Sassafras oil legality

[Alfa]

Safrole is currently a List I chemical. Moreover, safrole is listed as a Table I precursor under the United Nations Convention Against Illicit Traffic in Narcotic Drugs and Psychotropic Substances.

Sassafras oil contains safrole.

Is sassafras oil ´an sich´ a watched substance? Is there anything illegal with acquiring quantities of sassafras oil?

[Nagognog2]

If intent could be established (USA), then likely a conspiracy to manufacture (Felony) charge would result. So if one were to be in/attempt to be in possession of a large (?) amount - one better have a damned good excuse that will hold up in court.

[Operacya_Y]

Yes, sassaras oil is watched.How many times SWIM saw in the webs where it is selling, all time before ordering SWIY will see the warning like this:
"If you order more than a gallon of sassafras in a 12 month period, we may require you to submit DEA registration paperwork. Orders under a gallon in a 12 month period should be fine, in today's climate... but that is subject to change without notice".

They know that sassafras contains safrole, here you are the second quote of it:
"The safrole in our sassafras is 91.7%, with an accuracy of 2% The congealing point temperature is approximately 7.5(c)".

Other sellers selling it no more than 2oz per one time and etc.

IMHO he is legal but watched.

[Nacumen]

One could always find some Sassafras albidum trees. Where SWIM comes from, those things are everywhere. SWIM would also imagine that while it would be more time-consuming, it would be more rewarding to extract the sassafras oil out of the root bark of a tree one felled rather than ordering it online and getting oneself put on an 'enemy combatant' list.

But before you do, make sure it's your own tree on your own property of course

[Synesthesiac]

Originally Posted by Operacya_Y

Yes, sassaras oil is watched.How many times SWIM saw in the webs where it is selling, all time before ordering SWIY will see the warning like this:
"If you order more than a gallon of sassafras in a 12 month period, we may require you to submit DEA registration paperwork. Orders under a gallon in a 12 month period should be fine, in today's climate... but that is subject to change without notice".

Really? swim cant find anywhere selling the oil. Maybe he's not looking hard enough. Theres plenty of places selling the shredded root bark by the kilo online, however. swim was wondering how hard it would be to steam distill (or microwave, etc), say 5kg, of Brazillian Sassafras albidum, and what the actual yield in oil you would expect from this amount.

So, swim is presuming that the shredded boot bark is the most basic form of material you can get safrole extracted from before it becomes illegal, and presumably watched?

[turborunner]

SWIM thinks that one could order a few gallons of the oil and say "I just wanted to see if the DEA would show up"(if they do). And when they ask where it is SWIM would just say "I don't know the garbage dump" when in fact SWIM'S evil twin lives in a secret lab under the dump.

[Synesthesiac]

So anyone know if the shredded Sassafras albidum root bark is the most basic form of material you can get safrole extracted from before it becomes illegal and watched? its available in nearly wholesale amounts from various retailers online.

How much oil would one expect from 10kg of shredded root bark?

[Nagognog2]

As I recall, it is removed from the ground material by steam-distillation. An old friend of mine used to make tea from the bark - until I ruined his fun by telling him it was listed as a carcinogen.

[firewall]

Yes, an ideal way to acquire sassasfras oil would be to grow numerous trees on your property, cut them down, uproot them, put the whole mess through a wood-chipper, and then steam-distill the result in huge metal drums. But that is pretty much the only way to get a lot of sassafras oil without buying it.

[Nacumen]

Originally Posted by firewall

Yes, an ideal way to acquire sassasfras oil would be to grow numerous trees on your property, cut them down, uproot them, put the whole mess through a wood-chipper, and then steam-distill the result in huge metal drums. But that is pretty much the only way to get a lot of sassafras oil without buying it.

That might be ideal for a SWIM who wants to supply the entire county with rolls, but, not everyone needs that much safrole for a semi-personal supply :/

[firewall]

Yeah, but the problem is that it is extremely time-consuming and tedious to extract sassafras oil on anything but an industrial scale. Even using a nice 2000 mL flask and packing it full of finely shredded root material, one will probably only acquire 5-10 mL or so per batch (and often far less if impotent material is used). With unlimited access to a nice variety of sassafras trees, it might be possible to accumulate 150-200 mL of sassafras oil using a big flask like that, but it would probably take a couple of months and a lot of unpleasant labor (digging up the roots is a royal pain in the ass). SWIF actually has entire music albums that he associates with steam distillation after the many nights of labor that he went through for a couple of months.

[Nacumen]

Originally Posted by firewall

Yeah, but the problem is that it is extremely time-consuming and tedious to extract sassafras oil on anything but an industrial scale. Even using a nice 2000 mL flask and packing it full of finely shredded root material, one will probably only acquire 5-10 mL or so per batch (and often far less if impotent material is used). With unlimited access to a nice variety of sassafras trees, it might be possible to accumulate 150-200 mL of sassafras oil using a big flask like that, but it would probably take a couple of months and a lot of unpleasant labor (digging up the roots is a royal pain in the ass). SWIF actually has entire music albums that he associates with steam distillation after the many nights of labor that he went through for a couple of months.

Very understandable. Props to SWIF for his dedication though. Hopefully he found it all worth it in the end

[robertone]

Originally Posted by Nagognog2

As I recall, it is removed from the ground material by steam-distillation. An old friend of mine used to make tea from the bark - until I ruined his fun by telling him it was listed as a carcinogen.

1. The steamdistillation method is the reason on which the dutch high-court (Hoge Raad der Nederlanden) decided that Sassafras oil isn't an natural product (the dutch law makes it difficult to rule natural products, to declare that an product isn't natural is an trend to overcome this difficullity which, by the way, can also be noted in the present dutch ruling on psilicybin containing mushrooms) and therefore should be seen equal to the ruled Safrole. Remarkably there is still some semi-official trade in Sassafras oil without an permit needed for the trade in Safrole.
2. Sassafras on itself isn't so much carcinogen as one might suspect. In research only pure Safrole showed possible carcinogenic in rats. Research with mixtures containing Safrole, like Sassafras oil, didn't gave suspicion as carcinogenic.
3. Sassafras oil should be ruled in all countries of the European Union. In note seven of "REGULATION (EC) No273/2004 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL of 11 February 2004 on drug precursors" there is written

   The measures applicable to sassafras oil are currently interpreted in different ways in the Community, since in some Member States it is regarded as a mixture containing Safrole and is therefore controlled, while other Member States regard it as a natural product not subject to controls. Inserting a reference to natural products in the definition of scheduled substances will resolve this discrepancy and therefore allow controls to be applied to sassafras oil; only natural products from which scheduled substances can be extracted easily should be covered by the definition.

   but as on today Sassafras oil still isn't ruled in all European Counsil countries.

[old hippie 56]

Back when swim was a child, growing up in a very rural area. Sassafras trees where everywhere. Nowadays, in the same rural area, they are hard to find. Always wonder where they went?

[firewall]

Originally Posted by old hippie 56

Back when swim was a child, growing up in a very rural area. Sassafras trees where everywhere. Nowadays, in the same rural area, they are hard to find. Always wonder where they went?

Law enforcement would have no reason to cut them down if that is what you are implying. Most of the sassafras oil used in the manufacture of MDMA is diverted from legitimate uses such as the production of piperonyl butoxide (an important component of certain insectisides). SWIM suspects that many Chinese exporters are not very rigorous about who they provide the chemical to either. In any case, an imaginary friend of SWIM decided long ago that the best possible way to acquire a ton of sassafras oil would be to utilize the method that I posted above. It would be quite doable for your average Joe (not to mention a knowledgable chemist) if they had the trees and the right tools. But this is probably off-topic.

[darawk]

Something I have always wondered about in this regard is if a defense of "I ordered it to waste the time and money of the DEA" would be a legitimate defense. Assuming that was your genuine purpose, even. If I were very wealthy, I think I would regularly order large quantities of GBL and all manner of List I chemicals then just destroy them - purely to waste the time and energy of DEA agents.

[Alfa]

The term 'Obstructing justice' comes to mind.

[darawk]

Originally Posted by Alfa

The term 'Obstructing justice' comes to mind.

I'm not sure about this, but as far as I know "obstruction of justice" has to be in reference to a particular crime, or there has to be some crime or specific criminal investigation associated with it. Merely sending the DEA on wild goose chases I don't think would qualify, especially if those wild goose chases are perfectly legal(e.g. ordering large quantities of safrole).

[Operacya_Y]

Another question about this theme.Can the, i.e USA peoples to send the sassafras oil to other europe countrys, export it, or they could`nt?

[robertone]

Originally Posted by Operacya_Y

Another question about this theme.Can the, i.e USA peoples to send the sassafras oil to other europe countrys, export it, or they could`nt?

If, IF!, possession and export of sassafras oil in the USA [state] isn't ruled, one wouldn't make an offence in the USA. For the European countries it is depending on the country, but the importer/receiver has the keep in mind that he/she could break local laws. Special because the European Parliament strongly prescribes that each member country should regulate the possesment and trade of [natural] sassefras oil.

[Felonious Skunk]

I believe that any substance containing greater than 30% safrole (an oil for example) can be legally considered a List I chemical.

The DEA allows trade in sassafras oil of up to around 90% (ocotea cymbarum, from Brazil), but you have to be registered with them and provide a legitimate use for the product, which could include uses in the aromatherapy, fragrance, and food flavoring industries.

With reasonable quantities, it's not all that difficult to fill out the paperwork and order a couple dozen lbs. of this stuff if you're willing to
send you're info to the DEA. But no one would be putting the stuff to sinister ends anyway, would they?

[Nagognog2]

I was thinking of marketing "Suicidal Paperweights" - a capsule of sodium cyanide encased in a block of clear Lucite. The government ruled some years back that Marijuana Toilet-Seats were legal. This was pot leaves encased in clear plastic as a toilet-seat. They ruled once something was encased in plastic - it was effectively destroyed in a legal sense.

Just don't get caught making 'em.

[Nacumen]

Originally Posted by Nagognog2

They ruled once something was encased in plastic - it was effectively destroyed in a legal sense.

Just don't get caught making 'em.

Challenging me, are you?

...

This is going to get interesting...

[old hippie 56]

From the DEA chemical diversion division

Advisories to the Public
SAFROLE AND SASSAFRAS OIL
ARE BEING USED IN THE ILLICIT MANUFACTURE OF MDMA

The Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA) and state/local law enforcement authorities throughout the United States have noted an alarming trend involving illicit MDMA production. MDMA (Ecstasy) is a major drug problem in the United States. All businesses engaged in the sale of safrole and essential oils rich in safrole, such as, sassafras oil, "brown" camphor oil or camphor oil 1.070, also referred to as Chinese sassafras oil, should be aware of the use of these products by clandestine MDMA laboratory operators.

Criminal elements routinely use these List I chemicals in the illicit production of MDMA. DEA is aware that these criminals are searching, often over the Internet, for sources of supply for these List I chemicals.

This notice is being provided to:

1. Make you aware that safrole and essential oils rich in safrole, such as sassafras oil, and brown camphor oil or camphor oil 1.070, are List I chemicals;

2. Remind all distributors of these products that they must be registered with DEA, obtain identifying information from their customers, keep records, report suspicious orders to DEA, and "know their customer," to avoid unwittingly becoming a supplier to a clandestine MDMA laboratory;

3. Advise all distributors of these List I chemicals that it is unlawful for any person to possess or distribute a listed chemical knowing, or having reasonable cause to believe, that the listed chemical will be used to manufacture a controlled substance in violation of the Controlled Substances Act…21 U.S.C. 841(c)(2). Persons who violate 21 U.S.C. 841(c)(2) and/or the recordkeeping and reporting requirements are subject to criminal and/or civil penalties.

Reputation Comments on this post:

	Very good information!
	swim learned alot from this post.

[Operacya_Y]

Very nice and informative information old hippie 56, thankyou!

But how about export it i.e in to Europe?