UK - Psychoactive substances and the law (UK)

[eoin_k]

Hi

I’ve just posted on the welcome thread explaining that I’m doing some research into legal, psychoactive substances, primarily in the UK. I thought I would post up some of my initial thoughts to see if they would stimulate some discussion:

Legal substances, plants and fungi which have psychoactive properties include:
Alcohol, nicotine, caffeine, slavia, khat, nutmeg, fly agaric (and other amanitas mushrooms), guarana, ginkgo biloba, kratom, yerba mate, taurine, colt’s foot, valerian, chamomile.

There is a grey area around plants such as cacti containing mescaline (Peyote, San Pedro…) and seeds containing LSA (Morning Glory…) and plants containing DMT. Unlike coca, opium poppies and cannabis the plant is not controlled while the substance is. I am interested in looking at how possible/practical it is to get legally high on these. For example it appears that it if you process Morning Glory seeds to reduce the effect of unpleasant toxins you are likely to be committing an offence by as your are extracting LSA, which is a class A drug.

Useful web resources which I’ve founded so far include:
http://www.erowid.org
[xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://www.release.org.uk/
as well as this place which is a right old goldmine!

The most useless website I've checked so far is:
http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/drugs/



Any feedback or suggestions would be really appreciated.

Cheers

Eoin

[Micklemouse]

Where did SWiY get the information that cannabis plants are not controlled? A Certain Mouse & many others would be interested to see this loophole/interpretation of the law, as to the best of his knowledge, unlicensed cultivation, even in the wild, is punishable by law, & harvesting plants found in the wild would immediately put one in possession. Some countries do allow a certain amount of plants to be grown, but the U.K. is not one of them.

[eoin_k]

Originally Posted by Micklemouse

Where did SWiY get the information that cannabis plants are not controlled? A Certain Mouse & many others would be interested to see this loophole/interpretation of the law, as to the best of his knowledge, unlicensed cultivation, even in the wild, is punishable by law, & harvesting plants found in the wild would immediately put one in possession. Some countries do allow a certain amount of plants to be grown, but the U.K. is not one of them.

Sorry mate, I think you've missread me. I'm saying that unlike cannabis, morning glory, peyote etc. are not controlled.

[Micklemouse]

Originally Posted by eoin_k

Sorry mate, I think you've missread me. I'm saying that unlike cannabis, morning glory, peyote etc. are not controlled.

Yer right! My apologies!

[robertone]

Uploaded the English text (pdf) of "REGULATION (EC) No 273/2004 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL of 11 February 2004" in the Law section of the forums File Archive.

[eoin_k]

Originally Posted by robertone

Uploaded the English text (pdf) of "REGULATION (EC) No 273/2004 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL of 11 February 2004" in the Law section of the forums File Archive.

Cheers - I hadn't noticed that section of the boards before. There's loads of useful info there.

[Alfa]

Coca is even a trickier situation:
Cocaine is controlled.
Coca leaf is controlled.
Coca plant is legal, although a coca plant has coca leafs.
Coca seeds are legal.

Same with poppies:
Several opiates like heroin, morphine, etc are controlled.
Poppy resin is illegal.
Poppy plants are legal.
Poppy seeds are legal, although the pods contain controlled opiates.

Cannabis:
THC is controlled.
Cannabis plants are controlled. I do not know how the UK handles hemp.
Cannabis seeds are legal. Cannabis seed pods are illegal.

You can see that this is all hazardous grounds for discussion and open to interpretation.

Since when is LSA a class A drug? I was under the assumption that LSA is a watched chemical, but not controlled. Am I wrong?

As far as preparating plants which contain controlled substances: this is indeed grey area for this has not been fully tested in court yet. The UN which has made the laws we are talking about, says that since the plants are legal, you can prepare them all you want without breaking the law. Only if you separate the active substance from the plant, the activity becomes illegal according to the UN. But many prosecutors, if not any, will try to hang SWIY on the highest tree for preparing plants which contain controlled substances. So this will have to be fought out in court and those who frequent this board know that this will happen soon. It will probably not be over soon.

[eoin_k]

Could well be my mistake WRT LSA.

[robertone]

Originally Posted by Alfa

Since when is LSA a class A drug? I was under the assumption that LSA is a watched chemical, but not controlled. Am I wrong?

Well... LSA is in, at least, Europe, by the "REGULATION (EC) No 273/2004 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL of 11 February 2004" an category 1 controlled chemical. By this ruling it's a crime to have LSA without the proper lisence for Cat 1 chemicals, which is in the Netherlands punisable with 6 years imprisonment. This causes a bit unlogic situation because the possession of LSD in the Netherlands is 'only' punisable, provided it's only possession and not dealing or production or so, with 4 years imprisonment.

Because the EC Regulation also rules natural products containing controlled chemicals,

Article 2, Definitions
(a) ‘scheduled substance’ means any substance listed in Annex I, including mixtures and natural products containing such substances. This excludes medicinal products as defined by Directive 2001/83/EC of the European Parliament and of the Council of 6 November 2001 on the Community code relating to medicinal products for human use (¹), pharmaceutical preparations, mixtures, natural products and other preparations containing scheduled substances that are compounded in such a way that they cannot be easily used or extracted by readily applicable or economically viable means

Swim wonders how they will deal with the Cat 1 ruling of safrole. It occurs that legio natural oils contains safrole.

[ramjet]

It is fairly easy to find shops and stalls that sell these substances and other "smart drugs" containing BZP and ephedrine (apparently PEP pills have now been banned) in most large towns and cities in the UK.

SWIM has found that the practicalities of getting high on these substances can be tricky. The Peruvian Torch cactus (mesc containing) can be a ball ache to prepare. The shop near me that sells it recommends boiling the dried cactus powder for 20 mins and simmering for 2-3 hours, whereby the solids are drained off and the foul tasting liquid consumed. SWIM (can I talk in the first person if I bought the substance legally?) tried 20g with little to no effect.

SWIM has tried a fly agaric extract and obtained some mild effects that never went beyond a 1+ on the Shulgin scale. At first the shop ass. would not tell SWIM how to consume and the bottle itself stated that the extract was for botanical research purposes only. He did say, however, "it looks a bit like bisto doesn't it?" a couple of times, winking at SWIM in the process. As such SWIM assumed that he meant that the extract needed to be dissolved in water and drunk. Now they have no problems in telling customers this straight out.

SWIM has tried Hawaiian Baby Woodrose seeds. These were also a pain to prepare. The skins of 8 seeds were removed, and the seeds were crushed and placed into a pint glass containing water. This was left for 24 hours. The liquid was then consumed. SWIM did not feel many psychedelic effects, but got bad nausea, heart burn and stomach cramps.

SWIM has tried salvia too and has just written an extremely lengthy trip report which he has some how managed to delete! Will return to this later ...

[Paracelsus]

Originally Posted by robertone

Well... LSA is in, at least, Europe, by the "REGULATION (EC) No 273/2004 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL of 11 February 2004" an category 1 controlled chemical. By this ruling it's a crime to have LSA without the proper lisence for Cat 1 chemicals, which is in the Netherlands punisable with 6 years imprisonment. This causes a bit unlogic situation because the possession of LSD in the Netherlands is 'only' punisable, provided it's only possession and not dealing or production or so, with 4 years imprisonment.

That law isn't going to work. LSA can be extracted relatively easy from Morning Glory seeds, which can in no way be controlled. And if this law would be applied, anyone buying sassafras root, sassafras oil or even root beer would be punished. Well, probably not the root beer, safrole can't be extracted from that "by readily applicable or economically viable means".

Originally Posted by eoin k

khat

If somebody wants to get high from that, it has to be fresh leaf though(homegrown), because cathinone (the sought substance) decomposes into cathine (norpseudoephedrine, phenylpropanolamine) by enzymatic reduction upon drying the leaves.

If you mentioned valerian, kava kava is also a must.

And if you mentioned yerba and guarana, why not throw in chocolate? kidding

We need to write a new version of "Legal Highs" someday. The last one (the original by Adam Gottlieb) is old and completely out of date (1973). Then we will have what to offer to questions like this: "hey does anyone know an easy cheap way to get high legally? i've heard about banana peel but i'm not sure"

[Alfa]

Holy shit! Many thanks Robertone. I was not aware the EU has drug laws as well. So now, we do not only have national drug laws, UN drug laws, but also EU drug laws. This affects all drug information sections. I have never seen information about EU drug law on this site.
See here for more information:
Narcotic drugs and psychotropic substances: external aspects
Drug precursors: internal aspects

[Alfa]

I just read that coca plants ARE illegal. See the UN convention on psychotropic substances of 1961. Please note.

[MrMouse]

AMT and Methylone are legal ... lovely!

[Alicia]

Originally Posted by Alfa

Coca is even a trickier situation:
Cocaine is controlled.
Coca leaf is controlled.
Coca plant is legal, although a coca plant has coca leafs.
Coca seeds are legal.

Does the same then apply to coca tea bags?

Originally Posted by MrMouse

Methylone are legal ... lovely!

Methylone is legal thought that was controlled in the uk anyway. last time it was she checked her refs. please do tell swia different thou..

[Jatelka]

^^^ AMT (as a tryptamine) is surely covered by the "catch all" clause of the Misuse of Drugs Act?

[drug-bot]

Originally Posted by Jatelka

^^^ AMT (as a tryptamine) is surely covered by the "catch all" clause of the Misuse of Drugs Act?

it appears legal in the uk according to erowid, unless recent change in law(find uk bit near bottom of the qoute)

AMT (IT-290)
Legal Status
by Erowid

U.S. FEDERAL LAW #
Caution : All legal information should be verified through other sources. [see below]
U.S. FEDERAL LEGAL SUMMARY
AMT
REGULATED
Yes
STATUS
Scheduled
SCHEDULE
Schedule I
CLASSIFICATION
Hallucinogen
SCH. DATE
Apr 4, 2003
AMT is Schedule I in the United States. This means it is illegal to manufacture, buy, possess, or distribute (sell, trade or give) without a DEA license.

On Jan 28th, 2003, the DEA announced its intent to emergency schedule AMT. On April 4, 2003, they issued their final order to temporarily place AMT in Schedule I. The temporary scheduling lasted 18 months and on Sep 29, 2004, AMT was placed formally into Schedule I. See the DEA's Federal Register entries for notice of intent to schedule (FR, Vol. 68, No. 18. Jan 28, 2003), their final order to emergency schedule (FR, Vol. 68, No. 65 Apr 4, 2003), and their final placement into Schedule I for more details.



U.S. STATE LAW #
Illinois #
AMT is listed as a schedule I substance in Illinois.

INTERNATIONAL LAW #
Australia #
AMT has reportedly on schedule 8 (very controlled) of the Australian Customs import list since 2001. (unconfirmed)
Germany #
AMT is listed in Teil B with LSD, Cannabis, MDMA, and other psychedelics. BtMG 1981 Anlage I (zu § 1 Abs. 1), Fassung: 24. September 1999, Gültig ab 10. Oktober 1999 bis 9. Oktober 2000
Greece #
AMT became a controlled substance in Greece on Feb 18, 2003 [EU Legal Database].
Japan #
5-MeO-DIPT and AMT were controlled (made illegal) on April 17, 2005. We do not have a clear URL for a japanese law page, but see this page and also an arrest was made soon after the law came into effect: Man arrested on drug charges. DJ49 reports that these products have indeed disappeared off vendors shelves as of late April, 2005.
Sweden #
AMT was controlled as of March 1, 2005. See Statens Folkhaelsoinstitut. (thanks P)
U.K. #
AMT is not listed as controlled in Britain and does not fall under the substituted tryptamine rule because its 'substitution' is not on the nitrogen. See the 2001 Misuse of Drugs Act : Schedule 1, regulation 3 (as of Mar 2004)

http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/amt/amt_law.shtml
(the bold highlight of the uk is my doing)

[salviablue]

What would be the legal stance on the mycelium of psilocin/psilocybin mushrooms, i.e. the unfruited "root work". One would imagine that since the law states "fungi containing psilocin" then that includes the mycelium too?
Any ideas?

[darkglobe]

Alfa, you said this....

Cannabis:
THC is controlled.
Cannabis plants are controlled. I do not know how the UK handles hemp.
Cannabis seeds are legal. Cannabis seed pods are illegal.

I thought I'd respond. AFAIK, the UK tends not to bother with hemp production anyway. I recently visited The Eden Project (I imagine yuo know of this) and they had a small patch of Cannabis on the grow. Crux of the matter was, it was THC-free Cannabis. I.e. it was a breed of cannabis plant bred for hemp only.

Judging by the leaves it was originally some poor Sativa strain.... may it rest in peace lol!

Have a butcher's at this, I found it an immensely interesting read: http://mojo.calyx.net/~olsen/HEMP/IHA/iha01107.html

Hope it helps.

~Dark

[salviablue]

A few years ago the UK government banned the sale of Kava-kava in any form that is intended by any implication for internal use. This apparently makes it illegal to import, export, trade, sell or buy kava in any kind of preparation for internal use, or if internal use is implied in the transaction in any way. Any transaction of kava must come with the disclaimer "Not for internal use" and internal use must not be implied. It is OK to mention its quality/purity as apparently regulations governing what can be used in soap manufacture (as is one of kava`s other uses) must carry a garuantee of quality/purity.
Tinctures and extracts are ok to trade as they can be for soap manufacture. (providing internal use is not implied)
Powders are ok as they can be used for both soap and insence manufacture. (providing internal use is not implied)
Drinks, "tea bags" and "instant" drink powders containing kava are not ok, even if the disclaimer is included, as these have internal use implied.

I am not sure and wonder as to the legality of maybe topical applications and whether smoking preparations are classed as internal use (probably are).

[KomodoMK]

My little fishy knows of a source that still ships piperazines, methylone, and other similar chemicals to the UK. Even though the MODA says that piperazines are a prescription only medicine and thus a license is required for manufacture otherwise it is illegal to manufacture or supply, a loophole exists that it can be sold as a soil fertilizer or for other botanical use. I think methylone, methylmethcathinone, butylone can also be sold under this pretence, at least if it is shipped from Europe to the UK.

Jatelka: I believe the structure of AMT exempts it from the 'catch all' clause for tryptamines.

A question though: Would it be worth the police trying to prosecute an end user (with no prior) for purchasing 1 or 2 grams of a research chemical? Personally, I don't think they would waste their time.