addictive research chemicals

[dr ACE]

is it possible to get 'addicted' to research chemicals,the only one ive tried which seemed to have a tolerance was 5meo-amt

[Ximot]

depends on how you define addiction, I guess.

I know of no true psychedelics that are addictive in the true sense of the word, but many may brng about psychological dependence in the user who has a predisposition for dependency.

then again, not all RCs are psychedelics, e.g. methylone, which I could imagine being psychologically addictive...

is MDMA addictive? I'd say no, but then some may say yes.

is there a lot of tolerance for 5-meo-amt? it is one i haven't tried and possibly won't due to its reported side effects.

cannabis produces almost no tolerance at all in me... actually I get more sensitive with time, it seems. But I consider it as addictive nevertheless. (And I know that if one smokes non-stop, it will produce short-term tolerance).

[discobloodbath]

its possible to get addicted to anything, from soda to rc's.. anything has the potential for abuse, it all depends on the person

[serotonin]

it also depends on whether your talking about physical or pyschological dependence. like bloodbath said it is possible to be addicted to anything (phschologically). but physical dependence is a chemical thing. do some research on the specific drug and im sure you will find some usefull information.

[hippie_lain]

Sorry for the bad news, but the only rc that I hear is attictive is AMT. Withdraws and all. But all my friends do lots of drugs so it could be from combos

[Ximot]

@hippie_lain: could you elaborate in that?

[enquirewithin]

Yes-- is AMT really addictive????

[lociel]

Is addicutive mentality?
such as nicotine or meth?
I think that AMT is different when it is so.
"Addictive" is what phenomenon?

[HippieD9]

I could see something like 5-MeO-DMT getting psychologically addictave, but most RCs take up so much time and energy that they couldn't be used daily by most people. Just my 2cents.





Peace,


D.

[dmax]

Try this, from erowid.



http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=24727



It's anecdotal, not scientific, but it seems like there may be
addictive potential to AMT and 5meo-AMT. Be careful and such.

[greenman420]

I'm sure there's some out there, but RC's are not strictly psychoactive chemicals.... RC stands for RESEARCH CHEMICALS. This does not limit it just to phenethlamines and tryptamines, so I'm sure there's others out there that would be addicting.....


I'm also sure they have analogs for cocaine, heroine, and morphine as well. As a matter of fact, back when I was in high school I had to pass a kidney stone. Went to the hospital and they shot me up with a morphine analog to help with the pain. And trust me this shit kicked my ass. Could defintly see something like that be very addicting...

[lociel]

Was there addictive Tryptamines before?
problem is it.
If it's heroine and cocaine analogs though it is possible to understand.

Absolutely. RCs are absolutely addictive if you use them in the wrong
way for the wrong reasons -- just like food or sex or anything else fun
can be "addictive". If you come to rely on it for support or escape
from difficulty, it can become an addiction.

[ChemicallyBound]

There are grades or levels of addiction. a little kid can be addicted to candy , always crying or complaining to get more. then there is the chronic heroin addict who doses whenever the chance presents itself.


However, withdrawal of candy is not physically discomforting to the candy addicted kid whereas the heroin addict will go thru physical trauma if deprived.


I think another example in between would be the cigarette smoker.


just goes to show there are many levels of addiction.

[dr ACE]

i think its safe to say most if not all rcs are not addictive cause theycost so much,illegality, and some have hellish negative side effects.if there ever is an rc developed in the future whichcompletelymimics the proertiesof coke, eor lsd without any of the usual sidefects.then theywould obivously become addictivedrugs of choice,but the price is the mainreason whypotenial addicts never get the chance to become addiceted to any of theseresearchchemicals

[dmax]

Gah! Dr. ACE, cost isn't a good factor in deciding addictivity. I
think even heroin can get pricey, but that doesn't stop junkies.
Also, where I'm from, research chems can be pretty cheap.

[Nagognog2]

Such exists as people with an addictive personality type. These folks can become addicted to anything and everything from huffing butane to bug spray. So, of course, there are those who could become habituated to RC's. Is Glade Air Freshener addictive? Well, there was a young woman near where I live who became hooked on it. She's dead - but I'll get she still smells like a pine forest!

[hippie_lain]

Sorry for the long wait but 2 of my friends did AMT none stop (but with other drugs) and they got addicited mentally and had withdraws from it.......thus additicted physically too. The withdraws were similar to X physically but more like meth in the mental addiction. Sorry again for the long wait guys.

[fastandbulbous]

Originally Posted by hippie_lain

Sorry for the long wait but 2 of my friends did AMT none stop (but with other drugs) and they got addicited mentally and had withdraws from it.......thus additicted physically too. The withdraws were similar to X physically but more like meth in the mental addiction. Sorry again for the long wait guys.

Well none of the literature concerning the Soviet use of AMT as an antidepressant made any note of addiction, which you'd think they would if any sort of physical dependance existed. I'm not refuting the psychological component as anything can become psychologically addictive, but physically? I've taken low dose AMT for prolonged periods as a self prescribed antidepressant and had no difficulty either physical or mental upon stopping and I know I have what would be classified as a tendancy towards addictive behaviour (I know what physical dependance is as I've had my brief run ins with the children of the poppy)

[voacanga]

methylone, and bdb have had a hand full of people claim to be physically addicted, when i tried bdb, i didnt see any addictive qualities

[zipoo]

what is bdb?


as for addction as ha sbeen pointed out it depends on you definition of addiction, but it woul dbe my gess that different rc have diffferent affects.


one of the reasons that mdma is not addictive as tehre is only so much you can do before it loses its effectivenss and teh smae seems to be true of many rc's.

My therapist was the one who finally gave me a clear definition of
"addiction" that I can really agree with. Addiction is feeling
compelled to continue using something despite adverse consequences
(mental, physical, social, etc.)



Under this definition any behavior can be addictive, but as applied to
drugs and alcohol, I think it absolutely is correct and absolutely can
be applied to psychedelics and RCs. If you're taking them for escapism,
or for self-discovery, or creativity, or whatever, and you can't/don't
want to stop despite knowing you probably should, you are addicted. ANd
I may be weird for this, but I have totally been there.



I really wish more would be made of the addictiveness of psychedelics
for certain types of people. I might not even have tried them if I'd
known it was a possiblity, and that would have saved me a lot of grief.
Don't get me wrong, I still love 'em, but it's just not as cut and
dried as "they're not addictive".

[gn2osis]

Assuming Explosion is really methylone, there is indeed some addictive
quality there. Here's an illustration. In one of those "which drug
are you?" quizzes, the question is asked:





If you were going to take drugs, your main reason would be:



-To relax your mind and body
-To make everything feel twice as good
-To experience a whole new realm of thought
-To lose a few inhibitions
-To sharpen your senses and think more clearly




Methylone (Explosion) does something in the ballpark of just about all
those things. it doesn't really relax your body, but it's not
that
speedy either, and emotionally feels so good that you can't help but
open and therefore relax. It feels amazing, especially the
initial
rush; one subject reported that cuddling with g/f was sheer
bliss. It's not psychedelic unless a little ganja is added, but
it does
have some of that mental looseness and playfulness. It's almost
dangerously disinhibiting;
as with XTC you let down your guard; be sure you aren't in a setting
where you might share things you would regret. And while it
doesn't exactly make thinking exactly clearer as stimulants do, it does
enhance
sensation generally, promotes wakefulness (for awhile) and is not a
sedative.




Now tell me, what's not to like about that? But besides the fact
that
it feels so good, there is something about methylone that (like
cocaine) leaves one hungry for more. It doesn't ever quite get
over the top, and you can imagine how great a +3 would feel on it, so
of course you want more. That's to be expected with coke, but
with an RC it takes one quite by surprise, since most RC's
are psychedelics which if anything are more like cures for
addiction.




It's actually pretty disturbing to have a substance (especially an RC)
rewire one's cognition, making one think about doing more, and
soon. Khat is reportedly addictive, so maybe
this just goes with the cathinone territory. Jonesin' for that
subtle
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Edited by: gn2osis

[Nicaine]

Originally Posted by gn2osis

Now tell me, what's not to like about that? But besides the fact that it feels so good, there is something about methylone that (like cocaine) leaves one hungry for more. It doesn't ever quite get
over the top, and you can imagine how great a +3 would feel on it, so of course you want more. That's to be expected with coke, butwith an RC it takes one quite by surprise, since most RC's are psychedelics which if anything are more like cures for addiction.

That 'something' is a neurotransmitter called dopamine.

Edit -- Nagognog2 mentioned it already (didn't see his post). But as a former coke fiend, SWIM has learned to instantly recognize a substance that hits dopamine... increased sex drive is the most obvious sign. Quite honestly M1 seems to do it even moreso than coke, only with less norepinephrine effects (making it a lot less tweaky). In SWIM's opinion it stops hitting serotonin quite early, as in redose #1. At least it seemed to SWIM to lose any empath/entactogenic effects, and the dopamine effects to come front and center. It may resemble methcathinone more closely than MDMA.

It's actually pretty disturbing to have a substance (especially an RC)
rewire one's cognition, making one think about doing more, and soon.

No rewiring involved, just simple (bio)chemistry. Cognitive rewiring takes time, but dopamine can cause immediate cravings for more {of whatever increases it or blocks its reuptake}.

[Triple7]

during the last 4-5 months, i have been taking



~800mg 4-aco-dipt

~340mg amt

~80mg 5-meo-mipt

~600mg 4-ho-dipt

~1200mg meopp

~10mg 5-meo-det (this one is bad)

~100mg methylone


and i developed tolerance to all of those rc above except pherhaps
4-aco-dipt. to amt and especially 5-meo-mipt i developed tolerance very
quick.



the first time i took 40mg amt, was a stronger experience that last
time when i took 80mg. i didn't feel that the 80mg was a strong trip
and the setting was good.. still i had lots of fun.. oh, at 80mg, i
felt a little dizzy like if i was drunk, but i had not taken any
alcohol.



the 4-ho-dipt, if i take 15mg i feel nothing, but at 30mg i start
trippping and it is good.. i think a good dose is 30-45mg. I have tried
both 60 and 90mg and that was a waste.. it looks like the iprocin gets
saturated.



first time, i eyeballed 5-10mg and got a little stoned, second time i
just took 10-20mg and had a heavy trip were i was very disoriented. 3rd
and 4th time i had 10-15mg and the effects were weak and short. next
time i will go for ~20mg. (eyeballing seem not to work well, because i
can't make these 4 trips to become 80mg..).



the 4-aco-dipt, i can take 10mg and still feel that i am getting stoned
(shining and staring).. it seem like there is no point in taking more
than 40mg. max taken was 60mg and felt very sexual.. there came some
fluids from my dick.



i have also tried combos, if i take half dose of x and half dose of y.. it gives a weaker trip that a full dose of x or y only.



also.. it seem like it is better for me to take small amounts of rc
several times during the trip, than taking one big one. i cannot
explain why it is like this. for example, i think it is better to take
20mg 4-aco dipt, then +10mg at +T0:30 and another +10mg at +T1:00 than
all 40mg at once at T0:00.






Edited by: Triple7