SWIM first timing fentanyl

[Harry]

Approximately 10 hrs ago, SWIM ( a 300-400 mg codeine per day user), put 2 50 mg fentanyl patches on. Understanding that used as directed it's full effects wouldn't be most peaked until the 24 hr period, and then thru until 72 hrs, if he has read properly.

SWIM is curious to know if the using of a hot bottle type application is worth speeding up the process, as he thinks he rtead somewhere that it could increase it by 33%? He is not sure if the 33% relates to the amounts being taken in, or of the time factor. Basically...will he get a better 'pain relief sorta feeling' sooner doing so, and if this is the case...will it shorten the 72 hrs. as designed?

SWIM is also not sure about how long one would actually leave the hot water bottle on said patches, to get such desired changes.

I've read a lot of the articles so far in regards to extraction and so on, and will pass along the info to SWIM, but do not thionk he wants to go there now...and they aren't gell, so...this is where SWIM is for now.

Also curious about the use of other meds during this process for SWIM, as I know he frequently uses valium and as well still has much codeine, but neither of them are currently in his system.

Thanks in advance for any replies and suggestions.

[Harry]

Anyone, anyone...Bueller?

[trishtrb]

I have been on the Duragesic 50's for over a year and have read & heard all the warnings about heat w/ the patches. I take a very hot bath every morning and lay on a heating pad most of the day. I honestly don't notice anything. Not to say that it won't hurt you, but I don't notice anything. Hope that helps!

[Harry]

Hi trishtrb, and thanks for the response.

Shortly after posting SWIM decided to try and apply direct heat, by simply filling a 2 liter plastic pop bottle with hot tap water, and holding it on the patches on and off for an hour or so, once refilling the bottle for sustained heat. He did notice, it seemed, an increased effect. He wasn't too worried about overstepping his boundaries in the tolerance department as he has been thru many other narcotics (oxys, morphine, etc) at very high levels and has never really been on a serious nod, or had intense euphoria. I am guessing it may be in part due to SWIMs size, 6'4" 235lbs, and that for whatever reason, his system seems to be bullish and very tolerant.

As the 24 hr period passed a while ago, SWIM has not noticed any difference and is now well into the 24-72 hr period. During the night it seemed as though one consequence/reaction would be zero sleep, so he decided to take a meager 10 mgs of valium to help induce sleep. This worked within the hour and several hours of needed sleep occured...making the day easier to manage.

I believe I misquoted earlier by saying the patches were 50 mg, as they are not....they are 8.25 mg fentanyl, w/an hourly release rate of 50 mcg.

As of now SWIM is wondering if the heat applied earlier may have started the maximizing dosage period earlier then 24 hrs as by design, and the possible consequences of that 72 hr period being shortened.

The brand name for this particular patch is ratiopharm, and as I understand it, it is smaller then all other patches.

Wondering if anyone else has used this brand, and here is a bit about it I found on the web...

Quote:

Fentanyl patch developed by Labtec GmbH first generic to be approved for marketing in Canada

Release issued 29 Sep 2006

"Labtec´s licensee ratiopharm started marketing in Canada a transdermal patch containing fentanyl for treatment of strong chronic pain, which is generic to J&J´s blockbuster Durogesic®. The patch is 1/3 smaller than the originator´s product and is the first generic fentanyl patch to be approved for marketing in Canada.

Last month ratiopharm Canada launched "ratio-FENTANYL Matrix System", a product generic to Johnson&Johnson´s Durogesic®, which in 2004 generated global revenues of over 2 billion US$. The product is the first generic fentanyl patch to be approved in Canada and was developed by Germany- based Labtec GmbH who licensed it to ratiopharm for Europe and Canada. Besides Canada, the product is already approved in Germany, Austria and The Netherlands. ratiopharm is expecting approval for all other countries of their territory within the next months. Outside Europe and Canada, Labtec has licensed the product for USA, Australia, Israel and Turkey to leading national companies.

The patch uses Labtec´s innovative matrix technology making it the smallest fentanyl patch on the market. Because of its small size the product is more convenient for patients who suffer from strong chronic pain and have to wear the patch for 3 days before replacing it with a new one."

Thanks again trishtbr for your reply.

[trishtrb]

No problem Harry. Good luck to your friend.... yes, the no sleep thing is a major problem. I have that every time I apply a new patch. For me, that is every other day. I lie in bed thinking I'm going to be half dead the next day due to lack of sleep, however I feel fine the next day. I have to take xanax and restoril to get to sleep. Not fun. You must warn "your friend", withdrawl from Fentanyl is horrible! I was on it (the generic version) for 2 months, it irritated my skin so I stopped. I ended up up in the ER. I thought I was dying. After years and years of various narcotics, I had never experienced anything of the sort. I finally got the "brand name" free from Jannsen (the manfacturer) and haven't had the skin problem. If I ever quit using the patch, I will have to get something from my Dr. to help. I don't wish the withdrawls on anyone. I've not heard of the brand you mentioned. Good luck! (To your friend)

[kylan]

Originally Posted by Harry

Hi trishtrb, and thanks for the response.

Shortly after posting SWIM decided to try and apply direct heat, by simply filling a 2 liter plastic pop bottle with hot tap water, and holding it on the patches on and off for an hour or so, once refilling the bottle for sustained heat. He did notice, it seemed, an increased effect. He wasn't too worried about overstepping his boundaries in the tolerance department as he has been thru many other narcotics (oxys, morphine, etc) at very high levels and has never really been on a serious nod, or had intense euphoria. I am guessing it may be in part due to SWIMs size, 6'4" 235lbs, and that for whatever reason, his system seems to be bullish and very tolerant.

As the 24 hr period passed a while ago, SWIM has not noticed any difference and is now well into the 24-72 hr period. During the night it seemed as though one consequence/reaction would be zero sleep, so he decided to take a meager 10 mgs of valium to help induce sleep. This worked within the hour and several hours of needed sleep occured...making the day easier to manage.

I believe I misquoted earlier by saying the patches were 50 mg, as they are not....they are 8.25 mg fentanyl, w/an hourly release rate of 50 mcg.

As of now SWIM is wondering if the heat applied earlier may have started the maximizing dosage period earlier then 24 hrs as by design, and the possible consequences of that 72 hr period being shortened.

The brand name for this particular patch is ratiopharm, and as I understand it, it is smaller then all other patches.

Wondering if anyone else has used this brand, and here is a bit about it I found on the web...

Quote:

Fentanyl patch developed by Labtec GmbH first generic to be approved for marketing in Canada

Release issued 29 Sep 2006

"Labtec´s licensee ratiopharm started marketing in Canada a transdermal patch containing fentanyl for treatment of strong chronic pain, which is generic to J&J´s blockbuster Durogesic®. The patch is 1/3 smaller than the originator´s product and is the first generic fentanyl patch to be approved for marketing in Canada.

Last month ratiopharm Canada launched "ratio-FENTANYL Matrix System", a product generic to Johnson&Johnson´s Durogesic®, which in 2004 generated global revenues of over 2 billion US$. The product is the first generic fentanyl patch to be approved in Canada and was developed by Germany- based Labtec GmbH who licensed it to ratiopharm for Europe and Canada. Besides Canada, the product is already approved in Germany, Austria and The Netherlands. ratiopharm is expecting approval for all other countries of their territory within the next months. Outside Europe and Canada, Labtec has licensed the product for USA, Australia, Israel and Turkey to leading national companies.

The patch uses Labtec´s innovative matrix technology making it the smallest fentanyl patch on the market. Because of its small size the product is more convenient for patients who suffer from strong chronic pain and have to wear the patch for 3 days before replacing it with a new one."

Thanks again trishtbr for your reply.

hi i use the ratio-pharm and love it, but SWIM doesnt wear them but just cuts pieces off as needed and puts between upper lip and gum and lets it sit for a few hours. this works very well but very strong so only a small piece is needed

[Harry]

Mixing things up:

SWIM is currently 2 50 mcg fent. patches 24 hrs ago, heating padded earlier today, then one removed to put under tongue just a few ago. Add 20 mgs valium and 5 or 6 beers...dangerous?

No nodding, but heading towards comfortably numb. The Fents haven't been regular, last use was a week ago, but as specified earlier in thread...SWIM has a history of high tolerance.

Thoughts?

[Harry]

So here it is, 15 or so days later. SWIM sits after not doing fentanyl for some time with 2 newly applied 100/pr hr.mcg, 50 mcg patche on, roughly 400 mgs of codeine, 8 beer (more to follow), and 30 mg of valium in the system...wondering.

Wondering how much is too much. Wondering how things will transpire as the soon to be heated water bottle is applied to the patches, several beer, and possible other additives arrive in the system.

There is no reason for it tonight, other then it is another day and the opportunity presented itself. Why? Simple answer, I spose, addiction.

SWIM understands the nature of such things, somewhat. By why not just safelymedicate? Do any of you ask yourself why it is you go this route, to push the limits, as in, in SWIM's case...add another 100 mcg patch or 2, plus w/e...risking potential loss of life? SWIM isn't looking to die.

This is nothing new to SWIM, for most of SWIM's life he has tested boundaries. When 15 yrs old and other kids were doing 1 and 2 hits of acid, SWIM would do 8, or 10 or 12. Not to be better, or to prove a point, to the best of SWIMS recollection...but, just well, because. Because SWIM can, so therefore does.

So I guess the question is why the because. SWIM has no repressed trauma, to the best of SWIMs knowledge. Most all of SWIMs drug use is hidden, from family, friends, and other then a few instances though the years which were once likely deemed a 'phase'...not many really know, how much and often SWIM medicates. Most of SWIM'S 'medicates' would likely kill the average human.

I guess this should be in addictions now, the turn this thread has taken, but I suppose SWIM wanted it here, wondering if others maybe are or have been in the same place.

Anyway, that's about it...and no, the fent's aren't duralgestic, or SWIM'd be smoking them as he types...

So why SWIM's, why do you do this to yourself?

[Harry]

SWIM apologizes for the long ramble. It seems to have occured by atleast one person's account, briefly before some kinda add another 100mcg fentanyl imgettingtheitchnowbygeebus!andihopeitcarriesovert otommorrow, kinda thingy.