Morphine vs. other opiods?

[vike]

SWIM's morphine is real from Kadian caps. However, SWIMS reaction is not that of a few norcos, oxy's, or other good opiods. SWIM wants to know why REAL kadian doesn't provide the same or even better ephoric feeling??? SWIM is really confused by this. Thanks all.

[zera]

Well 1) Kadian is time released, meaning the morphine is only going to be slowly released into swiys bloodstream, unless swiy is crushing it up, and thus is going to be a very mild feeling over a long period of time. 2) Morphine has low oral bioavailable and a lot lower percentage of the morphine will be digested than say oxycodone.

Swim would suggest performing a cold water extraction, then use the final product rectally.

[kailey_elise]

Originally Posted by zera

Well 1) Kadian is time released, meaning the morphine is only going to be slowly released into swiys bloodstream, unless swiy is crushing it up, and thus is going to be a very mild feeling over a long period of time. 2) Morphine has low oral bioavailable and a lot lower percentage of the morphine will be digested than say oxycodone.

Swim would suggest performing a cold water extraction, then use the final product rectally.

Why would you try to CWE Kadian? CWE is to extract Asprin/APAP from pills, not the opiates.

Check you the morphine plugging thread, but basically SWIY'll want to crush and/or dissolve the pill in a small amount of water, then use a bulb syringe or a regular syringe without a needle to inject the now-cloudy water into SWIY rectum. A pinch of baking soda can be added to the water/morphine mixture to reduce ph, and it's best to do the enema after a bowel movement, as then there won't be any masses inside waiting to aborb the precious fluids and the rectal wall can do the absorbing. *grin*

~Kailey

[shoobie]

Here's swim's 2cents. Like the above posters I might tend to agree. Maybe morphine doesn't do it for swiy. for swim, morphine is the shiz. Swim thinks that there are people who do better with true opiates and some who like synthetics better. Swim guesses its all just like putting together a puzzle with the receptors. find the best one that fits and stick with it. Swim has no proble with oral bioavailabilty. Although swim thinks it better snorting crushed. Just can't bring myself to go the rectal route

[vike]

The statement "Morphine has low oral bioavailable and a lot lower percentage of the morphine will be digested than say oxycodone." must be the answer. I thought I had read enough, but, is there such a thing?? Thanks for the info. SWIM will attempt the CWE. Thanks all~

[fnord]

swims doen a fair amount of opiates and also knows many people that use often,morphine/diladid IMHO are only worth anything if you inject them,swims ate/snorted 150+mg of kadians before and felt very little if anything but he can inject 30mg and feel oh so good,pin pricks all over the body,nodding etc..

[vike]

From my understanding, morphine is the drug to rate all opiates against. Hmmmm... SWIM thinks oxy's are by far the most euphoric high all all. Morphine makes swim feel kinda wierd.

Originally Posted by fnord

swims doen a fair amount of opiates and also knows many people that use often,morphine/diladid IMHO are only worth anything if you inject them,swims ate/snorted 150+mg of kadians before and felt very little if anything but he can inject 30mg and feel oh so good,pin pricks all over the body,nodding etc..

[DrMuffy]

Well some people can really notice the difference (in effects) between a natural opiate high, like morphine, and a synthetic or even semi-synthetic opiate high, like oxycodone. Also, as mentioned above, morphine has a real low oral bioavailability, which would make other methods of ingestion (Injection, rectal administration, snorting, etc.) a better choice when it comes to getting as much out of the substance as possible.

[zera]

Originally Posted by DrMuffy

Well some people can really notice the difference (in effects) between a natural opiate high, like morphine, and a synthetic or even semi-synthetic opiate high, like oxycodone. Also, as mentioned above, morphine has a real low oral bioavailability, which would make other methods of ingestion (Injection, rectal administration, snorting, etc.) a better choice when it comes to getting as much out of the substance as possible.

This is interesting, I wonder though if its predisposed bias or that people would even be able to tell in a double-blind experiment. Do different opiates actually have different receptor affinity? I was under the impression that they all behave the same in the brain its just a matter of how powerful they are and how quickly they penetrate the blood brain barrier.

[kailey_elise]

Originally Posted by zera

This is interesting, I wonder though if its predisposed bias or that people would even be able to tell in a double-blind experiment.

I doubt it's predisposed bias, as the OP didn't know about morphine's low oral bioavailability prior to posting and his friend's experience was weak. I've heard from other people that they won't bother with morphine again, since it "didn't do anything"; upon learning that it should be taken by, well, basically any other method besides orally, it was tried again with good results. Obviously, they didn't have a predisposed bias either.

Some people don't like morphine via ANY route, some people vastly prefer hydrocodone and others won't touch anything other than oxycodone - it does make a difference. Apparently the different molecule setup fits differently in the opiate receptors, otherwise why would there be SOOOO many different options available? I know a number of people that swear by oxycodone, that they need 2x as much hydrocodone to get similar effects/pain relief and even that's weak and comes with major stomach pain. However, I also know another group of people that are the exact opposite, and get stronger effects from hydrocodone and stomach upset with oxycodone. Most people would say these medications are very similar and practically interchangeable; yet I know MANY people who would disagree.

So who knows? *LOL*

~Kailey

[vike]

I like this analogy. SWIM has hardly any headchange with morphine. However, the others are very euphoric. Thanks for the response.

Originally Posted by kailey_elise

I doubt it's predisposed bias, as the OP didn't know about morphine's low oral bioavailability prior to posting and his friend's experience was weak. I've heard from other people that they won't bother with morphine again, since it "didn't do anything"; upon learning that it should be taken by, well, basically any other method besides orally, it was tried again with good results. Obviously, they didn't have a predisposed bias either.

Some people don't like morphine via ANY route, some people vastly prefer hydrocodone and others won't touch anything other than oxycodone - it does make a difference. Apparently the different molecule setup fits differently in the opiate receptors, otherwise why would there be SOOOO many different options available? I know a number of people that swear by oxycodone, that they need 2x as much hydrocodone to get similar effects/pain relief and even that's weak and comes with major stomach pain. However, I also know another group of people that are the exact opposite, and get stronger effects from hydrocodone and stomach upset with oxycodone. Most people would say these medications are very similar and practically interchangeable; yet I know MANY people who would disagree.

So who knows? *LOL*

~Kailey

[methologist]

swim would say, when injecting or skin popping, swim prefers morphine to anything.

Oxycodone is the best orally, definatly. But when injecting, morphine is the gold standard.

[methologist]

nice to hear that someone likes morphine, swim gets the most amazing feeling from 10-15mg of oxycodone, can he expect the same feeling from 30mg oral morphine?

[Psych0naut]

Probaply not. SWIM has read many times that oxycodone is twice the strength of morphine, so that would mean one would have the same effects with 30mg oral morphine as with 15mg oxycodone, but in practice it's different. SWIM has only had one experience with oxycodone yet due to the fact pharmaceutical opiates are very hard to aquire where he lives. He snorted 5mg of oxycodone which is a tiny dose, but it felt the same like 20mg of snorted morphine. SWIM does have experience with other opiods and opiates so can make a bit of a comparisson, and in practice he found out morphine is even less the strength than half that of oxycodone. When SWIM snorted 30mg of morphine he only felt stoned but nothing amazing really, so orally it will probaply even less intense, and 30mg without any tolerance wasn't even special to SWIM.

[shoobie]

I tend to agree with someone who isn't psychonaut. The first time swim had any morphine it was oral and took 90 mg to get a really good effect. Swim also likes hydro and oxy as well. Oxy being swims favorite synthetic. But swim wouldn't expect to feel alot off 30 mg oral. There are better ways of doing it. Swim usually snorts morph. Swim just can't bear mainlining. Skin popping is a thought though. Now swim usually takes 120-150mg to get a good buzz going.

[methologist]

well if 30mg oral oxy wont do shit for swiy then swiy is not on swims level, cuz oral 7.5mg for swim is fantastic. so he thinks 30mg morphine IV will definatly be comparable!

[paulywould]

Check on the web for narcotic analgesic equivilent chart. It lists most narcotics in comparison to 10mg of Morphine. Morphine is the standard drug for comparison because it was one of the first narcotics pharmacuetically available.
PWould

[oxycontinuosly]

if swim doesnt like the kadian its maybe because it is the only LA morphine cap that is desighned to last 24 hrs..swim sais that m-eslon is the same kind of drug/capsule with beads and it is a q 12 h medication it comes in 15/30/60/100/200mg strenths

[heroin_ed]

Heroin and Hydromorphone feel the best IMO. Followed by Oxycodone and then Morphine. Heroin gets past the blood brain barrier so quickly it hits a swim SO much harder.

[mkmustng]

Swim does 400 mg a day of morp., no problem. Does anyone do more? Swim is trying to cut back to 200. Anything good to fill the void?

[samuraigecko]

Originally Posted by mkmustng

Swim does 400 mg a day of morp., no problem. Does anyone do more? Swim is trying to cut back to 200. Anything good to fill the void?

When SWIM had a good habit with Morph he would quite often go past the 600mg barrier (gray tablets known as "gray nurses" 100mg) He would take anywhere from 5 to 8 of these a day. (One does not recommend these dosages, especially for the opiate intolerant).

Morphine when smoked is quite bioavailable also (just for everyones information) and can be very similar to smoking Heroin.

When injected Morphine produces a fairly good high but it is not long lived (in his opinion) and has a totally different "taste" to Heroin.

Oxycodone (without any additive) like OxyNorm or OxyContin SWIM finds to be the most enjoyable out of all of them but this is just his opinion.

SWIM knows what the other poster means too, he knows that Morph and other opiates have a good bioavailability up the rectum but cannot bring himself to insert something into his ass.

As for his own real personal preference - CFO when done right can make a good experience either taken orally, made into a laudanum or tea or smoked and has on occasion even exceeded the H that happened to be around at the time (not for initial rush but definitely for duration and effect). And is also heaps better in his opinion because it costs practically nothing to make except the time taken to grow or order the poppy pods.

Just an opinion.