Search for the truth and find it at death. Death=Truth. Understanding this helps one eliminate fear and Rebuild Paradigm. I find an Alchemical Process I have called Salient Dissiloution of Morale a quintessential element to seeking the truth. As Lao Tzu said, "You cannot see the moon if you're looking at the finger." Morals are a byproduct of fear and judgement. They are an attempt to control the world and people around us by selling freedom for security. Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law. Love is the Law. Love under will. What is love? Love is an action. If I attempt to define it any further than this you may be inclined to look at my finger instead of the moon.

2+2=4 is not Truth. It is Logic. The difference is sublte but poingant. Within this state of mixed reality and unreality anything is possible. Even 2+2=X where X≠4



Perhaps 2=0?

[InsaneNcrazY]

We are all confused but we try to understand our surroundings by a made up reality. Numbers help us to understand ourselves and physics of the reality made for us by us.