wild lettuce tea

[baron samedi]

Can any SWIY's out there give SWIM any advice regarding effective preparation of a wild lettuce tea?
Most recipes on here or erowid seem to focus on alcohol-based extraction for smoking purposes, but SWIM isn't interested in this, rather how to make a tea from standard leaf.
As far as dosage goes he has read on this forum that 10 grams is enough to use, given the toxicity issue. He wonders if this will work sufficiently as he is used to taking 45g doses of kratom leaf.

[Thirdedge]

While 10 grams would be a good starting dosage Swim found 25 gram to produce good effect, but deffinetly start lower to test your reaction. Also, this is nothing like kratom. 45 grams of Kratom sounds excessive, does swiy do this regularly with diffrent kratom from diffrent sources? Keep in mind some vendors may have given their kratom a 'quick dip' in iso or etho before offering it for sale.

[baron samedi]

Yes, SWIM knows its excessive but is on medication which dilutes/decreases the effects of many drugs. He used to do 30g but found 45g to be closer to his level. He should state that this is no more than fortnightly most of the time if not longer.
Regarding lettuce opium can SWIY describe how it differs to kratom. SWIM used the comparison as they're both touted as being opium substitutes.
If SWIY would share his method of tea-making with SWIM, it would be very much appreciated.

[snapper]

Wild lettuce plant material contains anticholingeric deleriants, while the sap only contains non-alkaloidal components, which are the active ones. There is another thread on the subject :
http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/sho...=lactuca+opium

[Thirdedge]

Originally Posted by snapper

Wild lettuce plant material contains anticholingeric deleriants, while the sap only contains non-alkaloidal components, which are the active ones. There is another thread on the subject :
http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/sho...=lactuca+opium

I believe this was a mistake posted in the original edition of the Merck Index which has since been proven wrong. I can find no modern evidence of wild lettuce containing tropane alkaloids.

See here also: http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/sho...t=wild+lettuce

Originally Posted by baron samedi

Regarding lettuce opium can SWIY describe how it differs to kratom. SWIM used the comparison as they're both touted as being opium substitutes.
If SWIY would share his method of tea-making with SWIM, it would be very much appreciated.

Well everyones diffrent but Swim has noticed Wild Lettuce produces a mild relaxed dreamy state suited to relaxing on the couch before sleep at the end of the day. A sit back and chill sensation.

Kratom however is more suited to during the day, while it does give a codiene like body stone the mind is stimulated and awake, motivated to get on top of mundane chores in need of doing. Sleeping on kratom is difficult. Kratom also produces a strong euphoria that is not present in wild lettuce.

In Swims opinion wild lettuce is a mild / lightweight drug, whereas Kratom produces a far more pronounced effect.

Re: Wild Lettuce tea making method, Swim simply adds to boiling water in a pot and simmer for 15mins giving a bit of a stir here and there. Strain and drink with honey.

[snapper]

SWIM prefers to vaporize the resin and finds the effect more profound but shorter lived.
SWINagognog2 originally brought the tropane thing to SWIM's attention. SWINagognog2 may have a more recent reference. However, it would be good to know either way. At lower doses, anticholinergic effects would be complementary to the 'narcotic' principles in this plant, but in higher doses could throw a SWIM for a loop. Also, given the ubiquity of this plant, there is likely much individual variation which could mean higher tropane content strains. It would be worth confirming or refuting this claim for certain.
One way to determine if the tropanes are there is to extract the alkaloid (nitrogen containing fraction) and have it analyzed (or take it and see if cottonmouth, urinary retention, sedation, dilated pupils and delerium ensue - sort of a cheap alternative to column purification and spectral analysis....). Just because the parent reference in the Merck is lost, does not mean the data is erroneous.
SWINagognog2? Any new info ?

[baron samedi]

Hmmm, it seems the jury's still out on the tropane alkaloid issue. SWIM knows that the plant is toxic and can cause death in high doses, but is dubious about the tropane thing. Wild Lettuce has been sold since the sixties as a legal high and it is one of the commonest ingrediants in "smoking mixtures". You don't see datura or belladona sold as "legal smokes" because even this can cause delirium or death. Lettuce might be alot weaker i suppose, but would the manufacturers take the risk of promoting a tropane containing plant as a "smoking blend". Just SWIM's 2 cents.
Thanks for the tea info thirdeye, SWIM's not expecting a kratom buzz but, fingers crossed, not a tropane one either!

[baron samedi]

just another query about the tea. Is there any reason why the concoction shouldn't be refrigerated for a day or so before use, as with other herbal teas?

[Nagognog2]

All I know is what is from the Merck Index regards what was found in Lactucarium - Lettuce Opium. Someone identified hyoscine and other tropines. How they did is not known to me. I'd be cautious unless I had definitive proof to the otherwise.

On the other hand, the Merck also references finding bufotenine and atropine in the Amanita Muscaria. So.....run your own tests.

[Thirdedge]

Originally Posted by Nagognog2

All I know is what is from the Merck Index regards what was found in Lactucarium - Lettuce Opium. Someone identified hyoscine and other tropines.

Makes me wonder if one of the 'Legal Highs' manufacturers from back in the day decided to crank up the kick of his 'Herbal Opium' product by adding a bit of Datura extract.

Datura has sometimes been used as an adulterant of real Opium and Hash in India. I read somewhere that Tropanes potentiate Cannabis and Opium, although not something Swim has been tempted to try.

[snapper]

They sure do - SWIM thinks that some of the afghani strains SWIM had sampled were prone to induce cotton mouth from hell along with powerful sedation.
There are no easy field reagent tests for tropanes, are there ?

[baron samedi]

just to report back, SWIM survived his 25g wild lettuce tea without any noticable side effects. if it does contain tropane alkaloids i'd guess its in very small quantities. wouldn't fancy a 25g datura tea thankyou very much!
SWIM found it to have a mild sedative/hypnotic effect, could have been quite enjoyable but he only had a few hours sleep the night before so was too tired to be able to appreciate the effect.

[jbmac]

Wild lettuce is 10 times as strong as bananna peels. SWIM tried about 10 grams in a tea, got the same effect as 1/2 a beer.

[snapper]

Hello JBmac - nice to see SWIY has joined this forum.
Have you tried to vaporize the sap. That's the way SWIM finds it to be most effective.

[Alfa]

I received this information:

There are actually two species of interest here, Lactuca virosa and Lactuca serriola, the latter known as Prickly Lettuce. That species is native to the Middle East and Mediterranean areas, but has become acclimated to the warmer regions of the U.S. and is far more common than virosa, in fact it is quite abundant in many areas. It is also of botanic interest in that it is believed by most botanists to be the wild ancestor of domesticated lettuce. Considering how bitter the raw leaves are, it was probably first grown as a medicinal plant then only later as a food plant after its medicinal properties attenuated under the influence of domestication. The very prickly tough kind that grows in the desert Southwest is, IMHO fully as potent as European virosa. The claim that tropane alkaloids are present in either species is highly unsubstantiated and in my experience, unlikely to be true. I suspect the true active ingredients are probably the lactopicrin

IF you have access to the fresh or dried plant (either species) the best way to partake of it is as a cold drink in a blender extract. Put a good-sized handful of it in a blender with water, ice, sweetener and fresh (preferably) or dried mint. Whirl it on HI for several minutes then strain it into a tall glass and enjoy. It should not be made so strong it tastes unpleasantly bitter. Well made, it is a foamy dark jade-green beverage with a rich subtle taste (think Guiness and dark chocolate) and just loaded with anti-oxidants, vitamins and trace minerals. It will relax you in a wonderful way, you can feel every cell in your body going AAAAAAAH!!! It is especially effective in relieving heat stress during the height of summer. Don´t drink it BEFORE you are exposed to the heat, you´ll just get dizzy and nauseated. Drink it AFTER you get in out of the sun and have a chance to relax. You can also juice it and place it in a shallow pan before a fan and concentrate the juce until it´s pretty thick. (A lit
This can be mixed with Creme de Mint to form a great syrup for soothing purposes; best stored in the fridge, great for tension headaches or so I have been told. Finally you can evaporate the juice until it is a firm paste, form this into lumps and let it dry into Lettuce Hash, Gentle and dreamy, it makes a tasty and relaxing smoke that has a fine rich flavor. It is pleasant and soothing all by itself, but it will also cut the anxiety and sensation of heat that the Real Thing causes in some people. Nice! This is a seriously people-loving plant that likes to grow in populated areas. I think it loves us......

[0utrider]

is this 10g etc recommendation about dried plant material?

[baron samedi]

Thats what SWIM was using when he tried it, and it did work, although the effect is quite subtle.