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Amphetamines addiction Support for coping with Amphetamine-, Meth- and Ecstasy- addiction and Amphetamine addiction treatment.

 
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  #1  
Old 20-01-2007, 23:18
renegades renegades is offline
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Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for methamphetamine addicts

I had posted this in an obscure section of this bbs and thought this would be a better place for the original post:

So you want to get off of meth? It is so easy and painless. First swim needs a doctor who will prescribed swim these medicines or else order from india. What swim needs is a renegades' chemical cocktail made up of:
50 mg atarax
400 mg gabantin
200mg modifinal
10mg valium
60mg Cymbalta in the morning

Then just repeat the atarax and gabantin in early afternoon and again in the evening.

At night take:
30mg Remeron 45 minutes before bed time, it's not addictive and will help swim sleep.

Repeat everyday for 30 days. It worked for swim, swim have no cravings what so ever for the drug after 8 years of use. It just happens, overnite, swim can't explain it , but swim had no cravings. If swim has no cravings swims control over the drug is increased substantially. Swim can be in a room where people are using but according to swim "say its the past and will remain the past, there are better highs that are not addictive." DOx comes to mind and the 2Cs are a blast. Meth is not fun and if this helps out other addicts swim would love to see those postings of success stories of beating this addiction.

Swim heard this also works on heavy cocaine users too. Their cravings disappear also. It is supposedly some secret that a detox center is using charging patients 15,000 dollars for the treatment whereas you could easily administer the program yourself for the cost of the medication. Their cocktail is different requiring IV stuff, but renegades' cure requires no IV treatments. It is just smoke and mirrors. Might help going to a NA meeting too but not necessary. Swim takes credit for Renegades Chemical Cocktail, the really first cure for cravings in addicts.

Post Quality Evaluations:
Great thread, lots of info.
Thank you for sharing your experience but please edit the post to use generic names instead of brand names eg gabapentin instead of gabantin
Thank you for all the detailed info/experiences you've posted in this thread.
I cannot tell you how grateful I am for this info
i AM grateful for this shared information, I must look further into it, a scourge of an addiction .

Last edited by ~lostgurl~; 29-06-2008 at 12:00. Reason: making post easier to read
  #2  
Old 20-01-2007, 23:56
Forthesevenlakes Forthesevenlakes is offline
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

Interesting idea. Anyone more well versed in these types of drugs know about the safety/efficacy of combining them? And has swiRenegade gotten any data from other lab rats and lab squirrels who may have used this with success? Any side effects from the drugs that people should know about? SWIM is very curious to know more about this.

Also its interesting that modafinil would be part of this cocktail. SWIM knows that modafinil is supposed to keep someone awake without the typical dopamine reward circuit activation found in other stimulants, but SWIM is wondering if there would be any sort of nervousness/agitation from using this drug while one is already anxious from the meth withdrawals.
  #3  
Old 21-01-2007, 00:08
renegades renegades is offline
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

No the 10 mg of valium takes care of the anixety caused by the addiction or the modafinil effects.
The modafinil is important because swim can't lay in bed all day, it energizes you to get up and get something accomplished.

Swim had a daily meth problem dating back eight years, been through treatment, NA meetings nothing seemed to work until swim came up with renegades chemical cocktail.

The cymbalta is to uptake seritonin that meth use to do for swim.
The gabatin someway stops the craving
The anatrax is to rid your body of this addictive chemicals.

Swim is going to test it out on brother in law a 13 year addict - daily use.

Last edited by ~lostgurl~; 29-06-2008 at 12:03. Reason: easier to read
  #4  
Old 21-01-2007, 00:23
Forthesevenlakes Forthesevenlakes is offline
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

Excellent, thanks for the clarification! SWIM figured it was to help people get out of bed since meth withdrawal can make one want to sleep all day, but he wasn't sure if there would be any anxiety added to that as well.

SWIM has noticed something similar with gabapentin stopping various cravings, SWIM has heard a couple of anecdotal reports from people saying that it can help a little with some of the withdrawal pains from opiates as well.
  #5  
Old 21-01-2007, 02:54
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

Oh, buy a case of Rockstar at your local Costco. It will run you $30 for 36 of them. A great buy for a recovering meth addict. 150 mg caffeine and 8? tablespoons of sugar all in a 16 oz can. It helps get the engine reved up in the morning, much more effective than coffee or tea and you mix that modifinil and swim knows that this makes the morining go by a bit nicer. JUst don't forget to brush your teeth after drinking one of those 8 times more corresive on enamel than coke or pepsi.
  #6  
Old 01-02-2007, 05:36
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Meth is not physically addictive. If you say, replacing one drug, with another helped your cravings, i am not suprised. All research points to one very very specific part of the brain the plays the reward role, esp drugs. I don't know why its so addictive. It just is.

And you are dead on about not brushing your teeth after consuming soda or sugery drinks for about an hour. It will corrode your teeth even moreso than doing nothing. With your saliva out of the way, you are more brushing coke, than saliva. Your salive dose all sorts of amazing things, like heal teeth, protect teeth, and, more recently, plays a role in the reduction of pain.

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good point

Last edited by Forthesevenlakes; 01-02-2007 at 08:27. Reason: consolidation
  #7  
Old 02-02-2007, 03:58
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

Ah, true swim is using drugs to combat a drug addiction, but the substituted drugs does not get swim high or use endorphins, you’re basically straight when and after using the compounds mentioned in the above post. For example, they give alcoholics and opiate users Naltrexone to minimize the cravings for their drug; these swims do not get high off Naltrexone. Thus swim is replacing a bad drug for good drugs one that does not get this swim high. Thus you can't compare apples to oranges - they are both fruit but there exists a big difference. Meth is physically addictive, this swim knows it first hand. Why? Keep reading.

Methamphetamines cause a large increase in the amount of dopamine secreted and pooling between brain cells, leading to feelings of euphoria. With regular, repeated meth use, though, the brain eventually responds by reducing its normal release of dopamine. Studies also show a simultaneous decrease in the number of dopamine receptors created. Thus when a swim quits, she lacks dopamine because her brain has stop producing it. That, in turn, makes the brain's reward system less likely to respond to behaviors that produce a normal dopamine surge, thus the depression. It takes the brain at least 6 months to begin producing dopamine again on its own. During these 6 months the meth addict goes into deep depression and thus the reason for a possible relapse.

Meth users have a chemical imbalance due to the meth use and only drugs can correct this imbalance. Time will too, but the medications work a lot faster. It is also important for Swim to attend NA meetings to make new friends who don’t use.

Regarding the chemicals, they are unsure how Modafinil works but it does provide swim with energy but no euphoria. Plus the increase in energy pales in comparison to meth but it is strong enough so swim can get out of bed after washing it down with a 16 oz Rockstar (no Red Bull it costs more, in only 9 oz can, taste like cough syrup). Modafinil is a class IV drug but is not that physically addictive. This swim has used it on and off for a few years without withdrawal symptoms.

Valium is used to take the edge off the withdrawal from a daily addiction. It will relax swim but does not affect her endorphins, in other words 10 mg Valium will not get you high, the relax state is almost subliminal.

Gabapentin appears to reduce anxiety and cravings by enhancing the brain's GABA receptors. Remember, repeated meth use decreases the number of dopamine receptors. Gabapentin repairs the damage by increasing the number of dopamine receptors.

Atarax increases the effects of the drugs (Gabapentin) that depress the activity of the central nervous system and relieves the symptoms of common anxiety and tension.

Cymbalta medication works by restoring the balance of two kinds of natural substances such as neurotransmitters known as serotonin and norepinephrine in the brain, thereby improving mood and feelings of well-being. Remember, the Gabapentin increased the number of receptors, but the brain is not producing serotonin, thereby a swim needs to supplement these two chemicals by using Cymbalta until the brain starts producing these chemicals on its own, which is about six months.

Antidepressant drugs, such as mirtazapine (Remeron) help alleviate insomnia and improve sleep architecture. In patients experiencing post meth-depression, mirtazapine reduces sleep-onset time, increases total sleep time, and leads to improvement in sleep efficiency. Meth abstinence and withdrawl usually results with problems getting deep sleep.

Swim believes she has covered all the ingredients for the Renegades Chemical Cocktail. It works!!! However, the swim needs to be motivated to stop, clean the residence of all meth, and she needs to go to NA to make new non-using friends who can act as a support group.

Chemicals won’t work alone, it takes will-power, some days will be better than others, just take it one day at a time and believe in yourself that you don’t need to use. The night before going on the program, write 50 reasons why swim doesn't want to use meth anymore. Keep that with swim at all times. On that first night before bed, take the Gabapetin, Atarax, and the Remeron. It might help to wash it down with a adult beverage. When swim wakes up take Gabapetin, Atarax, Valium, Modifinal, Cymbalta immediatley wash down with Rockstar.

Cravings only last 5-10 minutes, the renegade’s chemical cocktail will minimize or eliminate those cravings, so if swim is addicted to Meth and wants to get off the drug, try it, what does swim have to lose but a nasty habit. It won't be a 24 hour struggle, but at certain times swim will need to be strong and read her list of 50 reasons, "the got to use" feeling will pass much quicker than before or in this swims case no cravings thus equaled no desire to use. This swim had only a two mini-desires over a month. it was manageable, weak and did not last long.

Good Luck

Last edited by renegades; 02-02-2007 at 07:24. Reason: added night before
  #8  
Old 02-02-2007, 06:25
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

Thanks for that, could really do with some useful info as decided to stop a while ago and planning on starting early next week, after using pretty much daily for 14 moths. Will have to try India though, hope it arrives in time
  #9  
Old 02-02-2007, 07:40
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

Yes, that is what this swim did. India takes 3-4 weeks, which when swim wanted to quit it was painfully slow. Wait until swim has received all medications. Do not try if missing one or two of the prescriptions, it won't work. In addition, have enough stock on hand. You will go through 90 Gabapentin and 180 Atarax the first month and with a delivery schedule 3-4 weeks, swim probably, needs to test it for a few days then reorder or swim will run out and the cravings will come back. Plus Gabapentin effects have been reported to decrease over repeated use. Every time swim stops, users and gets back on the program, the cocktail seems just a bit weaker in controlling the cravings. So it is important that swim is motivated and accomplishes this feat in the first try. If you slip up, get back on the program as soon as possible because Meth is usually out of your system in 8-10 days and the body begins to repair itself. If you use, it is like being penalized, because the body won't begin to repair itself until all the meth is out of it which is another 8-10 days. Good Luck, it will be easier than you think if you have made that decision to quit. Let us other swims know if it did stop the cravings for you. Swim will find out the first or second day of the treatment.
  #10  
Old 04-02-2007, 13:43
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

Oh dear.... SWIM got rid of her dealers no. and changed her phone. She also suffers from depression and other maybe BPD and is desperately trying to keep it together atm. Anything she can get quicker that may help?

Thanks for the reply, as so far so called professionals just seem to be stressing SWIM out more by making her jump through hoops and not offering to give her anything to help, which is making SWIM feel helpless and hopeless

Last edited by ~lostgurl~; 29-06-2008 at 12:18. Reason: self incrimination
  #11  
Old 04-02-2007, 18:01
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Swim would recommend you go to NA meetings. The people there all have been in your shoes before and can help by giving swim a support system - people who she can call 24 hours a day for advice. Plus they probably can give you leads on open-minded doctors who will prescribe the medication to you, however it is a lot less expensive getting it from India. Copy and print out the post to show the doctor why you need the medication and be honest.

Oh, Some at NA are anti-drugs (all drugs, except cigs), but many are not and are on medication from their doctors. That is what swim would do if she/he was you. Go today, look up Narcotics Anonymous, go to the meeting talk to other addicts and ask them for a doctor who believes in "dual diagnosis." In other words a Doctors who believes that one can treat addiction with other drugs. These recovering addicts will help you find a doctor that will prescribe you the medicine.

Tell swim who is making this world a better place?

The DEA whose laws and policies jail otherwise law abiding citizens. If caught with 5 grams of meth, the swim gets to withdrawl without any medication in a 8x10 locked cell for 5 years. If the DEA pops a dealer, the quantity of the drug decreases thus increasing the price. This results in users committing more burglaries to feed their habit. In otherwords, crime goes up in the community.

Renegades offers a different solution. The addict with the chemical cocktail can withdrawl from the chemical easily and continue her day activites. She stops using immediately when she begins on the cocktail. Thus she stops using and buying and stealing, the quantity of the drug goes up, prices come down, thus there is less crime such as break-ins to feed the other addicts. Imagine if a large majority of meth addicts were able to quit what would happen to the crime rate such as break-ins? It would go way down because the price will drop (law of supply and demand).

Now tell me which plan - the DEA Plan or Renegades Chemical Cocktail is the more humane, compassionate, effective way to handle the meth crises?

A big f*ck you goes out to the DEA for their treatment of addicts as criminals and not individuals with mental disorders and chemical imbalances.

Oh, and a big f*ck you goes out to the politicans making these laws.

Addiction is a medical problem and a disease. You don't throw a patient with depression in jail, why someone with a mental disorder? She probably uses drugs to help her depression. It makes her feel better, works better than prozac. Until these cronies come to realize this, we live in an uncivilized world who lock up their own sons and daughters for years in jail for drug use.

Like the Jews in Germany during WWII, drug users here in the USA are also persecuted with the same enthusiasim. Instead of going to a gas chamber, they are thrown in Jail (concentration camps). Watch COPs and see how much law enforcement enjoys busting people with a $5 rock. They treat it like it is a sport, us vs them. When will the USA become civilized in the way they treat a segment of our population?

Now with the democrats in control of congress, it is going to get worse. They believe in big government and a lot of laws regulating how we live. It was them who wrote the first drug laws, ban marijuana, and started the mandatory sentencing laws.

Last edited by ~lostgurl~; 29-06-2008 at 12:20. Reason: merged - back to back
  #12  
Old 04-02-2007, 20:09
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

That's exactly how i feel. It's took a lot to admit my problems, and am scared how i'll cope without using. Will take your advice and print off your suggestion.

Yey for Renegades Cocktail

Seriously, thanks. I'll print this out and see what happens
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Old 15-02-2007, 09:19
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

SWIM has looked into Renegades Chemical Cocktail but some of the medications are not available where swim lives. Swim has some questions though, most of the meds you have mentioned work primarily on seratonin, whereas meth works predominantly on dopamine, so how do these meds counter the effects of meth abuse? Also swim was wondering if swiy knows why dopamine agonists and dopamine reuptake inhibitors are not used in treatment for methamphetamine withdrawal. Like L-Dopa which is converted into dopamine in the brain. Just curious as swim cannot find any research of this sort of thing being tried with methamphetamine addicts.
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Old 19-02-2007, 00:42
Forthesevenlakes Forthesevenlakes is offline
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

L-Dopa as a possible treatment for methamphetamine is an interesting concept, and one SWIM hadn't actually thought of before. Intuitively it would seem to help with some of the withdrawal symptoms, but then the L-Dopa would probably have to be tapered off as well. If SWIM has time he's going to look into this on Pubmed to see if anyone has attempted this before, but he wouldnt reccomend someone try it without a doctors supervision.
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Old 19-02-2007, 16:18
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

A person’s sense of well-being is due to the action of key neurotransmitters working in a cascade fashion in the brain. The final site of action of these neurotransmitters is in the limbic system located near the center of the brain. The most important transmitters are serotonin (our natural antidepressant), enkephalins (along with endorphins, our natural pain killers), GABA (our natural sedative) and dopamine (along with norepinephrine, our natural stimulant) working in concert to bring about a feeling of well-being and stress reduction. Certainly we know the importance of increasing well-being and reducing stress in preventing relapse.

The nucleus accumbens, the “reward site,” in the brain is the master of simple but powerful drives. When all of the neurotransmitters, working in harmony and in conjunction with one another, stimulate the production, transportation, and reception of dopamine at the “reward site,” a person is calm, at ease and satisfied. This process of the neurotransmitters working in harmony and in conjunction with one another has been termed the “Brain Reward Cascade.” In the hypothalamus, serotonin stimulates the enkephalins, which in turn inhibits GABA in the substania nigra, which in turn fine tunes dopamine in the ventral tegmental area causing the release of dopamine at the nucleus accumbens.

So you target serotonin levels in order to prevent/correct dopamine depletion, for example high levels of serotonin, which occur when you take Ecstasy, make you feel happy, euphoric. When serotonin and noradrenaline are released from nerve cells in the brain they act to "lighten mood". When they are reabsorbed into the nerve cells, they no longer have an effect on mood. It is thought that when depression occurs, there may be a decreased amount of serotonin and noradrenaline released from nerve cells in the brain.

Cymbalta works by preventing serotonin, noradrenaline, and dopamine, from being reabsorbed back into the nerve cells in the brain, specifically on the 5-HT and NE and D2 receptors respectively. This helps prolong the "mood lightening" effect of any released serotonin and noradrenaline.

Hmm, L-Dopa might be useful in the short term; however L-dopa is addictive, and there are many case reports of patients with IPD who seek to increase their L-dopa dose to high levels because of psychological dependence rather than therapeutic benefit. This would be common with meth addicts. However, swim will look more into this as a short-term solution at beginning of the treatment. It might be helpful in curbing cravings.

Why aren't dopamine agonists and dopamine reuptake inhibitors being used to treat meth addiction is that scientist, in 30 years, have not found a drug better than L-Dopa for dopamine. A few dopamine agonists and reuptake inhibitors are in the pipeline, however, most of the drugs discovered that work on increasing the production of dopamine were addictive so one is replacing one addiction with another addiction. This defeats the objective of one becoming free from addiction.

Of course, you must talk to a doctor, one who is open for dual diagnosis before trying this regiment. For example, she will inform you that atarax can only be taken for 4 months and then must be stopped. She will also explain the possible side effects of the drugs and also help with the withdrawal symptoms from these medications such as cymbalta.

Anyway, the cocktail is used primarily to minimize the cravings. Swim is not saying you won't experience withdrawal symptoms, you will, there is no silver bullet, one can actually feel these cravings slip into her body, inside you, like a demon, or like being possessed, but then the spell is broken and the craving passes. Swim is not a doctor, not in the health industry and swim is the only one that has tried this regiment. Maybe all those years that swim went to NA and then this cocktail has helped swim remain meth free for a few months. Its hard, real hard, a lot of triggers, just be aware of them. If you fail, don't give up, keep trying, you'll get a lot of experience fighting off the cravings, what works what doesn't work. Hopefully this experience and the chemical cocktail will help you win your long term battle.

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good explanation and description
Very informative and factual.

Last edited by renegades; 20-02-2007 at 04:53. Reason: edit
  #16  
Old 19-02-2007, 20:32
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

Quote:
Originally Posted by renegades View Post
Why aren't dopamine agonists and dopamine reuptake inhibitors being used to treat meth addiction is that scientist, in 30 years, have not found a drug better than L-Dopa for dopamine. A few dopamine agonists and reuptake inhibitors are in the pipeline, however, most of the drugs discovered that work on increasing the production of dopamine were addictive so one is replacing one addiction with another addiction. This defeats the objective of one becoming free from addiction.
People seem far too concerned with addicts replacing one addiction with another. For someone who has been taking a drug for years and now wants to quit the best thing might be for them to switch to taking something that is less rewarding(Wouldn't think most of them would make you feel as good as Meth does) and new. Kicking the new addiction and being substance free seems like it would be a lot easier than having to have gone it alone in the first place.
  #17  
Old 23-02-2007, 14:50
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

Yes again swim am not a doctor. All swim did was to look at the withdrawl symptons to offer medication that will help alleviate some of the discomfort and it also via Gabatin takes away the cravings. One thing swim would change is to bump up the modafinil to 400mg morning. The change is because swims would take 200mg it in the morning and a couple of times fell right back to sleep for a few hours. Still checking about L-Dopa as to whether or not it is effective in alleviating some of the withdrawl symptons. Won't know results on that for at least a month. You no longer need in the states a precription for L-Dopa. But it is hard to find. There is a generic modafinil called modalert available about 1/3 the price of the regular modafinil. However you need to purchase it from the Far East or India. Swim guesses you could take bzp instead of modalert but not recommended modalert seems to be much cleaner, no body load and doesn't make you jittery.
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Old 06-04-2007, 01:23
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

Renegades, thanks for the advice i passed on. My friend ended up going cold-turkey on their tod, and to be honest did about 7days straight (more than they'd tried or done before), and gather the fear was worse than reality. Use has gone down to more of a weekly thing, but my friend has felt they had to use occasionally just to keep sanity from the chaos their life is in, and has been since last post.

My friend is not as concerned about their use anymore, and will continue as is, until health professionals actually help rather than cause destruction.
  #19  
Old 06-04-2007, 05:25
~lostgurl~ ~lostgurl~ is offline
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Re: Freaky

Good luck Freaky, occasional use for an addict is extremely difficult, it can be done but it takes a lot of willpower and self discipline to keep from sliding back into old habits. Stay focused and if swiy notices any warning signs that swiy's use is heading back towards addiction act immediately and do what ever is needed to keep you safe. I hope it all works out for you.
  #20  
Old 06-04-2007, 08:06
Nicaine Nicaine is offline
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

Speaking of which, how have you (or SWIY) been doing lately, lostgurl? Well, I hope...

SWIM is good, too much kratom lately though and it's been extremely un-fun when he inadvertently runs out. Otherwise pretty much OK, although he still can't leave the stims alone completely. No "addictive" stim use tho, which has been nice.
  #21  
Old 06-04-2007, 12:12
~lostgurl~ ~lostgurl~ is offline
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

Great to hear Nicaine! Your posts are sounding really positive and that is awesome, I'm really happy for you! Sounds a bit like the stims are more hassle then they are worth for SWIY at the moment, which could be a blessing in disguise.... Change can be a good thing as SWIM has just found out..... kinda wondering why SWIM delayed making all these changes for so long, but well addiction had SWIM well and truly lost. I guess there is a reason for everything.... SWIY is way too smart to let addiction trap SWIY forever, SWIY has so much potential (damn I usually hate that word lol) but honestly SWIY is highly intelligent and I can just imagine SWIY accomplishing so much if all that energy and motivation that SWIY currently puts towards drug use can be be redirected into something more fullfilling.
  #22  
Old 07-04-2007, 00:10
Freaky Freaky is offline
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for meth addicts

Lostgurl you've come such a long way, i'm really pleased it's working for you.

Good Point about occasional use creeping up, swim noticed that already, but everything got SOOoo critical for SWIM, it was a case of knowing that taking stims would keep swim alive, Health Service re-awaked childhood trauma (Flashbacks, voices) for no apparent reason, then left swim to it, after swim went to them with no-where else to turn about current probs. It's took 21/2 months of complete desperation, isolation then shutting-down, swim saw no point in talking as no-one listened or cared for them to Now ask what i want/need. Swim had no trust left, or will so at breaking point called PALS who confirmed all procedures had been completely ignored (felt worthless before!), swim had no plan, designated worker, benefit advice, even though swim'd been asking for weeks about self help groups, only got given a web-site to go on, oh and completely differing Diagnosis (.

Recently meds that swim sleep 14hrs through, without any co-ordination or ability to even go to the shop...Swim knows that without stims they would have been temped to drink, and for swim that spells sure doom.

Sorry for the rant, and thanks for the support.

Post Quality Evaluations:
love the honesty, people on this board really appreciate the truth... nice work!
  #23  
Old 18-10-2009, 10:57
JonCoyote JonCoyote is offline
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for methamphetamine addicts

Quote:
Originally Posted by renegades View Post
Swim would recommend you go to NA meetings. The people there all have been in your shoes before and can help by giving swim a support system - people who she can call 24 hours a day for advice. Plus they probably can give you leads on open-minded doctors who will prescribe the medication to you, however it is a lot less expensive getting it from India. Copy and print out the post to show the doctor why you need the medication and be honest.

Oh, Some at NA are anti-drugs (all drugs, except cigs), but many are not and are on medication from their doctors. That is what swim would do if she/he was you. Go today, look up Narcotics Anonymous, go to the meeting talk to other addicts and ask them for a doctor who believes in "dual diagnosis." In other words a Doctors who believes that one can treat addiction with other drugs. These recovering addicts will help you find a doctor that will prescribe you the medicine.

Tell swim who is making this world a better place?

The DEA whose laws and policies jail otherwise law abiding citizens. If caught with 5 grams of meth, the swim gets to withdrawl without any medication in a 8x10 locked cell for 5 years. If the DEA pops a dealer, the quantity of the drug decreases thus increasing the price. This results in users committing more burglaries to feed their habit. In otherwords, crime goes up in the community.

Renegades offers a different solution. The addict with the chemical cocktail can withdrawl from the chemical easily and continue her day activites. She stops using immediately when she begins on the cocktail. Thus she stops using and buying and stealing, the quantity of the drug goes up, prices come down, thus there is less crime such as break-ins to feed the other addicts. Imagine if a large majority of meth addicts were able to quit what would happen to the crime rate such as break-ins? It would go way down because the price will drop (law of supply and demand).

Now tell me which plan - the DEA Plan or Renegades Chemical Cocktail is the more humane, compassionate, effective way to handle the meth crises?

A big f*ck you goes out to the DEA for their treatment of addicts as criminals and not individuals with mental disorders and chemical imbalances.

Oh, and a big f*ck you goes out to the politicans making these laws.

Addiction is a medical problem and a disease. You don't throw a patient with depression in jail, why someone with a mental disorder? She probably uses drugs to help her depression. It makes her feel better, works better than prozac. Until these cronies come to realize this, we live in an uncivilized world who lock up their own sons and daughters for years in jail for drug use.

Like the Jews in Germany during WWII, drug users here in the USA are also persecuted with the same enthusiasim. Instead of going to a gas chamber, they are thrown in Jail (concentration camps). Watch COPs and see how much law enforcement enjoys busting people with a $5 rock. They treat it like it is a sport, us vs them. When will the USA become civilized in the way they treat a segment of our population?

Now with the democrats in control of congress, it is going to get worse. They believe in big government and a lot of laws regulating how we live. It was them who wrote the first drug laws, ban marijuana, and started the mandatory sentencing laws.
I hear ya on the DEA opinion, but not so much on the disease part, think about it as if you were a cancer patient, how would you feel if you heard a tweeker complaining about how ""itsadiseaseman ya ya ya" cancer is a disease addiction is not. it may be somewhat predetermined but not genetically, we chose to use, to blame anything else is sitting on a "pity pot", we should be focusing on the big choice all addicts have, the question goes "Am I going to live with it? die from it? or quit?"
  #24  
Old 20-02-2010, 16:31
songoflife7 songoflife7 is offline
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for methamphetamine addicts

Interesting (SWIM will keep this in mind for future reference).

SWIM tried to recover from heavy amphetamine and otc stimulants addiction several times, using prescription meds as part of the treatment (and failed every single time). On the first attempt, he was prescribed a cocktail consisting of Klonopin 1.5mg once or twice daily but only as needed, Topamax 50mg twice daily, Wellbutrin 300mg once daily, for 3 months and had no improvement. The second time, Topamax 200mg twice daily, Wellbutrin 350mg once daily, Seroquel 25mg x4 daily, Remeron 15mg once daily, for 4 months and had no improvement. The third time, 100mg Topamax twice daily, 300mg Wellbutrin daily, 100mg Seroquel twice daily, for 3 months and had no improvement.

The purpose of the meds used:
-Topamax: cravings, anxiety
-Wellbutrin: withdrawal symptoms (depression, fatigue, lethargy)
-Klonopin: anxiety, panic attacks
-Seroquel: anxiety, sleep
-Remeron: anxiety, sleep

SWIM managed to stay clean for 2 months the first time, 3 months the second time, and 3 months the third and most recent time. The cravings never went away, not once. Topamax is commonly used off-label for alcohol and/or cocaine addiction, but it did nothing for SWIM's amphetamine cravings. The withdrawal was a nightmare, which Wellbutrin was not potent enough to help (partially because of the Topamax side effects). Seroquel and Remeron caused anxiety when not feeling anxious because SWIM is very sensitive to sedatives, has no desire to sleep, hates boredom and sedation more than anything. Klonopin helped only if taken right at "the calm before the storm."

SWIM's amphetamine addiction ruined his life, yet, he cannot function without it anymore.
  #25  
Old 20-02-2010, 17:20
xenos xenos is offline
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Re: Renegades Chemical Cocktail Cure for methamphetamine addicts

@johcoyote: words are words, everyone is still going to see them differerntly and most likely not in a binary of addiction or disease, moreso a gradient. so if you say its addiction, its not going to change that many minds, its only stating your opinion. what really matters is which stance to adopt in order to curb an addiction/disease, and this depends on the person and the situation n alllllll that jazz

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